The 'Childishness' Of The Bible

Abrahamic religion, you know, the one with the cross...

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Re: The 'Childishness' Of The Bible

#261  Postby lyingcheat » Dec 12, 2013 2:18 pm

willhud9 wrote:
....an omnipotent thing can do anything including changing the unchangable.


And...

willhud9 wrote:
You can protest all you want about the logic of it or how it is the definition, but since God can do anything and "anything" includes by definition "The ability to change the absolute while retaining its absolutism."


This ^^^ illustrates perfectly the senseless vacuity of 'theological reasoning'. The god thing can say up is down and it... just is (woo woooooo). And despite that being a contradiction and an obvious error, the god thing remains an 'infallible source of unchanging absolute truth'. Not horseshit at all.
Not witless gibberish.

How do religious types get sucked in by this idiocy? It's like the linguistic version of 3-Card Monte.
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Re: The 'Childishness' Of The Bible

#262  Postby tolman » Dec 12, 2013 3:30 pm

In terms of morality, even leaving aside 'absolute' being apparently suggested to mean 'whatever [deity] feels like at the moment', what would 'absolute' mean anyway?

Most things people would point to as absolute moral principles are, like any other 'principle', effectively generalisations of human mixed-emotional-rational conclusions which, being generalisations from such sources, typically have exceptions or at least cases where people honestly disagree.
Violence up to and including killing, imprisoning people and taking their property against their will are all permissible in some circumstances.

Which absolute rules have no morally defensible exceptions, and if there are exceptions, how can a rule be called absolute?
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Re: The 'Childishness' Of The Bible

#263  Postby Thomas Eshuis » Dec 12, 2013 3:37 pm

I don't believe in absolute morality, you'd have to ask someone who does.
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Re: The 'Childishness' Of The Bible

#264  Postby willhud9 » Dec 12, 2013 6:49 pm

redwhine wrote:
redwhine wrote:
willhud9 wrote:If God can do anything than he can move an immovable object and retain the objects immovability. End of.

Name an immovable object that god can move, please.

Having trouble thinking of one, willhud9?

I'll make it easier for you by leaving god out of it. Name any immovable object, please.


You do realize my statement was philosophical right? :scratch:
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Re: The 'Childishness' Of The Bible

#265  Postby Onyx8 » Dec 12, 2013 11:06 pm

When called on ones bullshit just claim you were talking philosophy.

Some philosophers might object to that strategy.
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Re: The 'Childishness' Of The Bible

#266  Postby redwhine » Dec 12, 2013 11:38 pm

willhud9 wrote:
redwhine wrote:
redwhine wrote:
willhud9 wrote:If God can do anything than he can move an immovable object and retain the objects immovability. End of.

Name an immovable object that god can move, please.

Having trouble thinking of one, willhud9?

I'll make it easier for you by leaving god out of it. Name any immovable object, please.


You do realize my statement was philosophical right? :scratch:

So you cannot name anything that is immovable, right?

If so, you must agree that god cannot move an immovable object and retain the object's immovability, right?

Can god cause a moving object to become stationary?
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Re: The 'Childishness' Of The Bible

#267  Postby willhud9 » Dec 13, 2013 12:02 am

Onyx8 wrote:When called on ones bullshit just claim you were talking philosophy.

Some philosophers might object to that strategy.


What are you talking about?

You have heard of the question can an unstoppable force move an immovable object? That is a standard paradox question right there.

Well if God was real and was posed with an immovable object that he could move that object and it'd still be immovable because God can do the impossible including defy definitions.

So no it is not bullshit no matter how desperate you or Redwhine wish it to be. :coffee:
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Re: The 'Childishness' Of The Bible

#268  Postby willhud9 » Dec 13, 2013 12:06 am

redwhine wrote:
willhud9 wrote:
redwhine wrote:
redwhine wrote:
Name an immovable object that god can move, please.

Having trouble thinking of one, willhud9?

I'll make it easier for you by leaving god out of it. Name any immovable object, please.


You do realize my statement was philosophical right? :scratch:

So you cannot name anything that is immovable, right?

If so, you must agree that god cannot move an immovable object and retain the object's immovability, right?

Can god cause a moving object to become stationary?


You really are reaching aren't you.

First of all, it was used as an example. I never once made the claim that there is such a thing as an immovable object. So your request that I name such an item was pointless and stupid.

Second of all, it was in regards to the popular question which I told Onyx above. The fact that you missed that or ignored it is telling of your position.

Lastly, LOGICALLY-

If God can do anything, and is omnipotent, and can even do the impossible and if changing an absolute thing while retaining its absolutism is impossible; then God can change an absolute thing while retaining it's absolutism.

Simple if-then statement logic.

