Just had an incident of bullying

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Re: Just had an incident of bullying

#81  Postby Fallible » Nov 26, 2015 11:24 am

quas wrote:
Thomas Eshuis wrote:
quas wrote:So were you wearing revealing clothes?

:?


99.999% of rape is caused by the victim dressing provocatively.


99.999% of trolling is undertaken by trolls.
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Re: Just had an incident of bullying

#82  Postby Veida » Nov 26, 2015 12:39 pm

quas wrote:
Thomas Eshuis wrote:
quas wrote:So were you wearing revealing clothes?

:?


99.999% of rape is caused by the victim dressing provocatively.

According to whom?
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Re: Just had an incident of bullying

#83  Postby proudfootz » Nov 26, 2015 12:46 pm

I think it's a quote from Disraeli.
"Truth is stranger than fiction, but it is because Fiction is obliged to stick to possibilities; Truth isn't." - Mark Twain
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Re: Just had an incident of bullying

#84  Postby Agi Hammerthief » Nov 26, 2015 12:51 pm

Veida wrote:
quas wrote:
Thomas Eshuis wrote:
quas wrote:So were you wearing revealing clothes?

:?


99.999% of rape is caused by the victim dressing provocatively.

According to whom?

Rapists probbably.

Made of Stars wrote:quas is making a very oblique remark about Thomas being victim-blamed.
* my (modified) emphasis ( or 'interpretation' )

when you chop off your neighbours head and use it as a vase, you can call it 'culture'.
it's called civilisation is when this gets you jailed for the rest of your live.
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Re: Just had an incident of bullying

#85  Postby Weaver » Nov 26, 2015 2:02 pm

quas wrote:
Weaver wrote:It always stuns me that there are people here who support bullying behaviors, and support a return to the tacit approval of bullying by authority figures, despite the number of kids who have killed themselves or others after being bullied.


That's the only way to deal with bullies. You do not reason with them.
No, it is not.
Back in my high school years, there was this kid that the entire classroom picked on. The teachers were completely at a lost. One of the teachers even asked the bullied victim what's wrong with him, that he becomes such a target.
Because blaming the victim is always the best way. After all, we tolerate it with rape victims, right?
Only thing that eventually stopped the bullying was the discipline master threatening to cane anyone involved.
So, you're saying, after lots of tacit approval by authority figures, once the discipline master put his foot down and indicated the bullying would no longer be tolerated, it stopped?

Bit of an own goal there, as they say, isn't it?
As for the bullies though, last I heard a few of them are now working with the police force. One of them in particular, proudly posted on his facebook that he has been assigned to a special task force that's allowed to stop criminals by "any means necessary".
And? What are the rest of them doing? Any non-bullies who became cops?

Sure, we can debate the hypocrisies of using violence and bullying tactics against bullies all day, but at the end of the day, deep inside we all know that there is only one way to stop Ted Bundy, Hitler, ISIS, etc.

Because all bullies are psychopaths. Because the only way to stop Bundy wasn't life in a maximum security prison, but he had to be killed, and because Bundy is just like religiously-motivated Islamist extremists stepping into a power vacuum in the M.E.

This has to be one of the dumbest, least internally consistent posts I've seen since Robert Byers was evicted from the forum.
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Re: Just had an incident of bullying

#86  Postby Weaver » Nov 26, 2015 2:06 pm

Fallible wrote:
quas wrote:
Thomas Eshuis wrote:
quas wrote:So were you wearing revealing clothes?

:?


99.999% of rape is caused by the victim dressing provocatively.


99.999% of trolling is undertaken by trolls.

Ding, Ding, Ding!
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Re: Just had an incident of bullying

#87  Postby quas » Nov 26, 2015 2:53 pm

When people facepalm, they typically have that dejected look on their face, like so:
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But you guys make me facepalm and laugh at the same time, like so:
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For that you guys deserve an "achievement unlocked" badge.
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First of all,
Doubtdispelled wrote:
Made of Stars wrote:quas is making a very oblique remark about Thomas being victim-blamed.

