Ray Comfort: "Gravity doesn't exist in space."

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Re: Ray Comfort: "Gravity doesn't exist in space."

#41  Postby Oeditor » Jul 28, 2014 12:19 pm

I wonder if Comfort thought that gravity works from beyond the planets, holding them from behind to stop them falling into the sun? It's now dawned on him that that isn't the case, gravity doesn't work like a hook to hang the planets on.
It would appear to leave him believing, at last, in gravity roughly as it is - but he must now be thinking it's anti-gravity, pushing the planets outwards. The earth doesn't hang on a hook, is sits on a table er elephant no: turtles all the way down.
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Re: Ray Comfort: "Gravity doesn't exist in space."

#42  Postby Evolving » Jul 28, 2014 12:56 pm

It did occur to me that there is one moderately sensible way of regarding the Earth as "hanging" on something. If gravity were suddenly switched off, the Earth would continue in whatever lateral direction it happened to be going in at the time, like a child falling off a playground roundabout that is going too fast for it to hang on. What is stopping it doing that, is the centripetal force of the Sun's gravitational attraction. That is what the Earth is "hanging" on.

(This is, I’m pretty sure, what ihavenofingerprints was thinking of, here.)

Calling the Sun's gravitational field "nothing" does seem a bit rich, though.

EDIT: the link to ihavenofingerprints' post isn't working properly. I mean post no. 27, on page 2.
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Re: Ray Comfort: "Gravity doesn't exist in space."

#43  Postby Steve » Jul 28, 2014 1:54 pm

It wouldn't matter to Ray if gravity were switched off. The gravity of his lies would persist.
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Re: Ray Comfort: "Gravity doesn't exist in space."

#44  Postby LucidFlight » Jul 28, 2014 2:12 pm

Steve wrote:It wouldn't matter to Ray if gravity were switched off. The gravity of his lies would persist.


Ohh! Damn!

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Re: Ray Comfort: "Gravity doesn't exist in space."

#45  Postby mingthething » Jul 28, 2014 2:57 pm

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Someone should show this to Ray comfort.... I don't know if Einsteinian gravity theory has superseded this . Phycisists help? Any point in space can be expressed as a point between two objects of nonzero mass at a distance from each other. Therefore, there should always be gravity at any point you choose in the universe. Just because it's the weakest fundamental force doesn't mean it's a negligible force.
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Re: Ray Comfort: "Gravity doesn't exist in space."

#46  Postby Blackadder » Jul 28, 2014 3:16 pm

It's safe to say that Ray Comfort has not the first fucking clue about gravity. This can be added to the immense list of other things that Ray Comfort has not the first fucking clue about. Revelling in ignorance is not a virtue; taking pride in the fact that one's knowledge and intelligence barely exceeds that of a mollusc is not something to publicly celebrate, except in the roiling pit of stupidity and inanity that is the mind of Ray Comfort. What an utter, fucking weapon that man is.
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Re: Ray Comfort: "Gravity doesn't exist in space."

#47  Postby Weaver » Jul 28, 2014 3:18 pm

Evolving wrote:Just to address any misconception that may have arisen from mentioning orbits (and to give me a chance to pontificate on physics again...):

Free fall is, as Shrunk pointed out, a technical term meaning that gravity is the only force affecting you (all other forces are of negligible strength). Any object in space that is not being impelled by some thrusting thing like a rocket or an ion drive is in free fall in this sense; it doesn't matter which trajectory it is on.

If you are in a spacecraft that is in free fall, and you take that spacecraft as your frame of reference, then there is no preferred direction within that frame, as there is while standing on the ground: you can float equally readily in any direction you like within that frame of reference and it will seem to you as if you have no weight.

A spacecraft on the way to the Moon is in free fall, and so are the people inside it. Consequently, those people will experience what seems to be weightlessness.

It was my conjecture (and Comfort seems to bear this out in his second post, in which he reports on the corrections he has received) that it was seeing footage like this that misled him into thinking that there is no gravity in space.

This is likely correct - and the exact reason NASA no longer refers to something being "weightless" or in "zero gravity" but instead uses the term "microgravity" - because there is still a small gravitational attraction between the astronaut and the spacecraft.

Of course, knowing this would require Comfort to keep up with modern scientific understanding and terminology - and his understanding of science has apparently congealed at a level circa 2,500 years ago.
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Re: Ray Comfort: "Gravity doesn't exist in space."

#48  Postby Shrunk » Jul 28, 2014 3:25 pm

Here's good explanation of what is actually happening to the objects that Ray thought were languidly hanging motionless in space, free from gravity. (Spoiler: they're actually in free-fall at a speed of over 17 000 MPH.):

https://what-if.xkcd.com/58/
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Re: Ray Comfort: "Gravity doesn't exist in space."

#49  Postby Evolving » Jul 28, 2014 4:24 pm

That's a nice explanation, Shrunk.

