4 teenagers in Pensacola Harbour killed by a sea serpent?

Anything that doesn't fit anywhere else below.

Moderators: Calilasseia, DarthHelmet86, Onyx8

Re: 4 teenagers in Pensacola Harbour killed by a sea serpent?

#101  Postby Sendraks » Jul 11, 2014 5:43 pm

Soral wrote:I'm saying, assume that sea serpents were extremely rare. The chance of one dying near the coast (considering their alleged immense size) would be very unlikely considering how vast the ocean is.


Not to mention the chance of one of them actually coming near the coast to attack anyone.
"One of the great tragedies of mankind is that morality has been hijacked by religion." - Arthur C Clarke

"'Science doesn't know everything' - Well science knows it doesn't know everything, otherwise it'd stop" - Dara O'Brian
User avatar
Sendraks
 
Name: D-Money Jr
Posts: 15239
Age: 104
Male

Country: England
Print view this post

Ads by Google


Re: 4 teenagers in Pensacola Harbour killed by a sea serpent?

#102  Postby theropod » Jul 11, 2014 5:46 pm

Soral wrote:'Serpent' implies a snake, so I'm using facts from anatomy common in snakes.

What makes you think they'll go UP the shelves to somehow appear on beaches, as opposed to sliding down them?


The story IMPLIES a lot of shit but there is NOT ONE SHRED OF EMPIRICAL EVIDENCE that any such creature attacked anyone ever.

You are not using any facts. You are making empty assertions based on a story that is completely unsupported.

I've seen snow snakes, does that qualify as evidence of frozen water reptiles sans legs? What about the "White Walkers™"?

RS
Sleeping in the hen house doesn't make you a chicken.
User avatar
theropod
RS Donator
 
Name: Roger
Posts: 7529
Age: 67
Male

Country: USA
United States (us)
Print view this post

Re: 4 teenagers in Pensacola Harbour killed by a sea serpent?

#103  Postby Soral » Jul 11, 2014 5:49 pm

Sendraks wrote:
Soral wrote:I'm saying, assume that sea serpents were extremely rare. The chance of one dying near the coast (considering their alleged immense size) would be very unlikely considering how vast the ocean is.


Not to mention the chance of one of them actually coming near the coast to attack anyone.


Considering the lifespan of most snakes is about 20 or so years, I'd reason the chances of a sea serpent (which would be extremely rare) dying extremely close to the coast (that is, close enough to be pulled to the shore) would be more unlikely.
User avatar
Soral
Banned Sockpuppet
THREAD STARTER
 
Name: Sora
Posts: 60

Country: Sweden
Print view this post

Re: 4 teenagers in Pensacola Harbour killed by a sea serpent?

#104  Postby BlackBart » Jul 11, 2014 5:49 pm

Soral wrote:I'm saying, assume that sea serpents were extremely rare.


We don't need to assume anything. If you can't provide positive evidence for a claim there's no need to conclude it's fact.
You don't crucify people! Not on Good Friday! - Harold Shand
User avatar
BlackBart
 
Name: rotten bart
Posts: 12245
Age: 58
Male

United Kingdom (uk)
Print view this post

Re: 4 teenagers in Pensacola Harbour killed by a sea serpent?

#105  Postby Sendraks » Jul 11, 2014 5:49 pm

Soral wrote:Considering the lifespan of most snakes is about 20 or so years, I'd reason the chances of a sea serpent (which would be extremely rare) dying extremely close to the coast (that is, close enough to be pulled to the shore) would be more unlikely.


Or indeed coming near the coast to attack anyone.
"One of the great tragedies of mankind is that morality has been hijacked by religion." - Arthur C Clarke

"'Science doesn't know everything' - Well science knows it doesn't know everything, otherwise it'd stop" - Dara O'Brian
User avatar
Sendraks
 
Name: D-Money Jr
Posts: 15239
Age: 104
Male

Country: England
Print view this post

Re: 4 teenagers in Pensacola Harbour killed by a sea serpent?

#106  Postby Soral » Jul 11, 2014 5:53 pm

You're acting as if a large sea creature which (from comparing anatomy to other snakes, ergo 'serpent' ) would most likely sink to the bottom of the ocean when it dies, would magically be whisked towards the shore.

Do you have any cases of an animal which only lives in very deep, non-coastal waters (and does not float when it dies) washing to shore?
User avatar
Soral
Banned Sockpuppet
THREAD STARTER
 
Name: Sora
Posts: 60

Country: Sweden
Print view this post

Re: 4 teenagers in Pensacola Harbour killed by a sea serpent?

#107  Postby BlackBart » Jul 11, 2014 5:55 pm

Soral wrote:
Sendraks wrote:
Soral wrote:I'm saying, assume that sea serpents were extremely rare. The chance of one dying near the coast (considering their alleged immense size) would be very unlikely considering how vast the ocean is.


Not to mention the chance of one of them actually coming near the coast to attack anyone.


Considering the lifespan of most snakes is about 20 or so years, I'd reason the chances of a sea serpent (which would be extremely rare) dying extremely close to the coast (that is, close enough to be pulled to the shore) would be more unlikely.


