Religious people are more tolerant, open-minded than atheist

Christianity, Islam, Other Religions & Belief Systems.

Moderators: Blip, DarthHelmet86

Religious people are more tolerant, open-minded than atheist

#1  Postby DoctorE » Jul 04, 2017 9:30 am

A new study has upended long-held assumptions that religious people are more closed-minded and intolerant than atheists.

The study, conducted by Dr. Filip Uzarevic, a researcher at the Catholic University of Louvain in Belgium, revealed that while atheists might consider themselves open-minded than religious folk, they are actually less tolerant of differing opinions.

“The main message of the study is that closed-mindedness is not necessarily found only among the religious,” Uzarevic told PsyPost.

Uzarevic’s analysis determined that religious believers “seem to better perceive and integrate diverging perspectives.” The study revealed, though, that the level of closed-mindedness depends on the issue at hand.

cONTINUES: http://www.theblaze.com/news/2017/07/03 ... y-reveals/
User avatar
DoctorE
THREAD STARTER
 
Posts: 11067
Age: 60
Male

Iceland (is)
Print view this post

Ads by Google


Re: Religious people are more tolerant, open-minded than atheist

#2  Postby Scot Dutchy » Jul 04, 2017 9:38 am

Of course he is going say that being a catholic researcher at a very conservative university of Leuven.
Myths in islam Women and islam Musilm opinion polls


"Religion is excellent stuff for keeping common people quiet.” — Napoleon Bonaparte
User avatar
Scot Dutchy
 
Posts: 43118
Age: 71
Male

Country: Nederland
European Union (eur)
Print view this post

Re: Religious people are more tolerant, open-minded than atheist

#3  Postby tuco » Jul 04, 2017 9:39 am

Comforting those with attention disorder I guess ;)

Yes, the level of closed-mindedness depends on the issue at hand. Too bad the issues selected for the study are behind paywall.
tuco
 
Posts: 15453

Print view this post

Re: Religious people are more tolerant, open-minded than atheist

#4  Postby zulumoose » Jul 04, 2017 9:43 am

Uzarevic’s analysis determined that religious believers “seem to better perceive and integrate diverging perspectives.” The study revealed, though, that the level of closed-mindedness depends on the issue at hand.


I'll bet it depends on the issue at hand - I'm sure the "diverging perspectives" that the religious appear to be better at integrating are those that are completely fact-free and devoid of the slightest hints of critical thinking and rational discourse.
User avatar
zulumoose
 
Posts: 3618

Country: South Africa
South Africa (za)
Print view this post

Re: Religious people are more tolerant, open-minded than atheist

#5  Postby Scot Dutchy » Jul 04, 2017 9:51 am

Look this researcher is working at the last bastion of catholicism in Flanders. It still has a priests school.
Myths in islam Women and islam Musilm opinion polls


"Religion is excellent stuff for keeping common people quiet.” — Napoleon Bonaparte
User avatar
Scot Dutchy
 
Posts: 43118
Age: 71
Male

Country: Nederland
European Union (eur)
Print view this post

Re: Religious people are more tolerant, open-minded than atheist

#6  Postby tuco » Jul 04, 2017 10:15 am

Frankly, who cares? Unless such study can be dismissed on grounds of origin, in which case there is no need to bother with it at all ie. read article or cool story, the study itself is up for scrutiny.

Which brings us to importance of issues, again. Which are more important, the fact-free or the others?
tuco
 
Posts: 15453

Print view this post

Re: Religious people are more tolerant, open-minded than atheist

#7  Postby Thomas Eshuis » Jul 04, 2017 10:26 am

The article might also be conflating open-mindedness with gullible.
"Respect for personal beliefs = "I am going to tell you all what I think of YOU, but don't dare retort and tell what you think of ME because...it's my personal belief". Hmm. A bully's charter and no mistake."
User avatar
Thomas Eshuis
 
Name: Thomas Eshuis
Posts: 30767
Age: 30
Male

Country: Netherlands
European Union (eur)
Print view this post

Ads by Google


Re: Religious people are more tolerant, open-minded than atheist

#8  Postby tuco » Jul 04, 2017 10:29 am

The article links .. the study

Are atheists undogmatic? - http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/ar ... 6917303070

