Going back

Abrahamic religion, you know, the one with the cross...

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Re: Going back

#41  Postby Fallible » May 20, 2018 10:08 am

You're mixing up a whole lot of different types of Christianity. In particular, you seem to be talking about Christians as though they were all Catholics. Anyone can call themselves a Christian. Only Catholics have excommunication.
Sorry that you think you had it rough in the first world.
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Re: Going back

#42  Postby aliihsanasl » May 20, 2018 10:16 am

Shagz wrote:My impression is that Turkey is the most moderate Islamic country. Is that impression correct?

If so, don't you think that your impression of Islam will differ from someone from, say, Iran?


The picture is like that it looks like the most moderate Islamic country but does it really like that or with some laws and with the force of the army country pushed to appear like that to international community. Its my 38th year here I still dont have a clear view of it but even the sociologists cant define it.

One things is clear Istanbul was the city whole Islam world proud of having it, it was the home of the Islamic caliphate and in one day caliphate kicked out of country and what was left was a secular country.

Conservative Muslims all the time say that "Jews established 2 states in the 20th century and Israel is the second one."

Giving Iran as an example is a strange coincidence cause Turks learned Islam from Iranians and somehow in the history decided to change sect and passed from Shia to Sunni. But I understand what you say and I can say of course its normal to have different practices but there are fundamental pillars of a religion that wont change.

There is no clergy group in Islam everyone is equally close and equally distant from the same God. Even during the Friday prayer when a Muslims hears something that he doesnt approve he can criticize and leave the Friday talk. Just a few weeks ago when an imam's speech began to cover politics half of the mosque group left there and protested imam.
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Re: Going back

#43  Postby aliihsanasl » May 20, 2018 10:18 am

Fallible wrote:You're mixing up a whole lot of different types of Christianity. In particular, you seem to be talking about Christians as though they were all Catholics. Anyone can call themselves a Christian. Only Catholics have excommunication.


According to a popular website called experttv (in Turkish) both Orthodox and Armenian churchs have it too.
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Re: Going back

#44  Postby Evolving » May 20, 2018 10:21 am

I think it's an interesting fact that some Muslims in the West have assimilated as far as introducing social activities in their mosques. I wasn't aware that this was a difference between Muslims and Christians.
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Re: Going back

#45  Postby Fallible » May 20, 2018 10:22 am

aliihsanasl wrote:
Fallible wrote:You're mixing up a whole lot of different types of Christianity. In particular, you seem to be talking about Christians as though they were all Catholics. Anyone can call themselves a Christian. Only Catholics have excommunication.


According to a popular website called experttv (in Turkish) both Orthodox and Armenian churchs have it too.


Those are both types of Catholicism.
Sorry that you think you had it rough in the first world.
You ought to get out a map sooner than later.
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Get out of your head and spend less time alone.
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Re: Going back

#46  Postby Scot Dutchy » May 20, 2018 10:32 am

Mosques are struggling to stay open. The biggest one in this country is run by volunteers. The Rotterdam City Council (the mayor is a muslim) is stopping any subsidies it gets.
Myths in islam Women and islam Musilm opinion polls


"Religion is excellent stuff for keeping common people quiet.” — Napoleon Bonaparte
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Re: Going back

#47  Postby Thomas Eshuis » May 20, 2018 11:58 am

aliihsanasl wrote:
Thomas Eshuis wrote:
aliihsanasl wrote:We have members from Pakistan, they can inform us about the groups visiting frequency of mosques for daily prayers and other times.

And btw just to mention that Turkey doesnt represent whole Islamic world I said "thats the practice in Turkey".

But when I said mainstream Islam doesnt necessarily call for all prayers to mosque thats known by all Muslims.

But that's not what you said, or at least not what I responded to. I responded to your claim that Islam doesn't know mosque communities like Christian churches do.


I still defend that and the reason I do that I believe there are huge differences between the role of a church/priest and mosque/imam.

An argument which is based on your own personal, limited personal experience.
But let's end this derail.
"Respect for personal beliefs = "I am going to tell you all what I think of YOU, but don't dare retort and tell what you think of ME because...it's my personal belief". Hmm. A bully's charter and no mistake."
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Re: Going back

#48  Postby Thomas Eshuis » May 20, 2018 12:00 pm

Evolving wrote:I think it's an interesting fact that some Muslims in the West have assimilated as far as introducing social activities in their mosques. I wasn't aware that this was a difference between Muslims and Christians.

