When was the wheelbarrow invented in Europe?

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When was the wheelbarrow invented in Europe?

#1  Postby quas » Nov 11, 2018 2:13 pm

The current historical consensus is that, "The first wheelbarrow in Europe appeared sometime between 1170 and 1250."

Whereas the usage of chariots was already prevalent much earlier, historians say that there's evidence of chariots/wheeled carts use as early as 4th millenium BC when the humans first domesticated horses.

So why did it take so long (5000 years!) for people who already knew how to use wheeled carriages to invent the wheelbarrow?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wheelbarrow
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chariot
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Re: When was the wheelbarrow invented in Europe?

#2  Postby newolder » Nov 11, 2018 2:51 pm

Maybe the consensus is in error? :dunno: There is mention of wheelbarrows in Ancient Greece (and China) at this pinterest page.
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Re: When was the wheelbarrow invented in Europe?

#3  Postby I'm With Stupid » Nov 11, 2018 3:02 pm

If it didn't exist, presumably they had something that did the same job equally well.
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Re: When was the wheelbarrow invented in Europe?

#4  Postby newolder » Nov 11, 2018 3:07 pm

Even Fred had one, as this early daguerreotype shows:
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Re: When was the wheelbarrow invented in Europe?

#5  Postby Thomas Eshuis » Nov 11, 2018 3:16 pm

quas wrote:The current historical consensus is that, "The first wheelbarrow in Europe appeared sometime between 1170 and 1250."

Whereas the usage of chariots was already prevalent much earlier, historians say that there's evidence of chariots/wheeled carts use as early as 4th millenium BC when the humans first domesticated horses.

So why did it take so long (5000 years!) for people who already knew how to use wheeled carriages to invent the wheelbarrow?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wheelbarrow
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chariot

We don't know whether they did or did not use them before 1170, it's just that we have no direct evidence of their usage before that.
Also chariots are distinct from wheelbarrows, being that
a. They're propelled by horses, not manpower.
b. used for speed and warfare, not just transportation of goods.
c. dual, rather than solo wheeled.
Besides, you're begging the question that they were not invented, rather than just no considered practical.
Also, from your link:
However, Lewis proposes that the wheelbarrow could have also existed in ancient Greece.[9][22] Based on the Eleusis list, Lewis states that it is possible that wheelbarrows were used on Greek construction sites, but admits that archaeological evidence for the wheelbarrow in ancient farming and mining is absent.[9] He surmised that wheelbarrows were not uncommon on Greek construction sites for carrying moderately light loads. He speculates the possibility of wheelbarrows in the Roman Empire and the later Eastern Roman, or Byzantine Empire, although Lewis concludes that the evidence is scarce, and that "most of this scenario, perforce, is pure speculation."[23] The 4th century Historia Augusta reports emperor Elagabalus to have used a wheelbarrow (Latin: pabillus from pabo, one-wheeled vehicle[24][25]) to transport women in his frivolous games at court.[26] While the present evidence does not indicate any use of wheelbarrows into medieval times, the question of continuity in the Byzantine Empire is still open, due to a lack of research yet.[9] Currently, there is no archaeological evidence for the wheelbarrow in ancient Greece and Rome.
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Re: When was the wheelbarrow invented in Europe?

#6  Postby Alan B » Nov 11, 2018 5:24 pm

What did we use when building early cathedrals and forts, etc.? Are there any records?

It would seem strange if a stonemason didn't have some sort of wheeled conveyance.
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Re: When was the wheelbarrow invented in Europe?

#7  Postby Thomas Eshuis » Nov 11, 2018 6:31 pm

Alan B wrote:What did we use when building early cathedrals and forts, etc.? Are there any records?

It would seem strange if a stonemason didn't have some sort of wheeled conveyance.

Cathedrals (as in the large elaborate structures) did not appear until the end of the High-, start of the Late medieval period.Other than that horse carts were available
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Re: When was the wheelbarrow invented in Europe?

#8  Postby Fallible » Nov 11, 2018 10:00 pm

First 'how do you heat where you live', now 'when was the wheelbarrow invented in Europe?" Tune in tomorrow for 'how often do you move your bowels, and what colour is your bathroom suite? Did you do the grouting yourself, and if so, what did you apply it with, how do you keep it clean and did you go for the white or the grey?'
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Re: When was the wheelbarrow invented in Europe?

#9  Postby Thomas Eshuis » Nov 11, 2018 10:46 pm

Thomas Eshuis wrote:
Alan B wrote:What did we use when building early cathedrals and forts, etc.? Are there any records?

It would seem strange if a stonemason didn't have some sort of wheeled conveyance.

Cathedrals (as in the large elaborate structures) did not appear until the end of the High-, start of the Late medieval period.Other than that horse carts were available

Also, in some cases, construction projects did get (partially) by without using wheeled conveyances, by using porters.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Porter_(carrier)

Of which you can see an example in the series Catedral del Mar:
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Can also be seen depicted in real life on the titular Cathedral.
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Re: When was the wheelbarrow invented in Europe?

#10  Postby Alan B » Nov 12, 2018 9:42 am

Just had a thouhjt.
Traveller comes back home and sees all these porters carrying large stones. He gets the local carpenter to make this new contrivance he saw on his travels.

'Suddenly' loads of porters have lost their jobs...

:whistle:
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Re: When was the wheelbarrow invented in Europe?

#11  Postby Thomas Eshuis » Nov 12, 2018 1:29 pm

Alan B wrote:Just had a thouhjt.
Traveller comes back home and sees all these porters carrying large stones. He gets the local carpenter to make this new contrivance he saw on his travels.

'Suddenly' loads of porters have lost their jobs...

:whistle:

Not sure what your point is? :ask:
"Respect for personal beliefs = "I am going to tell you all what I think of YOU, but don't dare retort and tell what you think of ME because...it's my personal belief". Hmm. A bully's charter and no mistake."
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Re: When was the wheelbarrow invented in Europe?

#12  Postby LucidFlight » Nov 12, 2018 4:52 pm

The porter union stifled the wheelbarrow industry, possibly lobbying their local rulers to ban them by decree.
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Re: When was the wheelbarrow invented in Europe?

#13  Postby The_Piper » Nov 13, 2018 1:35 am

Stone age Trump "we're bringing back porters, clean porters!"
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Re: When was the wheelbarrow invented in Europe?

#14  Postby laklak » Nov 13, 2018 1:37 am

We got porters. The best porters Ask anybody, they'll tell you.
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