JCDenton, are you planning on coming back in here, or is this a one-post deal like your thread about depressed atheists?

Most wars, even those dressed up as "religious", are really about resources. From the first combat between rival hunter/gatherer family groups to the Nazi preaching of the need for "Lebensraum", it's always been first and foremost about resources. Religion provides a useful distracting excuse to camouflage the brutal reality that you're trying to steal the other guy's stuff.

The First World War may be an exception - or not. One historian suggested it could be called the War of the Railway Timetables. Still, those war machines were built up to protect each of the major powers' empires, and those empires were all about finding exploitable resources.

Some people need to have a look at the war on religion which took place in the USSR
Ask the Falun Dofa is anyone is at war with their religion.

Lion IRC wrote:AC Grayling's war on religion - apparantly it's vital

and Mr Dawkins makes 2

Metaphor is just something that happens to other people, isn't it, Lion?

It must surely be clear that we are talking about real war, in which real people get killed and injured, not about bruised egos and ruffled feathers.

How many churches and mosques has Grayling blown up? How many armour-piercing rounds has Dawkins expended against the infidels? No need to be exact - to the nearest 100 will do.

Lion IRC wrote:Some people need to have a look at the war on religion which took place in the USSR
Ask the Falun Dofa is anyone is at war with their religion.

Sorry, Lion, you'll have to join up those dots for me. What exactly is the point that you're making here?

Dogmatic Pyrrhonist wrote:

Ihavenofingerprints wrote:Yes Lion, secularists are at "war" (conflict) with religious fascism (in politics). Political wars/economic wars happen all the time.

Whats AC's death count so far?

Seconded.
Why is it that an atheist can say a few things against religion and they're instantly "at war" and fundamentalist and so on? Meanwhile theists generally have to get their body count into multi-digits before their considered a bit over the top.

It's a well known fact that religious folk don't get to be militant or extremist until they've actually killed or injured someone, whereas atheists and secularists get to be militant and extremist just by opening their mouths. It's one of the things that makes religion special...

Nebogipfel wrote:

Dogmatic Pyrrhonist wrote:

Ihavenofingerprints wrote:Yes Lion, secularists are at "war" (conflict) with religious fascism (in politics). Political wars/economic wars happen all the time.

Whats AC's death count so far?

Seconded.
Why is it that an atheist can say a few things against religion and they're instantly "at war" and fundamentalist and so on? Meanwhile theists generally have to get their body count into multi-digits before their considered a bit over the top.

It's a well known fact that religious folk don't get to be militant or extremist until they've actually killed or injured someone, whereas atheists and secularists get to be militant and extremist just by opening their mouths. It's one of the things that makes religion special...

I know... It does get my goat up though, and so I rant about it a fair bit. I'd propose evening up the playing field by labelling any religious person making anti-atheism statements (which would be most of them) as militant. But it would then become next to useless, because we'd just be labelling every religious person discussed as militant.

Lion IRC wrote:AC Grayling's war on religion - apparantly it's vital

Lion - did you actually read what Grayling wrote in that article?

(It's two copies of the same article - did you notice?)

Lion IRC wrote:Some people need to have a look at the war on religion which took place in the USSR
Ask the Falun Dofa is anyone is at war with their religion.

Don't you mean China?
That nation is pretty evil when it comes to protecting is government and it's Commie ideals.

Is Falun Gong a religious movement? I thought it a cross between Taoism and Tai Chi.

Lion IRC wrote:Some people need to have a look at the war on religion which took place in the USSR
Ask the Falun Dofa is anyone is at war with their religion.

Some countries have (had) laws prohibiting religion or prosecuting it. We know this. Is the carbon tax a war on carbon Lion? Are tax regulations a war on tax cheats? Yea, some "war"...

Just give up trying to equate atheism with all the terrible stuff your religion gets up to.

Onward, Christian soldiers, marching as to war,
with the cross of Jesus going on before.
Christ, the royal Master, leads against the foe;
forward into battle see his banners go!

Onward, Christian soldiers, marching as to war,
with the cross of Jesus going on before.

At the sign of triumph Satan's host doth flee;
on then, Christian soldiers, on to victory!
Hell's foundations quiver at the shout of praise;
brothers, lift your voices, loud your anthems raise.

Onward, Christian soldiers, marching as to war,
with the cross of Jesus going on before.

Like a mighty army moves the church of God;
brothers, we are treading where the saints have trod.
We are not divided, all one body we,
one in hope and doctrine, one in charity.

Onward, Christian soldiers, marching as to war,
with the cross of Jesus going on before.

Crowns and thrones may perish, kingdoms rise and wane,
but the church of Jesus constant will remain.
Gates of hell can never gainst that church prevail;
we have Christ's own promise, and that cannot fail.

Onward, Christian soldiers, marching as to war,
with the cross of Jesus going on before.

Onward then, ye people, join our happy throng,
blend with ours your voices in the triumph song.
Glory, laud, and honor unto Christ the King,
this through countless ages men and angels sing.

Onward, Christian soldiers, marching as to war,
with the cross of Jesus going on before.


-- Sabine Baring-Gould, 1865

I was just thinking about Lions claim of AC's war on religion. Lets say AC went out and killed everyone in one mega church in America, I may not like the guy after that but lets say its 5,000 people. When comparing the bodies AC is doing whole lot better on the body counts. It just goes to show if you want to get the body counts up you need some extra commitment, thats were religion comes in and gives the righteous motivation.

A war is an armed conflict between two groups. Religion has been a major cause in many.

AC Grayling and other secularists are pushing for more political activism of some sort. Some people may call this a political "war".

The two events are completely different. Yet Lion tries to equate the two. (for his own dishonest cause). It is just garbage.

It seems Lion has found more important calls on his time than backing up his vague smears and insinuations with something substantial.

Stop wasting your time here. This is a fly-by merchant.
It reminds me of someone

I think the bigger issue isn't that wars are caused by Religion, but that Religion fails to prevent the conflict fro starting or arrest the conflict if it is underway.

Not that this is an isolated issue: religion fails to prevent or stop, infection, poverty, fear, infant mortality, leprosy, pollution, debt, human rights abuses and so on and on and more importantly has failed to do this for thousands of years.