Alternative to "whose"?

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Re: Alternative to

#21  Postby Blip » Jun 26, 2011 12:14 pm

CdesignProponentsist wrote:"All the forces in the world are not so powerful as an idea whose time has come." - Victor Hugo


May I venture to correct you, CDesign? Hugo wrote in French. The original was, I understand: 'On résiste à l'invasion des armées; on ne résiste pas à l'invasion des idées.'
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Re: Alternative to "whose"?

#22  Postby Agrippina » Jun 26, 2011 12:16 pm

Show-off! :lol:
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Re: Alternative to "whose"?

#23  Postby Saim » Jul 03, 2011 6:40 am

This is a fairly old discussion, but I'd like to add something to it:

Wiktionary says that "whose" as the relative pronoun form of "which" was "formerly proscribed", meaning that "whose" was historically the "better" way of saying it. However, I think its similarity to the word "who" has caused some semantic drift in the minds of some speakers.
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Re: Alternative to "whose"?

#24  Postby Agrippina » Jul 03, 2011 7:23 am

Still if, for example, you are at a funeral (notorious for the gathering of long-lost family members), and you saw a youngster who you were unable to identity, you're more likely to say "whose child are you?" Rather than "the daughter/son of which of the deceased's children are you?" OR "Which of the adults are your parents?" "Whose" comes easier to casual speech. I think anyway.
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Re: Alternative to "whose"?

#25  Postby Blip » Jul 03, 2011 8:06 am

Saim wrote:This is a fairly old discussion, but I'd like to add something to it:

Wiktionary says that "whose" as the relative pronoun form of "which" was "formerly proscribed", meaning that "whose" was historically the "better" way of saying it. However, I think its similarity to the word "who" has caused some semantic drift in the minds of some speakers.


If the author of the Wiki says that it was 'formerly proscribed', s/he's suggesting it wasn't acceptable for 'which' and now it is. In other words, that my own stance is old-fashioned. I'd dispute that - but then I would say that, wouldn't I? :lol:
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Re: Alternative to "whose"?

#26  Postby Saim » Jul 03, 2011 8:11 am

Agrippina wrote:Still if, for example, you are at a funeral (notorious for the gathering of long-lost family members), and you saw a youngster who you were unable to identity, you're more likely to say "whose child are you?" Rather than "the daughter/son of which of the deceased's children are you?" OR "Which of the adults are your parents?" "Whose" comes easier to casual speech. I think anyway.

But that would be "of whom" and not "of which", wouldn't it?

Blip wrote:
Saim wrote:This is a fairly old discussion, but I'd like to add something to it:

Wiktionary says that "whose" as the relative pronoun form of "which" was "formerly proscribed", meaning that "whose" was historically the "better" way of saying it. However, I think its similarity to the word "who" has caused some semantic drift in the minds of some speakers.


If the author of the Wiki says that it was 'formerly proscribed', s/he's suggesting it wasn't acceptable for 'which' and now it is. In other words, that my own stance is old-fashioned. I'd dispute that - but then I would say that, wouldn't I? :lol:

I'm inclined to agree with Wiktionary. In fact, I suspect "of which" as a relative pronoun for inanimate nouns was originally a hypercorrection due to the similarity of the words "who" and "whose".
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Re: Alternative to "whose"?

#27  Postby CdesignProponentsist » Jul 12, 2011 6:34 am

Agrippina wrote: "Whose" comes easier to casual speech. I think anyway.


Which is probably the reason for its being adapted to the possessive form of which. The flow of a language sometimes trumps the logic of a language. My god! Just look at French. :think:
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Re: Alternative to "whose"?

#28  Postby Agrippina » Jul 12, 2011 7:53 am

I hate people who can speak French. And even more the people who can write it! :lol:

Sheesh, I hate people who can speak more than one language. Language is not my strong suit. Talking is. I talk far too much.
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Re: Alternative to "whose"?

#29  Postby redwhine » Sep 29, 2011 10:54 am

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sShMA85pv8M[/youtube]
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Re: Alternative to "whose"?

#30  Postby Pulsar » Sep 29, 2011 7:10 pm

Why not say

"There is a house, designed by an architect"

or

"There is a house, and its designer is an architect"

Keep it simple.
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