Worth pointing out, perhaps, that the orbital speed there mentioned applies to low Earth orbit where most manmade satellites are. Obviously the transverse speed necessary to avoid being drawn back down decreases the further you get from Earth - until you start approaching some other large thing.
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Re: Ray Comfort: "Gravity doesn't exist in space."

#50  Postby laklak » Jul 28, 2014 4:37 pm

Blackadder wrote:It's safe to say that Ray Comfort has not the first fucking clue about gravity. This can be added to the immense list of other things that Ray Comfort has not the first fucking clue about. Revelling in ignorance is not a virtue; taking pride in the fact that one's knowledge and intelligence barely exceeds that of a mollusc is not something to publicly celebrate, except in the roiling pit of stupidity and inanity that is the mind of Ray Comfort. What an utter, fucking weapon that man is.


Though I agree, I must object to your blatant molluscism.
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Re: Ray Comfort: "Gravity doesn't exist in space."

#51  Postby Evolving » Jul 28, 2014 4:38 pm

Oh, molluscs. I thought you said bacon.
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Re: Ray Comfort: "Gravity doesn't exist in space."

#52  Postby laklak » Jul 28, 2014 4:41 pm

Baked oysters with bacon and leeks.

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Re: Ray Comfort: "Gravity doesn't exist in space."

#53  Postby Calilasseia » Jul 28, 2014 6:23 pm

On the subject of orbits, this paper is extremely interesting to read:

The Puzzling Mutual Orbit Of The Binary Trojan Asteroid (624) Hektor by F. Marchis, J. Durech, J. Castillo-Rogez, F. Vachier, M. Cuk, J. Berthier, M.H. Wong, P. Kalas, G. Duchene, M. A. van Dam, H. Hamanow and M. Viikinkoski, Astrophysical Letters, 783: L27 (2014) [Full paper downloadable from arXiv via above link]

Marchis et al, 2014 wrote:Abstract: Asteroids with satellites are natural laboratories to constrain the formation and evolution of our solar system. The binary Trojan asteroid (624) Hektor is the only known Trojan asteroid to possess a small satellite. Based on W.M. Keck adaptive optics observations, we found a unique and stable orbital solution, which is uncommon in comparison to the orbits of other large multiple asteroid systems studied so far. From lightcurve observations recorded since 1957, we showed that because the large Req=125-km primary may be made of two joint lobes, the moon could be ejecta of the low-velocity encounter, which formed the system. The inferred density of Hektor’s system is comparable to the L5 Trojan doublet (617) Patroclus but due to their difference in physical properties and in reflectance spectra, both captured Trojan asteroids could have a different composition and origin.


So we have two sets of asteroids, (617) Patroclus and (624) Hektor, which consist of pairs of small bodies in mutual orbits around a common barycentre.

Further on in the paper, we read this:

Marchis, 2014 wrote:1. INTRODUCTION

As of today ~200 asteroids are known to possess one or several satellites across all populations of small solar system bodies (Richardson and Walsh, 2006), from the near-earth asteroids (Pravec et al. 2006), to the asteroid main-belt (Marchis et al. 2008) and beyond (Noll et al. 2008). Their existence and the study of their mutual orbits lead to significant constraints on the
formation of our solar system through the determination of the mass, densities, mass ratio and long term evolution of the system. In the Jupiter Trojan population, (617) Patroclus is the only doublet asteroid systems, made of two comparable-sized components, which has been imaged and studied so far (Marchis et al. 2006b). We report in this work on the shape and interior of the L4 multiple Trojan (624) Hektor and on the analysis of the orbit of its moon based on our AO observations and additional datasets. We discuss the internal structure of the primary in comparison with the one of another binary Trojan asteroid (617) Patroclus.


That paper has some nice photos of (624) Hektor toward the end, indicating that it is indeed a binary system, with a small asteroid orbiting a larger one. Superimposed on each of the nine images is a less magnified image of the entire system. Note that the authors have been using light curve data obtained from the system, captured at regular intervals since 1957. So the authors have been using a data set that stretches all the way back to when Comfort was an 8 year old child. Plus, the authors state in the introduction, that around two hundred such asteroid systems with satellites are known.

Then we have this paper:

The Shape, Mutual Orbit And Tidal Evolution Of Binary Near-Earth Asteroid 2004 DC by P. A. Taylor, J. L. Margot, M. C. Nolan, L. A. M. Benner, S. J. Ostro, J. D. Giorgini and C. Magri, Conference paper from Asteroids, Comets, Meteors, held in Baltimore, Maryland, July 14th to 18th, 2008 [Full paper downloadable from here

Taylor et al, 2008 wrote:Introduction: Radar observations show near-Earth asteroid 2004 DC is a binary system with an eccentric mutual orbit, an asynchronously rotating secondary, and a primary having a shape reminiscent of 1999 KW4. The lack of a tidally circularized orbit and synchronized secondary may imply 2004 DC is a young or recently excited binary system.

