Survey finds RE considered the ‘least beneficial subject’

21% say it was least beneficial subject they were taught

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Survey finds RE considered the ‘least beneficial subject’

#1  Postby Horwood Beer-Master » Aug 16, 2013 1:24 pm

https://humanism.org.uk/2013/08/09/surv ... eneficial/

British Humanist Association wrote:A new survey published today has found that more UK adults consider religious education (RE) to have been the ‘least beneficial subject’ they were taught at secondary school than any other subject. The survey found that 21% of UK adults considered RE to be the least beneficial, ahead of art (16%) and gym/PE (10%). Conversely, under 1% of people said sex education was the least beneficial subject – fewer than any other. 1% also said this about biology.

The British Humanist Association (BHA) strongly supports teaching about different religions and non-religious beliefs in school, but believes the subject of RE needs reform. BHA Education Campaigner Richy Thompson commented, ‘It is vital that RE remains relevant to young people today, and with surveys showing that between half and two-thirds of young people are not religious, this means teaching about non-religious beliefs such as Humanism alongside religious beliefs in a manner which does not seek to proselytise but instead aims to impart information in an objective and balanced way... (continues)
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Re: Survey finds RE considered the ‘least beneficial subject’

#2  Postby Scot Dutchy » Aug 16, 2013 1:27 pm

When I was at school is was called RI.
Disagree with the BHA. It is a complete waste of time as who really cares about mumbo-jumbo of any clour.
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Re: Survey finds RE considered the ‘least beneficial subject’

#3  Postby Shrunk » Aug 16, 2013 3:03 pm

Scot Dutchy wrote:When I was at school is was called RI.


What did that stand for?

Disagree with the BHA. It is a complete waste of time as who really cares about mumbo-jumbo of any clour.


I have no problem with being offered as an optional course, but I can't see what justifies making it mandatory.
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Re: Survey finds RE considered the ‘least beneficial subject’

#4  Postby Scot Dutchy » Aug 16, 2013 3:11 pm

Sorry did you not know. Religious Instruction. No education just told what to do.

I agree with on the second point. If people want to learn how crazy people can think why not.
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Re: Survey finds RE considered the ‘least beneficial subject’

#5  Postby ED209 » Aug 16, 2013 3:16 pm

Well, employers and colleges are always saying that school leavers are excessively numerate and literate but are held back by an insufficient understanding of the tenets of hinduism :dunno:
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Re: Survey finds RE considered the ‘least beneficial subject’

#6  Postby Shrunk » Aug 16, 2013 3:20 pm

Scot Dutchy wrote:Sorry did you not know. Religious Instruction. No education just told what to do.


I was wondering if it stood for "religious indoctrination". Which, from what you say, sounds like it would be an accurate name.
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Re: Survey finds RE considered the ‘least beneficial subject’

#7  Postby Matt_B » Aug 16, 2013 3:23 pm

I'm surprised the figure is that low.

Anyway, the far more interesting result of that survey is that it appears that only 6% of people were on the receiving end of a wedgie when they were at school. No wonder educational standards are slipping.
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Re: Survey finds RE considered the ‘least beneficial subject’

#8  Postby CdesignProponentsist » Aug 16, 2013 3:27 pm

I'm sure most home schoolers put RE at the top. It will come in real handy when applying for a job.
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Re: Survey finds RE considered the ‘least beneficial subject’

#9  Postby chairman bill » Aug 16, 2013 3:31 pm

My kids enjoyed RE. That said, their teacher was an atheist.
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Re: Survey finds RE considered the ‘least beneficial subject’

#10  Postby Scot Dutchy » Aug 16, 2013 3:40 pm

There was one year I enjoyed RI. We had an old guy who was a German spy interrogator during the WW2.

He loved telling us about all the different methods that were used. It sod all to do with RI and was far more interesting.
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Re: Survey finds RE considered the ‘least beneficial subject’

#11  Postby Jumbo » Aug 16, 2013 5:15 pm

You could tell how important it was to our school when they literally forgot to timetable it for us one year.
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Re: Survey finds RE considered the ‘least beneficial subject’

#12  Postby HomerJay » Aug 16, 2013 7:37 pm

this means teaching about non-religious beliefs such as Humanism


Humanism isn't a non-religious belief and there is no correlation between religious beliefs and non-religious beliefs, it's complete crap. If I believe that Manchester United will win the cup, it is a non-religious belief but what does it tell us about religious beliefs? Fuck all.

In this context the BHA sees itself as mediating on behalf of certain beliefs (!), it's just trying to eek out a little bit of turf it can defend, even if that means subjecting kids to the rest of the religious shit.

It's MeToo identity politics, not very endearing.
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Re: Survey finds RE considered the ‘least beneficial subject’

#13  Postby Varangian » Aug 16, 2013 8:54 pm

CdesignProponentsist wrote:I'm sure most home schoolers put RE at the top. It will come in real handy when applying for a job.


...as a preacher?

I think it is useful to know the delusions other people suffer from, but that it could be chucked under some other subject, like history - which will send a message as well...
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Re: Survey finds RE considered the ‘least beneficial subject’

#14  Postby Calilasseia » Aug 17, 2013 1:45 am

Shouldn't the whole subject be re-labelled "comparative mythology"?
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Re: Survey finds RE considered the ‘least beneficial subject’

#15  Postby orpheus » Aug 17, 2013 2:41 am

Calilasseia wrote:Shouldn't the whole subject be re-labelled "comparative mythology"?