Abstract
Previous theory and evidence favor the idea that religious people tend to be dogmatic to some extent whereas non-religious people are undogmatic: the former firmly hold beliefs, some of which are implausible or even contrary to the real world evidence. We conducted a further critical investigation of this idea, distinguishing three aspects of rigidity: (1) self-reported dogmatism, defined as unjustified certainty vs. not standing for any beliefs, (2) intolerance of contradiction, measured through (low) endorsement of contradictory statements, and (3) low readiness to take a different from one's own perspective, measured through the myside bias technique. Non-believers, at least in Western countries where irreligion has become normative, should be lower on the first, but higher on the other two constructs. Data collected from three countries (UK, France, and Spain, total N = 788) and comparisons between Christians, atheists, and agnostics confirmed the expectations, with agnostics being overall similar to atheists.
tuco
 
Posts: 15453

Print view this post

Re: Religious people are more tolerant, open-minded than atheist

#9  Postby I'm With Stupid » Jul 04, 2017 11:21 am

I'd be interested to know whether 'previous theory and evidence' happens to come from the USA, because let's be honest, there's often a vast difference between Christians in Europe and Christians in America.
Image
User avatar
I'm With Stupid
 
Posts: 9509
Age: 35
Male

Country: Malaysia
Jolly Roger (arr)
Print view this post

Re: Religious people are more tolerant, open-minded than atheist

#10  Postby laklak » Jul 04, 2017 2:01 pm

Yep. I'm heading out to the weekly stoning and beheading just now.
A man who carries a cat by the tail learns something he can learn in no other way. - Mark Twain
The sky is falling! The sky is falling! - Chicken Little
I never go without my dinner. No one ever does, except vegetarians and people like that - Oscar Wilde
User avatar
laklak
RS Donator
 
Name: Florida Man
Posts: 20226
Age: 66
Male

Country: The Great Satan
Swaziland (sz)
Print view this post

Re: Religious people are more tolerant, open-minded than atheist

#11  Postby Animavore » Jul 04, 2017 2:06 pm

What is this dogma atheists are holding to? It's not explained.

I'm also not sure what is wrong with intolerance of contradiction, especially if one has an evidenced based worldview. If someone has a view opposed to the facts, like creationists or climate denialism, they're simply wrong. End of story. I don't feel obliged to entertain that.

Or am I misunderstanding what is meant here?
A most evolved electron.
User avatar
Animavore
 
Name: The Scribbler
Posts: 43640
Age: 41
Male

Ireland (ie)
Print view this post

Re: Religious people are more tolerant, open-minded than atheist

#12  Postby Fenrir » Jul 04, 2017 2:14 pm

Animavore wrote:What is this dogma atheists are holding to? It's not explained.

I'm also not sure what is wrong with intolerance of contradiction, especially if one has an evidenced based worldview. If someone has a view opposed to the facts, like creationists or climate denialism, they're simply wrong. End of story. I don't feel obliged to entertain that.

Or am I misunderstanding what is meant here?


Maybe missing an equivocation between tolerating unevidenced bullshit and tolerating people. I can quite happily tolerate someones right to believe bullshit while calling out said bullshit and decrying the negative effect of said bullshit on society.

Hard to tell without getting behind that paywall and caring enough to dig into the paper.
Religion: it only fails when you test it.-Thunderf00t.
User avatar
Fenrir
 
Posts: 3511
Male

Country: Australia
South Georgia and the South Sandwich Islands (gs)
Print view this post

Re: Religious people are more tolerant, open-minded than atheist

#13  Postby Animavore » Jul 04, 2017 2:19 pm

Fenrir wrote:
Animavore wrote:What is this dogma atheists are holding to? It's not explained.

I'm also not sure what is wrong with intolerance of contradiction, especially if one has an evidenced based worldview. If someone has a view opposed to the facts, like creationists or climate denialism, they're simply wrong. End of story. I don't feel obliged to entertain that.

Or am I misunderstanding what is meant here?


Maybe missing an equivocation between tolerating unevidenced bullshit and tolerating people. I can quite happily tolerate someones right to believe bullshit while calling out said bullshit and decrying the negative effect of said bullshit on society.

Hard to tell without getting behind that paywall and caring enough to dig into the paper.


It is something to consider alright. You often hear of multi-faith discussions, which atheists are never invited to, where the religious come up with ways they more or less agree they believe in the same God through different paths.