Except you have no evidence that it is a serpent - not even the original story claims that is was. :doh:
You don't crucify people! Not on Good Friday! - Harold Shand
User avatar
BlackBart
 
Name: rotten bart
Posts: 12245
Age: 58
Male

United Kingdom (uk)
Print view this post

Ads by Google


Re: 4 teenagers in Pensacola Harbour killed by a sea serpent?

#108  Postby Sendraks » Jul 11, 2014 5:56 pm

Soral wrote:Do you have any cases of an animal which only lives in very deep, non-coastal waters (and does not float when it dies) washing to shore?


I dunno. Do you have any examples of an animal which only lives in very deep, non-coastal waters, coming to coastal areas and attacking people?
"One of the great tragedies of mankind is that morality has been hijacked by religion." - Arthur C Clarke

"'Science doesn't know everything' - Well science knows it doesn't know everything, otherwise it'd stop" - Dara O'Brian
User avatar
Sendraks
 
Name: D-Money Jr
Posts: 15239
Age: 104
Male

Country: England
Print view this post

Re: 4 teenagers in Pensacola Harbour killed by a sea serpent?

#109  Postby Soral » Jul 11, 2014 5:57 pm

Sendraks wrote:
Soral wrote:Do you have any cases of an animal which only lives in very deep, non-coastal waters (and does not float when it dies) washing to shore?


I dunno. Do you have any examples of an animal which only lives in very deep, non-coastal waters, coming to coastal areas and attacking people?


http://www.theguardian.com/environment/ ... ego-divers

Squid, however, float when they die, which is why their bodies wash to shore on occasion. If they sank to the bottom of the ocean it'd be extremely unlikely because they aren't being pulled to the shore as they thrive so far away from it (usually)

Squid are very common, so these location mishaps are more common.
User avatar
Soral
Banned Sockpuppet
THREAD STARTER
 
Name: Sora
Posts: 60

Country: Sweden
Print view this post

Re: 4 teenagers in Pensacola Harbour killed by a sea serpent?

#110  Postby BlackBart » Jul 11, 2014 5:59 pm

Soral wrote:You're acting as if a large sea creature which (from comparing anatomy to other snakes, ergo 'serpent' ) would most likely sink to the bottom of the ocean when it dies, would magically be whisked towards the shore.

Do you have any cases of an animal which only lives in very deep, non-coastal waters (and does not float when it dies) washing to shore?


Burden of proof. We don't need to do your homework for you. You haven't demonstated such a creature exists in the first place.
You don't crucify people! Not on Good Friday! - Harold Shand
User avatar
BlackBart
 
Name: rotten bart
Posts: 12245
Age: 58
Male

United Kingdom (uk)
Print view this post

Re: 4 teenagers in Pensacola Harbour killed by a sea serpent?

#111  Postby Soral » Jul 11, 2014 6:00 pm

That's up to nature.

If something dies and falls to the ocean floor, nothing is pulling it to shores.

If an animal that lives in only open and deep water floats when it dies, it could easily be pushed to shores by wind or surface currents.
Last edited by Soral on Jul 11, 2014 6:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
Soral
Banned Sockpuppet
THREAD STARTER
 
Name: Sora
Posts: 60

Country: Sweden
Print view this post

Re: 4 teenagers in Pensacola Harbour killed by a sea serpent?

#112  Postby Sendraks » Jul 11, 2014 6:01 pm

Soral wrote:http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2009/jul/17/giant-squid-attack-san-diego-divers

Squid, however, float when they die.


You are aware of the following I assume

1) Humbolt squid are no way near as large as your alledged sea serpent.
2) They are seen quite often and while potentially dangerous, do not routinely attack humans.
3) Their larger relatives, the Giant Squid and Colossal Squid, do not exhibit similar behaviour of coming into coastal waters and coming near to the surface.

So, back to my question.

Do you have any examples of an animal which only lives in very deep, non-coastal waters, coming to coastal areas and attacking people?
"One of the great tragedies of mankind is that morality has been hijacked by religion." - Arthur C Clarke

"'Science doesn't know everything' - Well science knows it doesn't know everything, otherwise it'd stop" - Dara O'Brian
User avatar
Sendraks
 
Name: D-Money Jr
Posts: 15239
Age: 104
Male

Country: England
Print view this post

Re: 4 teenagers in Pensacola Harbour killed by a sea serpent?

#113  Postby Soral » Jul 11, 2014 6:02 pm

But Giant Squid FLOAT when they die. They could easily be pushed by surface currents or wind on the surface. No difficulty in getting the body to defy gravity and go UP the continental shelves to get to the shore.
User avatar
Soral
Banned Sockpuppet
THREAD STARTER
 
Name: Sora
Posts: 60

Country: Sweden
Print view this post

Re: 4 teenagers in Pensacola Harbour killed by a sea serpent?

#114  Postby Sendraks » Jul 11, 2014 6:07 pm

Soral wrote:But Giant Squid FLOAT when they die. They could easily be pushed by surface currents or wind on the surface. No difficulty in getting the body to defy gravity and go UP the continental shelves to get to the shore.


