Sexual relationships between adults and children are illegal

Help me to find a rational reason why.

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Re: Sexual relationships between adults and children are illegal

#161  Postby Destroyer » Oct 09, 2018 8:34 pm

Scot Dutchy wrote:
Destroyer wrote:
Scot Dutchy wrote:Thommo

Old crap. But of course your interpretation prevails in your mind. Really scraping the barrel.

Being typical Dutch the schools have developed but the rules have not changed. Still quotable but totally irrelevant much like your crap.

You really need to learn some humility. You just find it impossible to admit when you are clearly in the wrong.


Digging up old information is no art.

Learning to admit when one is obviously in the wrong is not a crime.
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Re: Sexual relationships between adults and children are illegal

#162  Postby Rachel Bronwyn » Oct 09, 2018 9:51 pm

It's a key part of adulting.
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Re: Sexual relationships between adults and children are illegal

#163  Postby BWE » Oct 09, 2018 10:00 pm

laklak wrote:I'm always astounded that people need to be told not to fuck kids or animals.
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Re: Sexual relationships between adults and children are illegal

#164  Postby NuclMan » Oct 10, 2018 2:34 am

Scot Dutchy wrote:
Destroyer wrote:
Scot Dutchy wrote:Thommo

Old crap. But of course your interpretation prevails in your mind. Really scraping the barrel.

Being typical Dutch the schools have developed but the rules have not changed. Still quotable but totally irrelevant much like your crap.

You really need to learn some humility. You just find it impossible to admit when you are clearly in the wrong.


Digging up old information is no art.


For once in this thread, you're right. It's typically viewed as a profession, or area of expertise. One that you, apparently, can't be bothered with.

Scot Dutchy wrote:Fucking kids is not illegal everywhere


Perhaps you could get around to posting a place where adults fucking kids, is not prohibited.
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Re: Sexual relationships between adults and children are illegal

#165  Postby Hermit » Oct 10, 2018 4:42 am

As if this thread were not sufficiently absurd we now have a train wreck within train wreck.

The story so far:
Landlord wrote:Children can't give informed consent therefore any sex with them is not different from rape. Should be reasonable except I don't understand why this principle is restricted to sex only? Why it's still legal to teach them religion for example?

Sendraks wrote:Who doesn't see any problem with teaching children religion?

Landlord wrote:People. Teaching religion is completely legal in all jurisdictions. And "teaching sex" is frequently considered more severe crime than murder.

Scot Dutchy wrote:No its not. It is not legal here to so call teach religion. Sex is taught from the age of six.

Thommo wrote:Err what?

People in the Netherlands are absolutely allowed to teach their kids religion.

Scot Dutchy wrote:Not in state schools which is almost 99% of the schools. Just read will you.

In short, Scot Dutchy changes his argument from it is not legal here to so call teach religion to not in state schools and pretends there is no difference between the two statements. More hilarity ensues as he digs in.
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Re: Sexual relationships between adults and children are illegal

#166  Postby Rachel Bronwyn » Oct 10, 2018 5:37 am

To be honest, the "it's bad because they can't give informed consent" argument is silly. We do all kinds of things to people nonconsentually. I didn't consent to being vaccinated. My parents made that choice for me against my wishes. My nephew protests going to bed every day. He's still required to sleep. My best friend in an ICU RN. She doesn't have consent to wipe any of her patients' asses because they're all unconscious but she's still going to. We make decisions for people whose wellbeing is our responsibility without their consent or that violate their consent all the time. Doesn't make them wrong.

We don't rape kids because (most of us would never dream of doing it and) it will very likely harm them.
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Re: Sexual relationships between adults and children are illegal

#167  Postby Thommo » Oct 10, 2018 10:47 am

I'm not sure about that Rachel. I can't think of any kind of sex without consent that is ok. It seems to me that sex has a higher psychological implication that requires explicit consent in a way many activities do not.

Vaccination is a decision taken for the child's benefit, by a guardian with their best interests in mind. It was one of the points I found most troubling that the argument for having sex with children we've seen only ever considers the adult's point of view. "It's why shouldn't I be allowed to?", not "is this beneficial to the child?". You can justify guardians getting to make the decisions about what is or is not in a child's best interest, but when you introduce that conflict of interest (the guardian's own interests, or sexual desire) the situation is fundamentally different, just as it is when a teacher sleeps with a pupil who is old enough to consent.
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Re: Sexual relationships between adults and children are illegal

#168  Postby Rachel Bronwyn » Oct 10, 2018 8:42 pm

I'm not in favour of sex without consent under any circumstances.

It's not the lack of consent that makes fucking kids harmful though. We do nonconsentual things to kids that violate their bodily autonomy all the time because they're beneficial. Consent violations don't necessarily make something damaging.

Potential harm from sex is inherent, whether that sex is consentual or not. Consentual sex can still fuck you up emotionally and physically but we let adults make the decision to take that risk because they can comprehend it.

Consent violations can be profoundly damaging or not at all based on whether what's being done that violates the person's consent is harmful. Kids don't have total bodily autonomy and have their consent violated all the time for their well-being and aren't emotionally or physically crippled. Child rapists will throw that in everyone's face when they're told consent is the determining factor of whether something is harmful. Consent violations certainly can fuck with a child's (or anyone's) head but the fact of the matter is raping kids is inherently dangerous to them. If they could consent, it would STILL be dangerous to them. Adding a consent violation on top of that certainly worsens it but it was already a terrible thing to do.
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Re: Sexual relationships between adults and children are illegal

#169  Postby Thommo » Oct 10, 2018 8:58 pm

What I'm saying is, I guess, two things. Firstly that consent is more or less important for different actions, and sex is one of those things where violation of consent is at its most important.

