Who Made God?

The ultimate question?

Christianity, Islam, Other Religions & Belief Systems.

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Re: Who Made God?

#1121  Postby laklak » Jun 29, 2020 10:27 pm

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Re: Who Made God?

#1122  Postby felltoearth » Jun 30, 2020 1:09 am

laklak wrote:There's a scene in Clavell's "Shogun" where two samurai are talking about Jesus. One says "Not much of a god if he allowed himself to be crucified". The other answers "I'd have taken their heads".

He really only gave up a weekend. In godland, what the fuck is that really?


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Re: Who Made God?

#1123  Postby Wortfish » Sep 24, 2020 8:15 pm

BWE wrote:
Wortfish wrote:
Newmark wrote:
Still the same error, still the same stupid mistakes. You even contradict yourself in this post. Beginningless =/= endless. You simply (still) use exceedingly naive definitions to construct an incoherent model, which you then (still) attempt to shoot down.


Oh, really? If the universe has no beginning, then it doesn't matter how far you traverse back in time, you will never reach the non-existent beginning. So you wouldr journey back in time would be endless, i.e take forever without ever coming to an end.


I see that you chose the "provide more examples of how untenable your so-called argument is" route. You have yet to substantiate why you think mathematics isn't applicable to this subject (other than the fact that it proves you wrong). But you go ahead, brave bold sir Robin, run away from answering questions, just like you always do...


Mathematics is not relevant here...because we are dealing with TIME where each moment stands in a causal relationship to the preceeding and forthcoming moment. That is why all your models of infinity are not applicable here.
Defining Time is tricksy business.


It is incredible that some people think set theory somehow makes an actual infinite a possibility.
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Re: Who Made God?

#1124  Postby Fenrir » Sep 24, 2020 10:12 pm

Wortfish wrote:
BWE wrote:
Wortfish wrote:
Newmark wrote:
Still the same error, still the same stupid mistakes. You even contradict yourself in this post. Beginningless =/= endless. You simply (still) use exceedingly naive definitions to construct an incoherent model, which you then (still) attempt to shoot down.


Oh, really? If the universe has no beginning, then it doesn't matter how far you traverse back in time, you will never reach the non-existent beginning. So you wouldr journey back in time would be endless, i.e take forever without ever coming to an end.


I see that you chose the "provide more examples of how untenable your so-called argument is" route. You have yet to substantiate why you think mathematics isn't applicable to this subject (other than the fact that it proves you wrong). But you go ahead, brave bold sir Robin, run away from answering questions, just like you always do...


Mathematics is not relevant here...because we are dealing with TIME where each moment stands in a causal relationship to the preceeding and forthcoming moment. That is why all your models of infinity are not applicable here.
Defining Time is tricksy business.


It is incredible that some people think set theory somehow makes an actual infinite a possibility.


Learning some set theory would probably be of benefit round about now.

For example:

The set of positive integers is infinite and has a beginning.

The set of integers is the very definition of the countably infinite.

As opposed to the uncountably infinite, which corresponds to the number of times Wortfish's bullshit needs to be refuted before Wortfish will notice.
Religion: it only fails when you test it.-Thunderf00t.
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Re: Who Made God?

#1125  Postby Basset Hound » Sep 29, 2020 1:01 am

A quick answer is Elvis did. Then the question comes, Who made Elvis? And who make the ones who made Elvis, and so on. It's turtles all the way down.
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Re: Who Made God?

#1126  Postby Svartalf » Sep 29, 2020 9:27 am

simple, his parents made elvis, they were made by their own parents, and you can go back to the first aggregate of cells that stopped reproducing by simple splitting.
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Re: Who Made God?

#1127  Postby Cito di Pense » Sep 29, 2020 10:25 am

Basset Hound wrote:A quick answer is Elvis did. Then the question comes, Who made Elvis? And who make the ones who made Elvis, and so on. It's turtles all the way down.


Svartalf wrote:simple, his parents made elvis, they were made by their own parents, and you can go back to the first aggregate of cells that stopped reproducing by simple splitting.


Sigh. Looks like you both conclude that answering a philosophical question is a lot more important than asking it. That's how a theist goes about it.
Хлопнут без некролога. -- Серге́й Па́влович Королёв

Translation by Elbert Hubbard: Do not take life too seriously. You're not going to get out of it alive.
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Re: Who Made God?

#1128  Postby Svartalf » Sep 29, 2020 10:37 am

Well, asking questions is nice, asking meaningless and/or unanswerable questions?
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Re: Who Made God?

