Paradoxes of time in Saint Augustine

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Paradoxes of time in Saint Augustine

#1  Postby Clive Durdle » Jan 28, 2019 4:52 pm

Found this in skoob, by Roland J Teske SJ, and it is a fascinating introduction to why so much theology is as it is now, and I would argue that Augustine’s thinking is very similar to universe from nothing ideas, except he wasn’t able to think in god free terms.



Teske may not realise it but I think he has, by explaining Augustine’s thinking so clearly, killed off godislms :-)

Augustine asked the classic question what wasGod doing before he made heaven and earth, and asserts the absolute immutability of God.

Why does this sound so similar to block time ideas?
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Re: Paradoxes of time in Saint Augustine

#2  Postby Clive Durdle » Jan 28, 2019 5:10 pm

Augustine uses a three tier model of the universe,

That which is effected by time and place - bodies

That which is effected by time only - souls

That nothing effects - god.

But this is very similar to modern thinking. An ever existing universe of nothing is a three body problem the result of which is the quantum froth, some of which gets a bit more complex and evolves into universes, some of which are complex enough to have life forms typing away. So the issues of determinism and freedom are resolved by building on Augustine’s ideas, replacing his connections of souls and Jesus Christ with complexity and cas.
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Re: Paradoxes of time in Saint Augustine

#3  Postby newolder » Jan 28, 2019 5:40 pm

Clive Durdle wrote:Augustine uses a three tier model of the universe,

That which is effected by time and place - bodies

That which is effected by time only - souls

That nothing effects - god.

But this is very similar to modern thinking.

Citation required.

An ever existing universe of nothing is a three body problem

No it isn't. Nothing includes no bodies and "ever existing" means it's not nothing because it has (at minimum) a dimension of time. :scratch:

the result of which is the quantum froth, some of which gets a bit more complex and evolves into universes, some of which are complex enough to have life forms typing away. So the issues of determinism and freedom are resolved by building on Augustine’s ideas, replacing his connections of souls and Jesus Christ with complexity and cas.

Bullcrap.

Note to any mod: Is this a suitable topic for a General Science & Technology board? :ask:
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Re: Paradoxes of time in Saint Augustine

#4  Postby Clive Durdle » Jan 29, 2019 8:08 am

Good morning, maybe I am quoting from Teske? Sorry, I missed the rule that everything must be fully referenced and written in a Lancet type style.

Isn’t time a science subject?

I am not allowed to reference Barbour?

http://platonia.com/

Or Kraus

https://www.nytimes.com/2012/03/25/book ... rauss.html

Or discuss a church father’s views on a rational board by replacing soul models with complex adaptive systems and thus attempt to start discussion of a way to resolve the determinism freewill paradox.

But ok, it is all bull crap , let’s not even try and tease out something around what nothing and infinity mean.
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Re: Paradoxes of time in Saint Augustine

#5  Postby newolder » Jan 29, 2019 9:55 am

Clive Durdle wrote:...

But ok, it is all bull crap , let’s not even try and tease out something around what nothing and infinity mean.

Have you tried the philosophy section?

Or:

Which paradox of time do you wish to discuss first?

What hypothesis would resolve said paradox?

What test could be made to falsify the hypothesis?
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Re: Paradoxes of time in Saint Augustine

#6  Postby tuco » Jan 29, 2019 10:38 am

What were father, son and holy spirit doing before Big Bang? Playing 3d chess.
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Re: Paradoxes of time in Saint Augustine

#7  Postby Cito di Pense » Jan 29, 2019 11:33 am

Clive Durdle wrote:try and tease out something around what nothing and infinity mean.


In general? Try philosophy, unless you're willing to apply the concepts to something specific, the way it's done in maths.

Do you or your favorite quotable just want to practice hermeneutics on the text of St. Augustine? Go straight to theology. Do not pass 'Go'. Do not collect your Templeton Prize.
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Translation by Elbert Hubbard: Do not take life too seriously. You're not going to get out of it alive.
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