Oh, I see. I guess I just find the subject of bullying too disturbing to see any humour in it, or any place for irony.

My bad, I suppose.

My joke isn't poking fun at bullying, instead it points out the absurdity of victim-blaming.

Secondly, Fallible, you have no idea what I am talking about, and yet you do that condescending deriding thing as if you know what I am talking about. LOL!

Thirdly, Agi Hammerthief, also doesn't understand my position and just ditto whatever post that seems to oppose mine. LOL!

Fourthly, Weaver, you also misunderstand many things.

So, you're saying, after lots of tacit approval by authority figures, once the discipline master put his foot down and indicated the bullying would no longer be tolerated, it stopped?

No, they didn't give tacit approval. They were trying to stop the bullying, but because the bullying was so severe (it seems like the entire classroom is targeting this one kid only), they started thinking that perhaps this kid did something that really pissed off everyone. Kinda like thinking that a lone girl becomes the victim of gang-rape, so it must have been her dressing provocatively to get that reaction out of everyone.

Because all bullies are psychopaths.

Even if not all of them are, some of them are. Now what to do with those psychopaths?

Because the only way to stop Bundy wasn't life in a maximum security prison, but he had to be killed, and because Bundy is just like religiously-motivated Islamist extremists stepping into a power vacuum in the M.E.

But why do you guys believe that? If you think that bullies can be reasoned with, then why can't we reason with terrorists, Hitler and serial killers? At some level, they are still humans, and theoretically, that means we can still reason with them, appeal to their humanity and talk them into doing the right thing. Of course, practically, we don't and never do that. We either lock them away forever or kill them if we can't lock them away forever. This is the inconsistency that everyone of us here has embraced, and you have to gall to make it seem like I am the only one being inconsistent here!
Last edited by quas on Nov 26, 2015 3:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Just had an incident of bullying

#88  Postby Weaver » Nov 26, 2015 3:34 pm

There are certainly some whose psychopathic behaviors can only be stopped through complete incarceration or through being killed. There MIGHT even be a small subset of bullies who fall into this category.

But you, quas, have yet to establish that bullies have any connection with psychopaths, or that reason alone is a sufficient act to stop their behavior. In fact, I'm pretty sure this is just another stupid strawman of yours - because nobody but you was saying that their bullying could be stopped with reason alone. I for one advocate an increasing series of punishments levied by authority figures to stop the bullying behaviors.

And, like it or not, your seeming approval of victim blaming (they started thinking the kid did something ...) combined with your other posts containing no smilies or indication that you were anything other than fully honest and open with your remarks makes it seem like you believed the shit. That is not the fault of everyone who took your words at face value, it is YOUR fault for not making your meaning clear, using many available options here to do so.

Some terrorists can be reasoned with. Some cannot, and must be captured or killed. But, off-topic though it was, you haven't established there is any inconsistency between that truth and the truth that most if not nearly all bullies can be stopped via the appropriate intervention of authority figures.
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Re: Just had an incident of bullying

#89  Postby Cito di Pense » Nov 26, 2015 3:52 pm

jaydot wrote:that's the sort of caper my teachers got up to. it works. it enables the miscreants to save face and doesn't get all litigaty and unpleasant.


I would have used the word litigious here, and not just because it's actually in a dictionary somewhere. If you want to invent words, try to do it whole-cloth, so it doesn't get all frumious and slithy.

Sorry, but this is the only thing I could find to respond to in an otherwise vacuous defence of 'saving face'.
Хлопнут без некролога. -- Серге́й Па́влович Королёв

Translation by Elbert Hubbard: Do not take life too seriously. You're not going to get out of it alive.
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Re: Just had an incident of bullying

#90  Postby thaesofereode » Nov 26, 2015 4:06 pm

Just read/skimmed through this entire thread. One thing I notice (correct me if I'm wrong) is that there's been no mention of having the perpetrators directly *apologize to* the victim. Of course, a coerced and hollow apology is no good either.