That they float when they die is irrelevant.

The point is that large, deep ocean dwelling, creatures are not known for coming into shallow coastal waters and attacking people.
If the hypothetical sea serpent lives where you claim it does, then its hypothetical sorte into the shallows to attack people seems to be highly unlikely behaviour on its part.

So you're citing the existence of a highly unlikely creature that behaved in a highly unlikely way, based on your claims for its chosen habitat.
"One of the great tragedies of mankind is that morality has been hijacked by religion." - Arthur C Clarke

"'Science doesn't know everything' - Well science knows it doesn't know everything, otherwise it'd stop" - Dara O'Brian
User avatar
Sendraks
 
Name: D-Money Jr
Posts: 15239
Age: 104
Male

Country: England
Print view this post

Re: 4 teenagers in Pensacola Harbour killed by a sea serpent?

#115  Postby Soral » Jul 11, 2014 6:09 pm

Sendraks wrote:
Soral wrote:But Giant Squid FLOAT when they die. They could easily be pushed by surface currents or wind on the surface. No difficulty in getting the body to defy gravity and go UP the continental shelves to get to the shore.


That they float when they die is irrelevant.

The point is that large, deep ocean dwelling, creatures are not known for coming into shallow coastal waters and attacking people.
If the hypothetical sea serpent lives where you claim it does, then its hypothetical sorte into the shallows to attack people seems to be highly unlikely behaviour on its part.

So you're citing the existence of a highly unlikely creature that behaved in a highly unlikely way, based on your claims for its chosen habitat.


Unlikely, but not impossible.
User avatar
Soral
Banned Sockpuppet
THREAD STARTER
 
Name: Sora
Posts: 60

Country: Sweden
Print view this post

Ads by Google


Re: 4 teenagers in Pensacola Harbour killed by a sea serpent?

#116  Postby theropod » Jul 11, 2014 6:14 pm

Soral,

It's also not impossible that you will eventually see the importance of having some empirical evidence to support this tall tale.

RS
Sleeping in the hen house doesn't make you a chicken.
User avatar
theropod
RS Donator
 
Name: Roger
Posts: 7529
Age: 67
Male

Country: USA
United States (us)
Print view this post

Re: 4 teenagers in Pensacola Harbour killed by a sea serpent?

#117  Postby Sendraks » Jul 11, 2014 6:15 pm

Soral wrote:Unlikely, but not impossible.


Well as you can cite no examples of large deep sea lifeforms behaving in the way required to meet all your criteria, lets say highly improbable.

The evidence suggests that no such sea serpent attack occurred.
There is no evidence to support the highly improbable scenario you are outlining.

To justify your claims, you're going to need some highly remarkable evidence.
"One of the great tragedies of mankind is that morality has been hijacked by religion." - Arthur C Clarke

"'Science doesn't know everything' - Well science knows it doesn't know everything, otherwise it'd stop" - Dara O'Brian
User avatar
Sendraks
 
Name: D-Money Jr
Posts: 15239
Age: 104
Male

Country: England
Print view this post

Re: 4 teenagers in Pensacola Harbour killed by a sea serpent?

#118  Postby Soral » Jul 11, 2014 6:24 pm

Sendraks wrote:
Soral wrote:Unlikely, but not impossible.


Well as you can cite no examples of large deep sea lifeforms behaving in the way required to meet all your criteria, lets say highly improbable.

The evidence suggests that no such sea serpent attack occurred.
There is no evidence to support the highly improbable scenario you are outlining.

To justify your claims, you're going to need some highly remarkable evidence.



Where is this report which states there weren't any marks on the body?
User avatar
Soral
Banned Sockpuppet
THREAD STARTER
 
Name: Sora
Posts: 60

Country: Sweden
Print view this post

Re: 4 teenagers in Pensacola Harbour killed by a sea serpent?

#119  Postby KeenIdiot » Jul 11, 2014 6:27 pm

theropod wrote:Soral,

It's also not impossible that you will eventually see the importance of having some empirical evidence to support this tall tale.

RS

Soral is a well known troll, I'm sure they know better. They do it for the lulz.
KeenIdiot
 
Name: Mike
Posts: 924
Age: 32
Male

Country: USA
United States (us)
Print view this post

Re: 4 teenagers in Pensacola Harbour killed by a sea serpent?

#120  Postby Sendraks » Jul 11, 2014 6:30 pm

Soral wrote:Where is this report which states there weren't any marks on the body?


What are you claiming here?
If you're suggesting that if this report doesn't exist then the story must be true, I'd like to point out that the lack of evidence for a sea serpent attack NOT occurring is not evidence that one did.

You're the one making the extraordinary claim, you present the evidence.
"One of the great tragedies of mankind is that morality has been hijacked by religion." - Arthur C Clarke

"'Science doesn't know everything' - Well science knows it doesn't know everything, otherwise it'd stop" - Dara O'Brian
User avatar
Sendraks
 
Name: D-Money Jr
Posts: 15239
Age: 104
Male

Country: England
Print view this post

PreviousNext

Return to General Debunking

Who is online

Users viewing this topic: No registered users and 1 guest