Whatever the label, I certainly think it should be taught. Indoctrination — no. Education — yes, absolutely. Any school curriculum that doesn't teach about such a huge and omnipresent force in world history, politics, art, literature and philosophy is woefully deficient. You can't really understand much of the world without understanding something of the various religions, their tenets, their places in history, their influences and interactions, etc.

Edit: Moreover, Dennett said that after writing his book on religion he was wary of making any policy recommendations save one: that comparative religion should be required in all schools. He pointed out that learning about all the various claims to The Truth is a an excellent inoculation against indoctrination into any particular one.
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Re: Survey finds RE considered the ‘least beneficial subject’

#16  Postby Scot Dutchy » Aug 17, 2013 6:46 am

orpheus wrote:
Calilasseia wrote:Shouldn't the whole subject be re-labelled "comparative mythology"?


Whatever the label, I certainly think it should be taught. Indoctrination — no. Education — yes, absolutely. Any school curriculum that doesn't teach about such a huge and omnipresent force in world history, politics, art, literature and philosophy is woefully deficient. You can't really understand much of the world without understanding something of the various religions, their tenets, their places in history, their influences and interactions, etc.

Edit: Moreover, Dennett said that after writing his book on religion he was wary of making any policy recommendations save one: that comparative religion should be required in all schools. He pointed out that learning about all the various claims to The Truth is a an excellent inoculation against indoctrination into any particular one.


Disagree. Where do you draw the line? Just ignore the lot. If a child wishes to know then they should be able to do so.

It should not be a mandatory subject. Here it is not in public schools.

BTW the same is true of philosophy. A waste of time and money.
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Re: Survey finds RE considered the ‘least beneficial subject’

#17  Postby Cito di Pense » Aug 17, 2013 6:50 am

orpheus wrote:He pointed out that learning about all the various claims to The Truth is a an excellent inoculation against indoctrination into any particular one.


Unsubstantiated claims and indoctrination are not limited to religion. There does come a point at which a government and its institutions will not encourage the questioning of just-so stories. Remember, your government is there for you. :evilgrin:

There's always that old chestnut from Ben Franklin or Mark Twain or somebody like that, to the effect of pondering the absurdity of being a loyal citizen of a democracy whilst believing the universe is a monarchy. :dance:
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Re: Survey finds RE considered the ‘least beneficial subject’

#18  Postby Shrunk » Aug 17, 2013 11:44 am

orpheus wrote:Whatever the label, I certainly think it should be taught. Indoctrination — no. Education — yes, absolutely. Any school curriculum that doesn't teach about such a huge and omnipresent force in world history, politics, art, literature and philosophy is woefully deficient. You can't really understand much of the world without understanding something of the various religions, their tenets, their places in history, their influences and interactions, etc.


Which, I think, is an argument against separating religion off into a subject of its own. If you cover all of those other topics you list adequately, you must also be discussing the role that religion has had in them, so it's covered there.
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Re: Survey finds RE considered the ‘least beneficial subject’

#19  Postby orpheus » Aug 17, 2013 12:36 pm

Shrunk wrote:
orpheus wrote:Whatever the label, I certainly think it should be taught. Indoctrination — no. Education — yes, absolutely. Any school curriculum that doesn't teach about such a huge and omnipresent force in world history, politics, art, literature and philosophy is woefully deficient. You can't really understand much of the world without understanding something of the various religions, their tenets, their places in history, their influences and interactions, etc.


Which, I think, is an argument against separating religion off into a subject of its own. If you cover all of those other topics you list adequately, you must also be discussing the role that religion has had in them, so it's covered there.


Well, since all of these subjects are intertwined, you could say the same about any of them. In fact, by that reasoning you could argue that they all should come under one heading. Obviously that's impractical, and more importantly, just because topics are intertwined does not erase their identity as separate topics. I think religion is the same.
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Re: Survey finds RE considered the ‘least beneficial subject’

#20  Postby orpheus » Aug 17, 2013 12:40 pm

Scot Dutchy wrote:
orpheus wrote:
Calilasseia wrote:Shouldn't the whole subject be re-labelled "comparative mythology"?


Whatever the label, I certainly think it should be taught. Indoctrination — no. Education — yes, absolutely. Any school curriculum that doesn't teach about such a huge and omnipresent force in world history, politics, art, literature and philosophy is woefully deficient. You can't really understand much of the world without understanding something of the various religions, their tenets, their places in history, their influences and interactions, etc.

Edit: Moreover, Dennett said that after writing his book on religion he was wary of making any policy recommendations save one: that comparative religion should be required in all schools. He pointed out that learning about all the various claims to The Truth is a an excellent inoculation against indoctrination into any particular one.


Disagree. Where do you draw the line? Just ignore the lot. If a child wishes to know then they should be able to do so.

It should not be a mandatory subject. Here it is not in public schools.

BTW the same is true of philosophy. A waste of time and money.


Lines must be drawn in all subjects; you can't teach the totality of anything. Doesn't mean it's impossible to draw those lines. And even if it were, that's still not an argument against the importance of any particular topic.

Re philosophy: we disagree. Kids need not have an extensive course that tries to cover all areas and movements of philosophy, but they should have the basics. A high school graduate who knows nothing of Plato, for example, has missed a lot and is undereducated.
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