As I understand it, children are not born "moral giants." Compassion has to be TAUGHT. IMHO a lack of compassion (or indeed any acquaintance with the concept) is at the base, core, and root of bullying behavior. Those who are knowledgeable about child development, please weigh in on this, but it's also my understanding that children need to reach a certain point in their cognitive development before they can even understand the concept of compassion (identification with the pain of others). This does occur at a relatively young age, however. So if compassion is taught from as early as this is possible, there is a chance for them. Some parents sadly have not been taught the concept themselves, so they cannot demonstrate or model this behvior to their children. So the great yawning gap in an individual's personality where compassion should reside becomes generational. Growing up in a home environment devoid of compassion is what creates the monsters. I see this void in many people, and it grows out of a lack of socialization. It seems to be endemic now.
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Re: Just had an incident of bullying

#91  Postby quas » Nov 26, 2015 4:23 pm

Weaver wrote:There are certainly some whose psychopathic behaviors can only be stopped through complete incarceration or through being killed. There MIGHT even be a small subset of bullies who fall into this category.

Okay.

But you, quas, have yet to establish that bullies have any connection with psychopaths,

This statement possibly contradicts the statements above, yeah?

To clarify, I don't have to establish that, because you've already admitted that some bullies can only be stopped by overwhelming violence.

or that reason alone is a sufficient act to stop their behavior.

Reason alone? What do you mean by that? That you can have a dialogue while meting out punishment?

In fact, I'm pretty sure this is just another stupid strawman of yours - because nobody but you was saying that their bullying could be stopped with reason alone.

I didn't say that, but I did suggest that that's a possibility, even in cases where you are dealing with Hitler. At the same time, I also said that that's a possibility that we practically never consider.

I for one advocate an increasing series of punishments levied by authority figures to stop the bullying behaviors.

I guess somewhere along the "increasing series of punishments", you are suggesting meting out violent punishment such as caning?

And, like it or not, your seeming approval of victim blaming (they started thinking the kid did something ...)
Never did that, not even seemingly.

combined with your other posts containing no smilies or indication that you were anything other than fully honest and open with your remarks makes it seem like you believed the shit.

Do I have to be lame and riddle my posts with smilies and /sarcasm in order to not be misunderstood? I thought my other posts, the sheer absurdity of victim-blaming itself and hints like "99.999%" obviously bullshit statistics are all dead giveaways that the sentence is meant to be facetious jibe at victim-blaming. And evidently, some people here actually get that I was actually ridiculing, instead of endorsing, victim-blaming.

That is not the fault of everyone who took your words at face value, it is YOUR fault for not making your meaning clear, using many available options here to do so.

What is this?! You victim-blaming me now? :naughty2:

Some terrorists can be reasoned with. Some cannot, and must be captured or killed. But, off-topic though it was, you haven't established there is any inconsistency between that truth and the truth that most if not nearly all bullies can be stopped via the appropriate intervention of authority figures.

Define appropriate intervention. Does it include meting out or threatening to mete out violent punishments?
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Re: Just had an incident of bullying

#92  Postby Thomas Eshuis » Nov 26, 2015 6:39 pm

thaesofereode wrote:Just read/skimmed through this entire thread. One thing I notice (correct me if I'm wrong) is that there's been no mention of having the perpetrators directly *apologize to* the victim. Of course, a coerced and hollow apology is no good either.