#1129  Postby Fallible » Sep 29, 2020 10:54 am

Whoever made Elvis, I wish they hadn’t bothered.
She battled through in every kind of tribulation,
She revelled in adventure and imagination.
She never listened to no hater, liar,
Breaking boundaries and chasing fire.
Oh, my my! Oh my, she flies!
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Re: Who Made God?

#1130  Postby Svartalf » Sep 29, 2020 11:09 am

must admit I never cared for his music, then again, maybe I've never been in the proper context to find it interesting.
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Re: Who Made God?

#1131  Postby blindfaith » Sep 29, 2020 11:13 am

The best explanation for the absence of convincing reasons for god's existence is god's nonexistence

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Re: Who Made God?

#1132  Postby Cito di Pense » Sep 29, 2020 11:38 am

Svartalf wrote:Well, asking questions is nice, asking meaningless and/or unanswerable questions?


The theist has invented the idea of a cosmos that is the product of some intent. How it it meaningless to understand that when conversing with a theist? It's the verb in the question, rather than the grammatical subject, which gives it away. Better to ask, how did the intent develop? If you do talk to theists, start with that question, because it avoids asking about the turtles, the "who".
Хлопнут без некролога. -- Серге́й Па́влович Королёв

Translation by Elbert Hubbard: Do not take life too seriously. You're not going to get out of it alive.
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Re: Who Made God?

#1133  Postby Hermit » Sep 29, 2020 12:30 pm

Fallible wrote:Whoever made Elvis, I wish they hadn’t bothered.

He was quite a good rocker until he joined the army and lost his heart in Heidelberg.
God is the mysterious veil under which we hide our ignorance of the cause. - Léo Errera


God created the universe
God just exists
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Re: Who Made God?

#1134  Postby Fallible » Sep 29, 2020 12:49 pm

I’m just not into that stuff.
She battled through in every kind of tribulation,
She revelled in adventure and imagination.
She never listened to no hater, liar,
Breaking boundaries and chasing fire.
Oh, my my! Oh my, she flies!
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Re: Who Made God?

#1135  Postby IAMinyou » Oct 02, 2020 9:41 pm

zulumoose wrote:Just been thinking, isn't this the ultimate question to ask a theist?

The more you think about it the more it exposes the weaknesses in theism, in such a way that they have to see the weaknesses framed from their own point of view.

It ridicules their idea of complexity implying God.
It ridicules their assumption of agency.
It ridicules the assumption of a single, ultimate God.
It causes them to think about why their arguments aren't just as valid for a completely different conclusion.

Basically they cannot argue against the validity of the question without rendering their own thinking style invalid. They are forced to try and dismiss the question without reason, and then have to answer why their own arguments cannot also be dismissed without reason, or if they say there is no reason to establish the question in the first place, why is there a reason to ask whether there is any god at all?

Am I on a winner here? How can theists counter the implications of this question?


Who made God? That is a question that needs to be changed because the name God is so over-used it means a million different things like the word "FAITH" which is not the same as belief. Here are some questions to ask theists;

Who made our Creator?

Can a Creator be created?

Did a Creator come from absolutely nothing or has there always been a Creator?

Can a Creator create from nothing but thoughts?

Could a Creator create an AI system that speaks called the Voice of God?
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Re: Who Made God?

#1136  Postby Fallible » Oct 03, 2020 9:41 am

:picard:
She battled through in every kind of tribulation,
She revelled in adventure and imagination.
She never listened to no hater, liar,
Breaking boundaries and chasing fire.
Oh, my my! Oh my, she flies!
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Re: Who Made God?

#1137  Postby BlackBart » Oct 03, 2020 10:42 am

Probably simpler to call it 'Alexa'.
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Re: Who Made God?

#1138  Postby campermon » Oct 03, 2020 2:30 pm

BlackBart wrote:Probably simpler to call it 'Alexa'.


You're not taking this thread siri-ously enough. :grin:










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Re: Who Made God?

#1139  Postby SafeAsMilk » Oct 03, 2020 2:52 pm

Does the Creator have 10 toes or 12?

When the Creator makes chicken and rice for dinner, does he get so excited that he burns his mouth on the first bite?

Can the Creator explain to me how to raise the human character's class in Disgaea 2 without having to reincarnate them and start from level 1?

How often does the Creator have to dust out his computer tower?

Can even the Creator come up with a non-garbled non-self serving difference between belief and faith?

What's the Creator's favorite John Coltrane album? (I'm going with Crescent)
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