Viewed this way, the religious would look open-minded and receptive to each other's wooly ideas, while an atheist would appear hostile to all of them.
A most evolved electron.
User avatar
Animavore
 
Name: The Scribbler
Posts: 43640
Age: 41
Male

Ireland (ie)
Print view this post

Re: Religious people are more tolerant, open-minded than atheist

#14  Postby Matthew Shute » Jul 04, 2017 2:30 pm

If by open-minded they meant open to accepting assertions without evidence, and if by tolerant they meant tolerating insults to our intelligence and outrages to rational thought, I'd say they had a point. It's not crystal clear what this means, though:

Uzarevic’s analysis determined that religious believers “seem to better perceive and integrate diverging perspectives.”


Do they mean something like... "I'm a Christian, you're a Muslim. I'm open to the idea that you really believe in your version of god, and you're open to the idea that I really believe in mine. I believe in my versions of heaven and hell, you believe in yours. I can fantasise about sitting in heaven, watching you roast in my version of hell, you can imagine sitting in paradise as I roast in yours. Yay for us! We're so open-minded and tolerant!"...?

Or something else? I'm certainly not paying $36 to find out.
"Change will preserve us. It is the lifeblood of the Isles. It will move mountains! It will mount movements!" - Sheogorath
User avatar
Matthew Shute
 
Name: Matthew Shute
Posts: 3676
Age: 41

Antarctica (aq)
Print view this post

Re: Religious people are more tolerant, open-minded than atheist

#15  Postby monkeyboy » Jul 04, 2017 3:22 pm

Animavore wrote:
Fenrir wrote:
Animavore wrote:What is this dogma atheists are holding to? It's not explained.

I'm also not sure what is wrong with intolerance of contradiction, especially if one has an evidenced based worldview. If someone has a view opposed to the facts, like creationists or climate denialism, they're simply wrong. End of story. I don't feel obliged to entertain that.

Or am I misunderstanding what is meant here?


Maybe missing an equivocation between tolerating unevidenced bullshit and tolerating people. I can quite happily tolerate someones right to believe bullshit while calling out said bullshit and decrying the negative effect of said bullshit on society.

Hard to tell without getting behind that paywall and caring enough to dig into the paper.


It is something to consider alright. You often hear of multi-faith discussions, which atheists are never invited to, where the religious come up with ways they more or less agree they believe in the same God through different paths.

Viewed this way, the religious would look open-minded and receptive to each other's wooly ideas, while an atheist would appear hostile to all of them.


Well, they're all used to squaring off the round peg of old belief and sacred texts to accommodate the knowledge available these days that clearly wasn't when the ignorant scribes did their thing. So being used to finding some common ground or wiggle room to keep their beliefs intact isn't so hard to transfer onto someone else pretty much pulling the same stunt with their beliefs.

It's a bit trickier if you either never believed any of it to start with or stopped believing it, to not simply consider all of it to be bollocks. Different faith heads are probably more tolerant of say, religious schooling (provided they're getting their own brand of wibble taught and not having another forced on them) than atheists who don't want religion taught as fact, whatever flavour.

The argument between the big Abrahamic faiths is essentially acknowledgement that they all believe in the same psychotic god character but believe everyone who doesn't kiss his arse just the way they do is doing it wrong.....but at least they're giving it a go and believe in him etc. These bloody atheists are going around suggesting that the whole bunch of them are wrong, and they're not just bickering over the odd detail like does a wafer and wine symbolise flesh and blood or actually become it or some such nonsense, they're dismissing the whole caboodle as made up nonsense, downgrading sacred "Truth" to mere mortal myth. It's the scale of the schism they're calling intolerance I think. A little detail here and there is a disagreement but to reject the whole is intolerance.

And then to not allow the religious to dictate as they used to, weilding political power and providing uncriticised education as they used to with abandon is seen as intolerant.

And then they started to insist on prosecuting child rapists publicly and wanting to jail them rather than usher them away quietly whilst trying to maintain a veneer of respectability and authority, most of all the position of the keeper of the source of ultimate morality.

Basically, not allowing them to do as they once did is intolerance to some. To be able to challenge beliefs openly without fear of punishment (as was the case when religion held the political power, and still is the case in parts of the world where it does) is intolerance apparently. The irony is not lost, nor is the incredible hubris that Catholics are whining about intolerance of their beliefs etc. The very church who were responsible for so many deaths as they persecuted anyone who did not profess to believe exactly as they demanded. The butthurt seems to boil down to, they're just having to take the criticism of their beliefs, Bible, behaviour etc on the chin and there's no protection like there used to be.

They have virtually no political power. They aren't the arbiters of what is moral any more and every paedophile exposed is another nail in that coffin, along with every state decision allowing things like abortion and gay marriage etc. People can openly question, criticise and deny the existence of god freely, they can go as far as to attack ( not physically) the church without penalty.