The problem is that it's still unclear who the perpetrators were.
Only one kid so far has admitted being involved, but claims someone else gave the books to them.
"Respect for personal beliefs = "I am going to tell you all what I think of YOU, but don't dare retort and tell what you think of ME because...it's my personal belief". Hmm. A bully's charter and no mistake."
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Re: Just had an incident of bullying

#93  Postby Fallible » Nov 26, 2015 6:58 pm

If I seem to have no idea what you are talking about, quas, consider the source. You appear to be in possession of some of the lamest beliefs and opinions I've ever seen here. That's clearly just because I am a knowledge free child and you have spent many years working in the field of education, world history and or psychology.
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Re: Just had an incident of bullying

#94  Postby Ironclad » Nov 26, 2015 7:20 pm

Which bits are the lame ones?
"If there was no such thing as science, you'd be right " - Sean Lock

"God ....an inventive destroyer" - Broks

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Re: Just had an incident of bullying

#95  Postby campermon » Nov 26, 2015 10:17 pm

Thomas Eshuis wrote:Just some background info, I'm currently doing my final intern ship as part of teaching course at the university.


This morning I was teaching one of my classes, 15-17 years old.
While student X went to the bathroom and I was talking to another student, someone took the books of student X from their bag and hid them in a cupboard in the back of the class.
Student X was, no surprise, visibly upset by this. When I asked the students around them who had taken his stuff and demanded they return it immediately, everyone acted as if they didn't what I was talking about.
Since no-one wanted to fess up, I told the entire class that I would not tolerate this kind of behaviour and that if the books were not returned before the end of class, the entire class would get detention.

So finally, with one minute left, one student retrieved the books from the cupboard and handed them back.
When I asked them why he would do such a thing, he said that someone had handed them to him. When I asked who, he said he would not tell.
Therefore I told him that, until he does tell, everything would be his responsibility and that I would contact his tutor/counsellor (not sure what the correct word is in English, the teacher who manages your affairs during the year).

So I mailed his tutor which also happened to be the tutor of the victim and we're going to discuss the matter tomorrow.

Again, student X got visibly upset by the situation and mentioned how 'everyone/many people' were 'out to get him', leading me to suspect he's not fitting in well with the rest of the group and possibly being bullied on a regular basis.

I would appreciate it if people with teaching experience would give their view on the situation.
Criticisms and advise are both welcome. Mainly I'm looking to create a safe teaching environment and how to deal with the culprits.


I haven't read the rest of the thread, but thought I'd chuck my tuppence worth in anyway :)

Yes, a tricksy situation.

Yes, it looks like the victim is probably having a hard time elsewhere - so yes, you must share this info with staff up the foodchain so that some monitoring can be done across the board.

As for the kid who admitted taking the books - he needs talking to and thanking for his honesty. Perhaps he doesn't want to name names because he's being bullied too? Dunno.

As for your role in the class - just ensure that you create a safe zone for the kid when they're with you.

:thumbup:
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Re: Just had an incident of bullying

#96  Postby proudfootz » Nov 27, 2015 12:35 pm

When I was in school, much younger than the students under discussion here, I joined in teasing a new student. She caught me outside of school with some of her older siblings and slapped my face. It helped me realize what I was doing was wrong.
"Truth is stranger than fiction, but it is because Fiction is obliged to stick to possibilities; Truth isn't." - Mark Twain
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Re: Just had an incident of bullying

#97  Postby crank » Nov 28, 2015 1:42 am

Thomas Eshuis wrote:
crank wrote:
Thomas Eshuis wrote:
crank wrote:
You've not only misconstrued much of what I said, you changed the facts.

What's the point in quoting my entire response if you're not going to address what I said?
And, no I did not change the facts in the slightest, you have to read the OP carefully/thoroughly.


crank wrote: It's a quite different situation if the guy who returned the books said someone 'made' him do it, that wasn't in your first version in the OP.

False:
Thomas Eshuis wrote:

So finally, with one minute left, one student retrieved the books from the cupboard and handed them back.
When I asked them why he would do such a thing, he said that someone had handed them to him. When I asked who, he said he would not tell.
Therefore I told him that, until he does tell, everything would be his responsibility and that I would contact his tutor/counsellor (not sure what the correct word is in English, the teacher who manages your affairs during the year).

I think I know how to read, please point to where it's said someone made him do it?