How is that so bloody hard to understand? Unless you simply don't want to admit that in this regards you are flat out wrong.
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Re: The 'Childishness' Of The Bible

#269  Postby Onyx8 » Dec 13, 2013 12:29 am

it's not that it is hard to understand, it is that it is bollocks. Easy-to-understand bollocks.

If God can do anything then he can be the type of being who can't do everything and still be capable of doing anything. Fuuuuuck.
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Re: The 'Childishness' Of The Bible

#270  Postby willhud9 » Dec 13, 2013 12:35 am

Onyx8 wrote:it's not that it is hard to understand, it is that it is bollocks. Easy-to-understand bollocks.

If God can do anything then he can be the type of being who can't do everything and still be capable of doing anything. Fuuuuuck.


Yeah its bollocks. Only because the concept of God is bollocks.

But IF God was real, and IF he was real in the way Christians present him than he COULD do the above. That was all. So trying to say God cannot change an absolute because that goes against the definition of absolute is self defeating because God can do anything.
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Re: The 'Childishness' Of The Bible

#271  Postby Greyman » Dec 13, 2013 1:37 am

willhud9 wrote:Lastly, LOGICALLY-

If God can do anything, and is omnipotent, and can even do the impossible and if changing an absolute thing while retaining its absolutism is impossible; then God can change an absolute thing while retaining it's absolutism.

Simple if-then statement logic.

How is that so bloody hard to understand? Unless you simply don't want to admit that in this regards you are flat out wrong.
Nah. It is nonsense, that is what it is. Totally "You've fallen down the rabbit hole and smoked the caterpillar's hookah" level of nonsense.

This isn't about mere mortals being unable to comprehend the paradoxical majesty of the almighty. This is about words having definitions. If you cannot mean what you say, you cannot say what you mean. That's logic.

Something cannot do absolutely anything including things which absolutely cannot be done. Two mutually contradicting absolute statements cannot both be valid. At least one must be false.

Even theomagicians retreated from that position early on and came up with the "god can do anything except the logically impossible" definition of omnipotence. However, if there's an exception its not an absolute, and some just couldn't accept a less-than-absolute omnigod so stuck their heads deep into the "god's beyond logic, neener, neener!" rabbit-hole.

But, to paraphrase, that which is wibbled to be without logic can be dismissed as illogical nonsense.
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Re: The 'Childishness' Of The Bible

#272  Postby Onyx8 » Dec 13, 2013 1:39 am

Indeed. All that is really being said is: "If the impossible is possible then the impossible is possible." Well, duh.
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Re: The 'Childishness' Of The Bible

#273  Postby ElDiablo » Dec 13, 2013 2:57 am

Everything is everywhere man, but Dave's not here.

God is silly putty.
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Re: The 'Childishness' Of The Bible

#274  Postby redwhine » Dec 13, 2013 3:31 am

willhud9 wrote:If God can do anything than he can move an immovable object and retain the objects immovability. End of.


willhud9 wrote:
redwhine wrote:
willhud9 wrote:
redwhine wrote:
Having trouble thinking of one, willhud9?

I'll make it easier for you by leaving god out of it. Name any immovable object, please.


You do realize my statement was philosophical right? :scratch:

So you cannot name anything that is immovable, right?

If so, you must agree that god cannot move an immovable object and retain the object's immovability, right?

Can god cause a moving object to become stationary?


You really are reaching aren't you.

First of all, it was used as an example. I never once made the claim that there is such a thing as an immovable object.

Make your fucking mind up. If there is no such thing as an immovable object, how can god move one?

willhud9 wrote:So your request that I name such an item was pointless and stupid.

You were the one that brought up the subject of immovable objects. I merely called you out on your bullshit. Any pointlessness and stupidity was all your own. Had you been able to come up with an example, there would have been plenty of point in my response.

willhud9 wrote:Second of all, it was in regards to the popular question which I told Onyx above.

Irrelevant.

willhud9 wrote:The fact that you missed that or ignored it is telling of your position.

The fact that you cannot even name one example of an immovable object is telling of your position.

willhud9 wrote:
Lastly, LOGICALLY-

If God can do anything, and is omnipotent, and can even do the impossible and if changing an absolute thing while retaining its absolutism is impossible; then God can change an absolute thing while retaining it's absolutism.

LOGICALLY-

If a thing can be changed, then it never was absolute in the first place.

willhud9 wrote:Simple if-then statement logic.

Simple being the operative word, as in "anybody swallowing your crap would have to be simple".

willhud9 wrote:How is that so bloody hard to understand?

Oh I understand it all right. No problem. I understand that it is plain wrong.

willhud9 wrote:Unless you simply don't want to admit that in this regards you are flat out wrong.

