Surprisingly little force required to tip the planets tilt

Anything that doesn't fit anywhere else below.

Moderators: kiore, The_Metatron, Blip

Re: Surprisingly little force required to tip the planets tilt

#21  Postby Macdoc » Aug 14, 2020 8:55 pm

You need to work with something like the Saturn rocket which apparently did impact the earth in a measurable manner on lift off. For some math wonk you have the mass of earth, mass of rocket and thrust numbers.
Travel photos > https://500px.com/macdoc/galleries
EO Wilson in On Human Nature wrote:
We are not compelled to believe in biological uniformity in order to affirm human freedom and dignity.
User avatar
Macdoc
 
Posts: 17710
Age: 74
Male

Country: Canada/Australia
Australia (au)
Print view this post

Re: Surprisingly little force required to tip the planets tilt

#22  Postby Thommo » Aug 14, 2020 9:01 pm

Calculable sounds plausible. Measurable doesn't.
User avatar
Thommo
 
Posts: 27290

Print view this post

Re: Surprisingly little force required to tip the planets tilt

#23  Postby BlackBart » Aug 14, 2020 9:45 pm

But could nerd thighs alter the tilt of the Earth? :ask:
You don't crucify people! Not on Good Friday! - Harold Shand
User avatar
BlackBart
 
Name: rotten bart
Posts: 12607
Age: 59
Male

United Kingdom (uk)
Print view this post

Re: Surprisingly little force required to tip the planets tilt

#24  Postby Hermit » Aug 14, 2020 10:20 pm

laklak wrote:
Thommo wrote: or a variation on the old saw about every Chinese person jumping at once.

I heard some guy on the internet say that if every Chinese person inhaled at the same time it would use up all the oxygen in the world.

I don't know if that's true or not. What do you guys think? Could it be true?

Depends. Many people say if he came to that conclusion via a thought experiment and some back of envelope calculations, it's definitely true.
God is the mysterious veil under which we hide our ignorance of the cause. - Léo Errera


God created the universe
God just exists
User avatar
Hermit
 
Name: Cantankerous grump
Posts: 4894
Age: 69
Male

Print view this post

Re: Surprisingly little force required to tip the planets tilt

#25  Postby Macdoc » Aug 14, 2020 10:35 pm

Travel photos > https://500px.com/macdoc/galleries
EO Wilson in On Human Nature wrote:
We are not compelled to believe in biological uniformity in order to affirm human freedom and dignity.
User avatar
Macdoc
 
Posts: 17710
Age: 74
Male

Country: Canada/Australia
Australia (au)
Print view this post

Re: Surprisingly little force required to tip the planets tilt

#26  Postby Cito di Pense » Aug 14, 2020 10:44 pm

Thommo wrote:I am puzzling over how this question would *actually* be solved (obviously not with jet engines since angular momentum is conserved) though. I don't know how one goes about finding the energy needed to shift an axis of rotation.


I'd start with one of those physics lectures on gyroscopic precession demonstrating what happens when we apply a force perpendicular to the axis of rotation of a bicycle wheel. In the usual demo, that force is gravity and the axis rotates in a plane perpendicular to the direction of gravity. At least Crumple came up with "gimble". He's heard someone say the word, but then what? What else do we need? Something pronounced "tork". Hey Hey we're the Monkees.
Хлопнут без некролога. -- Серге́й Па́влович Королёв

Translation by Elbert Hubbard: Do not take life too seriously. You're not going to get out of it alive.
User avatar
Cito di Pense
 
Name: Al Forno, LLD,LDL,PPM
Posts: 30195
Age: 24
Male

Country: Nutbush City Limits
Mongolia (mn)
Print view this post

Re: Surprisingly little force required to tip the planets tilt

#27  Postby Fallible » Aug 15, 2020 12:18 am

‘Twas brillig, and the slithy toves
Did gyre and gimble in the wabe.
All mimsy were the borogroves,
And the mome raths outgrabe.
She battled through in every kind of tribulation,
She revelled in adventure and imagination.
She never listened to no hater, liar,
Breaking boundaries and chasing fire.
Oh, my my! Oh my, she flies!
User avatar
Fallible
RS Donator
 
Name: Alice Pooper
Posts: 51607
Age: 49
Female

Country: Engerland na na
Canada (ca)
Print view this post

Re: Surprisingly little force required to tip the planets tilt

#28  Postby felltoearth » Aug 15, 2020 1:21 am

Fallible wrote:‘Twas brillig, and the slithy toves
Did gyre and gimble in the wabe.
All mimsy were the borogroves,
And the mome raths outgrabe.


Love how it’s used here

"Walla Walla Bonga!" — Witticism
User avatar
felltoearth
 
Posts: 14664
Age: 54

Canada (ca)
Print view this post

Re: Surprisingly little force required to tip the planets tilt

#29  Postby laklak » Aug 15, 2020 3:03 am

I think that's exactly what God did at Jericho, slowed down the earth. That's why the walls came down, and the sun stood still in the sky. All so Joshua and his lot could genocide the shit out of the Canaanites.
A man who carries a cat by the tail learns something he can learn in no other way. - Mark Twain
The sky is falling! The sky is falling! - Chicken Little
I never go without my dinner. No one ever does, except vegetarians and people like that - Oscar Wilde
User avatar
laklak
RS Donator
 
Name: Florida Man
Posts: 20878
Age: 68
Male

Country: The Great Satan
Swaziland (sz)
Print view this post

Re: Surprisingly little force required to tip the planets tilt

#30  Postby JustStarDust » Sep 25, 2020 7:10 am

Even if possible, I will have to say 'don't do it'.