The point where I asked him why he took the books and hid them and he said that someone gave them to him.

crank wrote:
Thomas Eshuis wrote:
crank wrote:
You have said absolutely nothing to give anyone to think that this wasn't an isolated event.

Where did I say it was or wasn't?
All I've said is that the victim gave me the impression it wasn't, because he said things like 'they' are always out to 'get him'.

You're right, I forgot that.
This goes with the 'made' thing. It makes no sense to me as you reported it, if he actually said 'made' then I would agree, there was probably something more serious going on, like maybe there is one or a small group of bullies going after much of the class. But, having just now gone back through all of your posts, he assures the counselor that it isn't systematic. Now I'm beginning to think it really is.

How do you figure?

crank wrote:
Thomas Eshuis wrote:
crank wrote:
I made it clear if it was a pattern, that would be different, and more serious.

And I made it clear that your personal impression that hiding your books is a lame thing to do, is a fallacious appeal to personal incredulity.

No, that's not even what I said, I said it wasn't serious, which, by itself, it isn't.

So you blindly assert.
It is serious, it demonstrates disrespect for the victim. Especially when said victim is visibly upset by the entire incident and both he and I are telling them to hand the books back.

crank wrote:
Thomas Eshuis wrote:
crank wrote: I'm sorry you don't understand how a kid sees you as authority, and if he shows real deference to that, he won't make a good skeptic, but it's crystal clear to me.

This is nothing but an elaborate appeal to common sense fallacy.
If you can't demonstrate how it makes him not a good sceptic, you're just asserting it.
There's a difference between not betraying a friend, who's being wrongfully persecuted and covering for people who did something you know is wrong.

Good skeptics don't view authority something deserving respect simply due to their being authority, this goes beyond 'authority' as in scholarly authority.

Except that this not at all a case of sceptically not accepting my authority. They have no business taking other people's stuff, regardless of my authority and any respect thereof.

crank wrote: I thought that should be obvious. Not ratting another student out is normal behavior,

Again, it's completely irrelevant whether it's normal or expected behaviour.
Students need to learn how to behave, not just in the classroom, but as a member of society.
I can't expect that pupils never play with their phone in class, doesn't mean I won't address it and confiscate the phone if happens.
It's 'normal' behaviour for pupils to talk to each other during class, even during oral instruction by the teacher.
Doesn't change that it's unacceptable behaviour that needs to be corrected.
Just like it's not acceptable behaviour to take and hide other people's stuff, refuse to return and covering up for people who bully.
And again, if this student doesn't 'rat out' his fellow perps, he's the only one who I know is involved and the only one who will face the consequences.

crank wrote: it's not the same as covering for someone, it's not ratting them out. It's not all that subtle a distinction.

A crucial and ludicrous distinction. It might be expected behaviour among their peers, that doesn't mean it's acceptable. Nor will it help them when they'll be the only facing the consequences because they don't want to 'rat out' the others.


crank wrote:
Thomas Eshuis wrote:
crank wrote:
Saying a group bullied this kid, again, not in evidence.

Hence you won't find me asserting this is the case with this incidence.
Do try to address what I actually post and not straw-men.

Your words sounded like you had just about assumed it, your scenario spinning left little to no room for it being a harmless prank.

That's still a complete misrepresentation of my posts in this thread.
All I've said is that I wanted to be sure whether that scenario is happening or not.
Hence why I suggest to the year tutor to have a conversation about it with the student.

crank wrote:
Thomas Eshuis wrote:
crank wrote: You really must not remember what it's like being a kid,

I advise you not to make stuff up about your interlocutors, not only is it dishonest it hinders rational discussion.

What? I asserted an opinion, based on the observation that you expect kids to rat out another student in open class, I've made nothing up.