Observations: Arecibo S-band (2380 MHz, 13 cm) and Goldstone X-band (8560 MHz, 3.5 cm) radar observations from June 2-6, 2006 showed that 2004 DC is a binary system with a size ratio of roughly 5:1 [1] and witnessed a mutual event where the secondary passed through the radar shadow of the primary. A combination of high resolution images, as fine as 7.5 m in range, and long observing windows provided by Arecibo and Goldstone allow us to produce a detailed shape model of the primary and determine the mutual orbit of the components about the system's center of mass.

Results: Preliminary shape modeling suggests a shape for the primary similar to 1999 KW4 [2] including a pronounced circular equatorial belt, sloped sides, and flattened poles. Such a shape could be indicative of a binary formation process that spins up the primary, redistributes regolith to the equator, and causes material to be shed into orbit about the primary.


Indeed, when searching for the citation for that second paper, Google Scholar informed me that there were three hundred and seventy five similar papers covering binary near-Earth asteroids alone.

But I suspect all of this knowledge is something that Comfort will simply treat as more apologetics fodder.
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Re: Ray Comfort: "Gravity doesn't exist in space."

#54  Postby Blackadder » Jul 28, 2014 6:35 pm

laklak wrote:Baked oysters with bacon and leeks.

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Even after being baked with bacon and leeks, I suspect the IQ of the oysters would rival that of Banana Ray Dumbfucker.
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Re: Ray Comfort: "Gravity doesn't exist in space."

#55  Postby KeenIdiot » Jul 28, 2014 6:36 pm

Evolving wrote:Doesn't "hanging", whether on something or on nothing, imply that the Earth is stationary?

I got in an argument with a literalist who stated "fixed and unmoving" is the same as orbits around the sun sun in a semi-stable orbit.
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Re: Ray Comfort: "Gravity doesn't exist in space."

#56  Postby Calilasseia » Jul 28, 2014 6:43 pm

Oh by the way, (617) Patroclus is actually the more interesting object. Even the Wikipedia page (view here) states that this system is composed of two bodies of nearly equal size, which means that they are both orbiting around a common barycentre situated almost midway between them. There's a lot more information on this system, with links to relevant papers, here.

From that page, here is the 2006 Nature paper on (617) Patroclus:

A Low Density Of 0.8 g cm-3 For The Trojan Binary Asteroid 617 Patroclus by Franck Marchis, Daniel Hestroffer, Pascal Descamps, Jérôme Berthier, Antonin H. Bouchez, Randall D. Campbell, Jason C. Y. Chin, Marcos A. van Dam, Scott K. Hartman, Erik M. Johansson, Robert E. Lafon, David Le Mignant, Imke de Pater, Paul J. Stomski, Doug M. Summers, Frédéric Vachier, Peter L. Wizinovich & Michael H. Wong, Nature, 439: 565-567 (February 2006)

Marchis et al, 2006 wrote:The Trojan population consists of two swarms of asteroids following the same orbit as Jupiter and located at the L4 and L5 stable Lagrange points of the Jupiter–Sun system (leading and following Jupiter by 60°). The asteroid 617 Patroclus is the only known binary Trojan1. The orbit of this double system was hitherto unknown.Here we report that the components, separated by 680 km, move around the system’s centre of mass, describing a roughly circular orbit. Using this orbital information, combined with thermal measurements to estimate the size of the components, we derive a very low density of 0:8+0.2-0.1 g cm-3: The components of 617 Patroclus are therefore very porous or composed mostly of water ice, suggesting that they could have been formed in the outer part of the Solar System2.
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Re: Ray Comfort: "Gravity doesn't exist in space."

#57  Postby laklak » Jul 28, 2014 6:45 pm

Blackadder wrote:
Even after being baked with bacon and leeks, I suspect the IQ of the oysters would rival that of Banana Ray Dumbfucker.


There is something a bit congregational about them.

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Re: Ray Comfort: "Gravity doesn't exist in space."

#58  Postby cogitate-truth » Aug 04, 2014 3:38 pm

Just call Bullshit, Ray isn't worthy of more attention.
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Re: Ray Comfort: "Gravity doesn't exist in space."

#59  Postby tolman » Aug 27, 2014 2:39 pm

Calilasseia wrote:Ray Comfort peddles stupid, retarded shit like this, because he knows that there are enough stupid, retarded rubes who will lap it up and keep sending in the money. Him and the rest of the liars for doctrine - Ham, the younger Hovind (standing in for his jailbird father), and that twat Adnan Oktar - they're all doing this because they know there are enough morons around to keep them in easy affluence. All they have to do is make up stupid, retarded shit, sell it to the rubes, and persuade the rubes that lapping this up makes them purportedly "smarter" than the pointy-headed scientists, and the money will keep coming in.

I bet their mailing lists would be a goldmine for boiler-room fraudsters.
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Re: Ray Comfort: "Gravity doesn't exist in space."

#60  Postby talkietoaster » Sep 19, 2014 9:28 am

I propose making a new title for him - Gravely Idiotic Turnip.
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