1.) It's too risky - would you trust the people in control to get the rotation correct? If it goes wrong, how do you fix it? If the machines break 1/2 through changing the tilt, what are the backup plans?

2.) It's too risky - could be hacked by terrorists, and controlled to cause havoc. Then the news will say it's a natural disaster, or all Trumps fault.

3.) It's too risky - you're messing with the entire biosphere. You would need permission from every single leader on Earth. Or it's basically an act of war.

4.) Leave Earth alone - go to another planet, and try it there 1st.

5.) Even if you do succeed in creating the perfect state for Earth, all it would take is 1 CME from the sun, to change the balance again?

6.) Don't tell Elon. He'll steal the idea.

7.) What would be the financial cost? How much heat would these jet engines produce? At the poles, of all areas.
Avoid nasty drugs.
User avatar
JustStarDust
 
Name: NotTellingYouThatSorry
Posts: 268

Country: NotTellingYouThatSorry
Marshall Island (mh)
Print view this post

Re: Surprisingly little force required to tip the planets tilt

#31  Postby Thommo » Sep 25, 2020 7:55 am

I think I felt some brain cells die when I read that. :(
User avatar
Thommo
 
Posts: 27290

Print view this post

Re: Surprisingly little force required to tip the planets tilt

#32  Postby JustStarDust » Sep 25, 2020 9:09 am

Thommo wrote:I think I felt some brain cells die when I read that. :(


Oh I'm sorry, are you taking this 'thought experiment' seriously?
Plus cells die off naturally, even brain cells.

Your jokes aren't funny.
Avoid nasty drugs.
User avatar
JustStarDust
 
Name: NotTellingYouThatSorry
Posts: 268

Country: NotTellingYouThatSorry
Marshall Island (mh)
Print view this post

Re: Surprisingly little force required to tip the planets tilt

#33  Postby Thommo » Sep 25, 2020 10:04 am

JustStarDust wrote:
Thommo wrote:I think I felt some brain cells die when I read that. :(


Oh I'm sorry, are you taking this 'thought experiment' seriously?
Plus cells die off naturally, even brain cells.

Your jokes aren't funny.


And yours were? Or are you taking it seriously?
User avatar
Thommo
 
Posts: 27290

Print view this post

Re: Surprisingly little force required to tip the planets tilt

#34  Postby Fallible » Sep 25, 2020 1:52 pm

JustStarDust wrote:
Thommo wrote:I think I felt some brain cells die when I read that. :(


Oh I'm sorry, are you taking this 'thought experiment' seriously?
Plus cells die off naturally, even brain cells.

Your jokes aren't funny.


Oh god, it’s been so nice to visit here of a morning and not have to wade through piles of your vapid, weightless shit at the end of every thread. I don’t know why that state of grace has suddenly ended, but you add nothing to this place, and arguably take something away. Thommo’s comments, on the other hand, always add something, even if it’s only another reflection of my own views, which you may have otherwise succeeded in draining the requisite mental energy from me to actually say. Why you appear to expect the people here to give you an education or watch your shit videos is anyone’s guess, but you’re fooling yourself if you think you add a thing with your empty headed bilge.
She battled through in every kind of tribulation,
She revelled in adventure and imagination.
She never listened to no hater, liar,
Breaking boundaries and chasing fire.
Oh, my my! Oh my, she flies!
User avatar
Fallible
RS Donator
 
Name: Alice Pooper
Posts: 51607
Age: 49
Female

Country: Engerland na na
Canada (ca)
Print view this post

Re: Surprisingly little force required to tip the planets tilt

#35  Postby felltoearth » Sep 25, 2020 3:35 pm

Indeed, Thommo is often a breath of fresh air and I like it when he challenges my post as it's always reasoned and fair.
"Walla Walla Bonga!" — Witticism
User avatar
felltoearth
 
Posts: 14664
Age: 54

Canada (ca)
Print view this post

Re: Surprisingly little force required to tip the planets tilt

#36  Postby Challenger007 » Oct 29, 2020 9:18 am

Thommo wrote:Jet engines move air. Air is part of the Earth. What you're proposing is changing the Earth's movement by pushing against itself, or a variation on the old saw about every Chinese person jumping at once.

Never mind the absence of showing your working (and, in fact, the answer that working supposedly arrives at) the premise itself is nonsense, there's no net change in the angular momentum from the operation of a jet engine at all, you'd need to expel air from the Earth's atmosphere altogether to have an effect.

Without actually doing the calculation myself it seems unlikely that a jet engine pumping air out of the Earth's system would put much of a dent in the 2.138×1029 J of rotational energy the Earth has anyway.


To shift the axis of the Earth, we need to launch more than one rocket. And the weight of all the Chinese is a drop in the ocean compared to the weight of the planet. So, all these theories about jumping and launching are nonsense. You need to study physics, astronomy in order to understand the logic of orbital displacement. And this also requires space flights, observation of the processes taking place on Earth from afar. Recently, I have been interested in the developments of space companies, it’s very interesting how the development of our space industry will come. The British space company is very interested, it seems a newcomer to the space exploration market, not as famous as the mastodons in this field, but the ideas are fresh. I'd like to see the results of research on the development of natural disasters. After all, nothing is taken out of the blue. There is a pattern and a combination of factors in everything.
Challenger007
 
Name: Alex Johnson
Posts: 38

Country: Illinois
United States (us)
Print view this post

Previous

Return to General Science & Technology

Who is online

Users viewing this topic: No registered users and 1 guest