I'm still not aware of this as Ali hasn't presented any evidence for it.
"Respect for personal beliefs = "I am going to tell you all what I think of YOU, but don't dare retort and tell what you think of ME because...it's my personal belief". Hmm. A bully's charter and no mistake."
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Re: Going back

#49  Postby Skinny Puppy » May 20, 2018 12:14 pm

zulumoose wrote:Remember that guy that wanted to be reconnected to the matrix? He at least asked to have his memory wiped, so that he wouldn't know it wasn't real. How will you fare when you know?

Is the steak really so juicy that it doesn't matter to you?

Image


I'm not familiar with the matrix reference.

As far as the steak goes... right now I'm betwixt and between. :scratch:

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Re: Going back

#50  Postby Skinny Puppy » May 20, 2018 12:25 pm

scott1328 wrote:I guess the being on the Trump Band wagon wasn't enough for you. When shall look for the "I was once an atheist" testimonial?


At the same time that I'll be looking for the "I once believed all of the fake news about Trump" testimonial.

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Re: Going back

#51  Postby Skinny Puppy » May 20, 2018 12:38 pm

Fallible wrote:Back to the OP - if it helps you chill the fuck out, I'm all for it.


When one pushes buttons... expect a reaction.
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Re: Going back

#52  Postby Rachel Bronwyn » May 20, 2018 12:53 pm

People aren't buttons. Most of them have self-control.
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Re: Going back

#53  Postby Cito di Pense » May 20, 2018 1:15 pm

Skinny Puppy wrote:
Fallible wrote:Back to the OP - if it helps you chill the fuck out, I'm all for it.


When one pushes buttons... expect a reaction.


It's not surprising, true, but this only gives one to wonder what the point of church is. I don't think you really made that clear in your OP by declaring that you thought it was a mistake to reject what you learned growing up. I'm not suggesting that the point of church is for you to transcend those buttons you think other people are pushing. If going back to church is just a regression to childish relation to habit, then so be it. It's the going back that isn't forthrightly addressed, although I'm perfectly willing to regard church attendance as a tap that one turns off and on again. To be clear, it's other people who are telling you it's a mistake to reject what you learned growing up. In that case it wasn't really worth the thread to make the big announcement. I'm with those who say you're welcome to whatever floats your boat. Paddle it quietly, please, so you don't splash the other bathers.
Хлопнут без некролога. -- Серге́й Па́влович Королёв

Translation by Elbert Hubbard: Do not take life too seriously. You're not going to get out of it alive.
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Re: Going back

#54  Postby Fallible » May 20, 2018 2:13 pm

Skinny Puppy wrote:
Fallible wrote:Back to the OP - if it helps you chill the fuck out, I'm all for it.


When one pushes buttons... expect a reaction.


Even if that were an excuse, you don't need your buttons pushed in order to kick off. This has been seen a few times. I hope the liberal application of comfortable lies helps to ameliorate this issue.
Sorry that you think you had it rough in the first world.
You ought to get out a map sooner than later.
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Get out of your head and spend less time alone.
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Re: Going back

#55  Postby Alan B » May 20, 2018 2:25 pm

When I go there on the 27th, it will be like going home again. The people, whom I've never met before, will be like family. There's a bond between us, which is very, very hard to explain, that will flow or permeate amongst us where I will be like the 'prodigal son' and welcomed with open arms. Yes, one could join a club but it's not the same.

Ah, yes. And if you announce yourself as an atheist and they say that you are still welcome, be wary of their motives. Be very wary.
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Re: Going back

#56  Postby Thomas Eshuis » May 20, 2018 2:35 pm

Rachel Bronwyn wrote:People aren't buttons. Most of them have self-control.

And either way, they're responsible for their own behaviour.
"Respect for personal beliefs = "I am going to tell you all what I think of YOU, but don't dare retort and tell what you think of ME because...it's my personal belief". Hmm. A bully's charter and no mistake."
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Re: Going back

#57  Postby Animavore » May 20, 2018 3:08 pm

I find enough human connection in the pub to do me.
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Re: Going back

#58  Postby Rachel Bronwyn » May 20, 2018 4:11 pm

Right?

I get that church offers some people a sense of community but I get that outside of religion. It surprises me everyone doesn't.
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Re: Going back

#59  Postby aliihsanasl » May 20, 2018 4:21 pm

Rachel Bronwyn wrote:Right?

I get that church offers some people a sense of community but I get that outside of religion. It surprises me everyone doesn't.


I always felt externalized by the society for not attending Friday prayers, not fasting or even nasty Islamic sayings. For example think that you fall and broke your arm first person come up saying "Allah protected you from the worse just your arm broke" ffs I'm right away losing my temper.

But Im happy to seee that its changing and AKP served it a lot, while trying to create a religious generation it end up totally opposite :cheers:
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Re: Going back

#60  Postby Seabass » May 20, 2018 6:21 pm

Thank god I married an atheist.
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