Secondly I would suggest that other things that might be done to children are done based on consent from a guardian, compelled to act in the best interests of the child. That is to say we give a sort of power of attorney for someone else to make the decision on the child's behalf, and thus have a form of consent preserved. A doctor can innoculate a child with the parent's consent in the child's best interest. Where no benefit can be gained, there is no presumption that the guardian has an equivalent transfer of the power of consent.

We are naturally guarded against such a transfer where the adult might gain for themselves at the loss of the child (financially or for their own sexual gratification). Situations where there is a conflict of interest, and especially where there is a vulnerable person involved attract a higher level of vigilance.
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Re: Sexual relationships between adults and children are illegal

#170  Postby theropod » Oct 10, 2018 10:00 pm

I think we need a straight up answer to the question posed by Skinny Puppy.

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Re: Sexual relationships between adults and children are illegal

#171  Postby Landlord » Oct 13, 2018 6:42 am

Mike_L wrote:If it didn't work back then, it seems unlikely that it'll work now or at any time.

I don't want to convince you, I want you to explain where it is wrong.
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Re: Sexual relationships between adults and children are illegal

#172  Postby Landlord » Oct 13, 2018 6:43 am

SafeAsMilk wrote:You have no evidence for the position that being told it's harmful is what causes harm. You just assert it blindly. Thommo has provided you with oodles of evidence that it objectively does cause harm, and you ignore it. Says everything everyone in the thread needs to know.

Yes, I have no evidences, and neither are you. And all I want you to do - give an alternative explanation.
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Re: Sexual relationships between adults and children are illegal

#173  Postby Landlord » Oct 13, 2018 6:45 am

Fallible wrote:Nope. that's not true at all. Children feel at the time that something is very wrong.

We're talking only about those cases when child is willing to participate.
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Re: Sexual relationships between adults and children are illegal

#174  Postby Landlord » Oct 13, 2018 6:47 am

The_Metatron wrote:There you are, doing it again. You can’t tell right from wrong without a law spelling it out for you, can you?

Yes I can.
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Re: Sexual relationships between adults and children are illegal

#175  Postby Fenrir » Oct 13, 2018 6:48 am

BWE wrote:
laklak wrote:I'm always astounded that people need to be told not to fuck kids or animals.
Religion: it only fails when you test it.-Thunderf00t.
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Re: Sexual relationships between adults and children are illegal

#176  Postby Landlord » Oct 13, 2018 6:51 am

laklak wrote:In Florida we have to remind people

Incest? It usually involve two consenting adults. But still illegal.
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Re: Sexual relationships between adults and children are illegal

#177  Postby Landlord » Oct 13, 2018 6:53 am

Keep It Real wrote:Paedophiles have zero in common with those other persecuted minorities. Blacks? Persecuted for financial gain. Jews? Persecuted because of one powerful man's insanity. "Witches?" persecuted because of religion (madness). Homosexuals? Persecuted because of religion. Paedophiles? Persecuted because they rape children ie actually severely directly DEFINITIVELY rape children.

You're right except: Blacks were persecuted because that was widely believed that they are inferior to whites. Jews were persecuted over the course of history in diffrent countries bacause that was widely believed that they are lying, cunning, greedy and deceiving people. Witches were persecuted because it was widely believed that some people can use magic against Christians and doing them harm. Homosexuals were (and still are) persecuted in different countries with different religions, even if their religion does not require to punish them, even in atheistic countries, because that was widely believed that homosesualtiy is against "moral and spiritual" values of society and can harm it's traditional ways. And yes, pedophiles are persecuted because it is wildely believed that they are raping children. And unless we find out this is true, we can't be sure this case is different. And the fact that we want, desperately want it to be different case, doesn't make it true.
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Re: Sexual relationships between adults and children are illegal

#178  Postby Cito di Pense » Oct 13, 2018 6:55 am

Landlord wrote:
Mike_L wrote:If it didn't work back then, it seems unlikely that it'll work now or at any time.

I don't want to convince you, I want you to explain where it is wrong.


All the factors indicating that children are not equal partners in sexual relations with adults have been pointed out to you. You are stonewalling. You apparently want to change how these relationships are viewed, but you're being outvoted by people who are at least as sophisticated as you are about human relationships, and not just here.

Landlord wrote:
Fallible wrote:Nope. that's not true at all. Children feel at the time that something is very wrong.

We're talking only about those cases when child is willing to participate.


A child's willingness to do a lot of things is not countenanced by adults. This also has been pointed out to you, or didn't you get that memo? When adults behave childishly, we treat it as inappropriate, if not unexpected. Perhaps you know what I mean.
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Re: Sexual relationships between adults and children are illegal

#179  Postby Landlord » Oct 13, 2018 7:22 am

The_Metatron wrote:Those same laws that protect the children also protect the pedophiles. From the parents.

If they have the rights to have guns, they can protect themselves.
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Re: Sexual relationships between adults and children are illegal

#180  Postby Landlord » Oct 13, 2018 7:25 am

Destroyer wrote:nothing of a personal nature could be scientifically proven to be objective/universal

I never said this.
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