Yes, you have, as I've made it repeatedly clear that I do not expect them to rat each other out.
I said that they should say who was involved, not that they would/that I expected they would.

crank wrote:
Thomas Eshuis wrote:
crank wrote: ratting out someone just isn't going to happen, not unless you got a class full of busybody weasels.
Expecting it is not a sign of being a good teacher, it's a sign of a teacher with zero understanding of her students.

Your choice of words is quite telling. This has nothing to with grassing or weasels.
This has to do with unacceptable behaviour and teaching children not do this.
And again, I suggest you stuff your blind assertions about my understanding where the sun doesn't shine.

No, you're just wrong,

Counterfactual blind assertion based on repeated failure to address what I've actually posted.

crank wrote: you are expecting behavior from kids that aren't the way kids behave.

Still complete fiction, no matter how many times you blindly repeat it.


crank wrote:They don't give a shit what you expect of them here, they're going to view anyone ratting another student out as a weasel, a rat, whatever, and it;s likely to go very hard on them afterwards. If you don't see that, you're not being a good teacher, you're demanding behavior that isn't in the students' best interest.

Again, not what I posted at all.

crank wrote:
Thomas Eshuis wrote:
crank wrote:
I don't claim to know what's going on, not enough info..

And somehow that's not prevented you from making blind assertions about teaching capacities, knowledge of my pupils and other things.

crank wrote:
It could be an isolated incidence, a harmless prank, hiding someones books is not serious, friends routinely do much worse shit to their buddies. The 'victim's' clear distress could easily be a gross over-reaction, you don't know, at least you haven't given us a reason to think you do.

Equally I have no reason to assume it is an overreaction and the first priority is to ensure no-one feels unsafe in my class.


crank wrote: What is the relationship between the 'victim' and the perps? They could be good friends for all we know. A far better response by you would have been to tell the class no one is leaving until the books are returned, and if it happens again, serious consequences would follow..

You've just demonstrated again you haven't read my OP thoroughly, or my subsequent post as I've made it clear that's exactly what I did.

No, it isn't, you also demanded ratting out another student.

Yes I did. I did not expect him to, I told him that's what he should do, if he wanted to avoid being the only one facing the consequences.
I left the choice with him.
Whether I should expect it or not is immaterial, it's what he should do.
Again, whether I can expect students to play with their phone, or talk during instruction time is completely irrelevant to the fact that they should not do either and they have to be taught not do so.

crank wrote: You're getting loose with the details,

I've done no such thing. You are the one who has failed to read what I actually posted and/or misrepresented it.

crank wrote:keep misconstruing what I said.

That's really the pot calling the kettle black.

crank wrote: I've tried to caveat everything considering how little data was released.

And I've tried to explain why some of your responses were not corresponding with what I actually posted and others were flawed.

crank wrote:
Thomas Eshuis wrote:
Thomas Eshuis wrote:
Since no-one wanted to fess up, I told the entire class that I would not tolerate this kind of behaviour and that if the books were not returned before the end of class, the entire class would get detention.

I had to threaten detention as it was the middle of the day and the kids had different classes to get to.

crank wrote: Your scenario spinning with insufficient evidence did no one any good, leaving you to possibly making it out to be far more serious than it was.

I have to ask which thread you have been reading because this does not at all reflect what I've been posting here.

My remarks stand, you're not being honest with yourself if you don't think you've left virtually no room for the harmless prank case.

Blindly repeating the same baseless assertion won't magically make it true.
You have not demonstrated how I've done this.
I've repeatedly made it clear that I wanted to make sure whether it was an isolated incident or not and that if the culprits had bothered to observe the victim they'd quickly noticed that their 'prank' was anything but harmless.

crank wrote:
Thomas Eshuis wrote:
crank wrote:I bet you haven't even tried perusing the kids social media have you? You don't have a clue what's going on, don't make it into WWIII, figure out what's happening without making the 'perp' into a terrorist, and try real hard to remember what it's like being a kid in school.

Nope, you clearly haven't read my posts in this thread. :picard:


You can facepalm all you want, it's a non sequitur,

It's not, it's an expression of exasperation at your continued failure to address what I actually posted.

crank wrote:I have read all of your posts now and there's no reason to change anything I've said.