The atheists haven't arrived at anything close to the intolerance that the Catholic Church once had of anyone not Catholic, or the Protestants had of Catholics, or the Islamic Jihadists had of anyone not Islamic or the Jews had of the Amelekites etc yet, not even close to the ball park, not even looking for a spot in the car park, and they're whining. At least they can be confident there won't be persecutions of the religious by the Atheists, just a rejection of ideas
The Bible is full of interest. It has noble poetry in it; and some clever fables; and some blood-drenched history; and some good morals; and a wealth of obscenity; and upwards of a thousand lies.
Mark Twain
User avatar
monkeyboy
 
Posts: 5472
Male

Country: England
England (eng)
Print view this post

Ads by Google


Re: Religious people are more tolerant, open-minded than atheist

#16  Postby pelfdaddy » Jul 04, 2017 5:51 pm

Apologetics is a 24/7 enterprise. When they're "doing science apologetics", they are just cherry-picking from other peoples' hard-won data. The sociological apologetics requires them to create their own.

It matters little that the study is manipulated for a desired outcome. They are not attempting to forge a logic chain to drag us to their side, but a mooring cable to reassure believers.
pelfdaddy
 
Posts: 1022
Age: 53
Male

United States (us)
Print view this post

Re: Religious people are more tolerant, open-minded than atheist

#17  Postby tuco » Jul 04, 2017 8:50 pm

Animavore wrote:What is this dogma atheists are holding to? It's not explained.

I'm also not sure what is wrong with intolerance of contradiction, especially if one has an evidenced based worldview. If someone has a view opposed to the facts, like creationists or climate denialism, they're simply wrong. End of story. I don't feel obliged to entertain that.

Or am I misunderstanding what is meant here?


It does not say atheists are holding to any dogma. It, abstract says: in these two areas:

2) intolerance of contradiction, measured through (low) endorsement of contradictory statements, and (3) low readiness to take a different from one's own perspective, measured through the myside bias technique.


atheists scored lower according to the study. Unless we get access to the study, methodology, we can assume and speculate.

Non-believers, at least in Western countries where irreligion has become normative, should be lower on the first, but higher on the other two constructs.


Should? How come is that?
tuco
 
Posts: 15453

Print view this post

Re: Religious people are more tolerant, open-minded than atheist

#18  Postby Wortfish » Aug 07, 2017 11:33 pm

From my experience here, I would have to agree.
User avatar
Wortfish
 
Posts: 931

United Kingdom (uk)
Print view this post

Re: Religious people are more tolerant, open-minded than atheist

#19  Postby laklak » Aug 08, 2017 3:25 am

Unsupported assertion can be dismissed without explanation. This pisses off theists, because no matter how you slice it, you eventually get an unsupported assertion or two. I have never had a serious discussion with a theist that didn't eventually boil down to "you have to have faith". No, I don't. "Faith", when unsupported by evidence, is self-delusion, and I don't truck with self-delusion. I also have fairly high standards for evidence. "I feel it" or "I've seen prayer work" or (my personal favorite) "science doesn't know everything" just ain't gonna cut it. I don't actually care what anyone else thinks or believes, unless it has an impact on my life. Believe whatever you want - god, demons, devils, whatever, but when you want to pass laws based on your unsupported mythology or otherwise force it down my throat I tend to resist. If that's being closed minded then I'm happy to cop to it. If others don't like it they're free to go fuck themselves.
A man who carries a cat by the tail learns something he can learn in no other way. - Mark Twain
The sky is falling! The sky is falling! - Chicken Little
I never go without my dinner. No one ever does, except vegetarians and people like that - Oscar Wilde
User avatar
laklak
RS Donator
 
Name: Florida Man
Posts: 20226
Age: 66
Male

Country: The Great Satan
Swaziland (sz)
Print view this post

Re: Religious people are more tolerant, open-minded than atheist

#20  Postby Scot Dutchy » Aug 08, 2017 11:52 am

Always the put-downer: "You dont have faith".
Myths in islam Women and islam Musilm opinion polls


"Religion is excellent stuff for keeping common people quiet.” — Napoleon Bonaparte
User avatar
Scot Dutchy
 
Posts: 43118
Age: 71
Male

Country: Nederland
European Union (eur)
Print view this post

Next

Return to Theism

Who is online

Users viewing this topic: No registered users and 1 guest