Coming from the guy that doesn't believe in god, but that god can move immovable objects, but there's no such thing as an immovable object. :crazy:
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Re: The 'Childishness' Of The Bible

#275  Postby willhud9 » Dec 13, 2013 4:31 am

redwhine wrote:
willhud9 wrote:If God can do anything than he can move an immovable object and retain the objects immovability. End of.


willhud9 wrote:
redwhine wrote:
willhud9 wrote:

You do realize my statement was philosophical right? :scratch:

So you cannot name anything that is immovable, right?

If so, you must agree that god cannot move an immovable object and retain the object's immovability, right?

Can god cause a moving object to become stationary?


You really are reaching aren't you.

First of all, it was used as an example. I never once made the claim that there is such a thing as an immovable object.

Make your fucking mind up. If there is no such thing as an immovable object, how can god move one?


Where in the above statement you enlarged needlessly as if it somehow made your point did I make the claim there was an immovable object. It was simply an IF concept.

willhud9 wrote:So your request that I name such an item was pointless and stupid.

You were the one that brought up the subject of immovable objects. I merely called you out on your bullshit. Any pointlessness and stupidity was all your own. Had you been able to come up with an example, there would have been plenty of point in my response.


No it was not bullshit. It was an example. Which you utterly failed to understand. The pointlessness and stupidity came from your failure to understand the example.

willhud9 wrote:Second of all, it was in regards to the popular question which I told Onyx above.

Irrelevant.

willhud9 wrote:The fact that you missed that or ignored it is telling of your position.

The fact that you cannot even name one example of an immovable object is telling of your position.


Oh look more idiotic ramblings showing that you once again have failed to understand the fucking point. Do go on. :coffee:

willhud9 wrote:
Lastly, LOGICALLY-

If God can do anything, and is omnipotent, and can even do the impossible and if changing an absolute thing while retaining its absolutism is impossible; then God can change an absolute thing while retaining it's absolutism.

LOGICALLY-

If a thing can be changed, then it never was absolute in the first place.


Which is why it is called a paradox. Look it up sometime.

willhud9 wrote:Simple if-then statement logic.

Simple being the operative word, as in "anybody swallowing your crap would have to be simple".


Translation: The logic of the if-then statement was indeed sound. But I am going to make this cuntish remark instead of actually addressing the presented statement. :coffee:

willhud9 wrote:How is that so bloody hard to understand?

Oh I understand it all right. No problem. I understand that it is plain wrong.


The man who doth says something is wrong without any rational defending why he thinks something is wrong presents a foolish statement indeed.

willhud9 wrote:Unless you simply don't want to admit that in this regards you are flat out wrong.

Coming from the guy that doesn't believe in god, but that god can move immovable objects, but there's no such thing as an immovable object. :crazy:


Yep, you sure missed the fucking point. Go back and read the thread within its context and maybe, just maybe you will understand instead of you just making assertive nonsense about what I am claiming.
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Re: The 'Childishness' Of The Bible

#276  Postby Thomas Eshuis » Dec 13, 2013 8:53 am

This is beginning to be slightly off-topic.
"Respect for personal beliefs = "I am going to tell you all what I think of YOU, but don't dare retort and tell what you think of ME because...it's my personal belief". Hmm. A bully's charter and no mistake."
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Re: The 'Childishness' Of The Bible

#277  Postby Agrippina » Dec 13, 2013 9:00 am

The Bible is still childish, like a book of fairytales is childish.
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Re: The 'Childishness' Of The Bible

#278  Postby willhud9 » Dec 13, 2013 1:21 pm

Agrippina wrote:The Bible is still childish, like a book of fairytales is childish.


I beg to differ. Hans Christian Anderson, and Brothers Grimm have entertained me for many years, but always in abridged forms as a child. It wasn't til my teenage years that I was introduced to the bloody and oftentimes frightening conclusions to many a character in the fairytale.
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Re: The 'Childishness' Of The Bible

#279  Postby redwhine » Dec 13, 2013 1:45 pm

Thomas Eshuis wrote:This is beginning to be slightly off-topic.

Not really. there's plenty of childishness on display from willhud9...

"I'm right! I'm right! ...and I'll scweam and scweam until you say I am, too!" :snooty:

I'm only sorry he couldn't come up with something he thought was immovable. :( I wanted to post one of my favourite Monty Python clips.


Dammit! I'll do it anyhow...



Everything in the universe is moving, so, by definition, nothing is immovable. Simples! :P :P
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Re: The 'Childishness' Of The Bible

#280  Postby willhud9 » Dec 13, 2013 1:49 pm

redwhine wrote:
Thomas Eshuis wrote:This is beginning to be slightly off-topic.

Not really. there's plenty of childishness on display from willhud9...

"I'm right! I'm right! ...and I'll scweam and scweam until you say I am, too!" :snooty:


Oh look more deflection. :roll: I have not done anything of the sort.
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