No reasons, other than presenting evidence for your assertions, addressing my corrections of your misrepresentations.
But if you don't care about that, that's fine, but then I'm done engaging on this thread with you.

crank wrote:Have you checked out the social media of kids in the school?

I've left it in the hands of their year tutor, which you'd know if you'd read the thread. He's going to talk with the people involved and based on the result, we're going to see if we need to investigate further or take other steps.

crank wrote: that would be really helpful if you suspected there to be a pattern of bullying.

This question has already been resolved.

crank wrote: By continuing to insist that students should rat out other students, especially in class, you clearly forgot, don't understand, what it's like to be a teenager in school.

Once again making shit up that I haven't expressed.
I told the student to tell me who else was involved, at no point did I demand he do so in class.
I said that until he told me one way or the other, he'd be the only we knew was involved and therefore the only one who would face the consequences.
And for the final time, I don't expect him to do anything.
I've made it clear what he should do. What's the right the behaviour.
Covering up for people who've broken the rules is not helpful for either the student or the victim and won't be good behaviour in society either.
If they graduate and some friend gives them stolen goods, not telling their friend was involved won't help them one bit and will only result in them getting punished in their friends stead.

crank wrote: If the kid was telling the truth, that he's not being systematically bullied, then this was highly likely a harmless prank.

A complete non-sequitur based on a false dichotomy.
It might not be systematic bullying, it still made the victim visibly upset, as I made clear in the OP. So even if it was intended as a prank, it was anything but harmless. More-over taken other students stuff is simply unacceptable behaviour, both because it might affect the pupil and it tends to disrupt the class/lesson.

crank wrote:
Maybe I'm biased, in the US, there are usually much much worse shit to get upset about in schools, maybe the schools where you are do so well that something this minor is worthy of so serious a reaction.

This is a fallacy of relative privation.

We're just going to disagree, on what's serious, on what kids think and how they will act. I have no more arguments to give other than to ask any reader to try to think back to their school days. One reason to think I am more likely to be correct is how you think saying "someone gave him the books" is tantamount to saying "someone made him" hide the books, this is just silly, do you know of a secret code here? I just can't fathom the leap you're taking.
“When you're born into this world, you're given a ticket to the freak show. If you're born in America you get a front row seat.”
-George Carlin, who died 2008. Ha, now we have human centipedes running the place
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Re: Just had an incident of bullying

#98  Postby Fallible » Nov 28, 2015 8:37 am

OK so now that's settled, can anyone explain why quas thinks facepalming and laughing entails neither facepalming nor laughing, but rather sitting down in an abandoned building in nothing but a fur coat? :scratch:
John Grant wrote:They say 'let go, let go, let go, you must learn to let go'.
If I hear that fucking phrase again, this baby's gonna blow
Into a million itsy bitsy tiny pieces, don't you know,
Just like my favourite scene in Scanners .
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Re: Just had an incident of bullying

#99  Postby Thomas Eshuis » Nov 28, 2015 8:45 am

crank wrote:
We're just going to disagree, on what's serious, on what kids think and how they will act. I have no more arguments to give other than to ask any reader to try to think back to their school days.

An appeal to personal anecdote fallacy.

crank wrote: One reason to think I am more likely to be correct is how you think saying "someone gave him the books" is tantamount to saying "someone made him" hide the books, this is just silly, do you know of a secret code here? I just can't fathom the leap you're taking.

It's neither a secret code nor a leap of any kind.
When I asked him why he took someone's else's stuff and hid them, his response, therefore explanation was: someone else gave them him.
IE it was offered as an excuse: he did the unacceptable deed, because someone else handed him the books.
"Respect for personal beliefs = "I am going to tell you all what I think of YOU, but don't dare retort and tell what you think of ME because...it's my personal belief". Hmm. A bully's charter and no mistake."
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