zurina wrote:

z8000783 wrote:
Did you get a chance to see the video I posted about critical thinking and scepticism? I appreciate you may wish to do more research but the fact is you are not thinking of becalming a Muslim, you are one now, so presumably you have already accepted the the Quran is the literal word of God. I am just wondering what the arguments for this are that you currently accept . There must be something that maintains your belief in Allah otherwise you would stop believing this to be true.

Ah, I have yet to see the video; busy times. I'll try to squeeze some time to watch it.

zurina wrote:On the reason why I could take the Quran as the literal word of God.. I can't really explain it in words; but I could tell why I can still maintained my belief while joining RatSkep.

I often questioned myself; if one dies doing goods after living a life of misery while another dies oppressing others yet lived a wealthy life, then where's the justice in Al-Hakem (The Judge; one of Allah's 99 names) and Al-Adl (The Just) if Heaven and Hell never exist? Since everything created (humans, djinns, Hereafter etc. etc.) by Him should have at least a purpose, then if God never exist are we just meaningless beings created out of coincidence?

zurina wrote:I prefer not to risk my whole life ending up in Hell for eternity if they truly exist as said in the Quran. If not, then at least I could die happily knowing that I've lived my life in virtuous way even it may not be perfect.

zurina wrote:
I never really intend to preach; instead I'd rather go according to one of my favorite sura:

Say : O Disbeliever! I worship not that which ye worship, Nor will ye worship that which I worship. And I will not worship that which ye have been wont to worship, Nor will ye worship that which I worship. To you be your Way, and to me mine.

zurina wrote:I'll continue believing what I wish to believe, and I won't bother others who wish to believe their own beliefs; sharing of informations won't be a problem as long as we can be decent to each other.

zurina wrote:

z8000783 wrote:No problem for me with that but if you have good wishes for people here then they would be more appreciated if they came directly from yourself rather than asking Allah to do it for you.

Haha, true enough. I'll avoid using them then.

z8000783 wrote:

zurina wrote:I prefer not to risk my whole life ending up in Hell for eternity if they truly exist as said in the Quran. If not, then at least I could die happily knowing that I've lived my life in virtuous way even it may not be perfect.

Aren’t you taking the same risk by not believing that the only way to heaven is through Jesus Christ? You will spend eternity in hell if you don’t accept that Jesus is the son of God, was crucified and then resurrected.

zurina wrote:So far I have yet to deal Islam fanatics

link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lina_Joy

Lina Joy is a Malay convert from Islam to Christianity. Born Azlina Jailani in 1964[1] in Malaysia to Muslim parents of Javanese descent,[2] she converted at age 26. In 1998, she was baptized, and applied to have her conversion legally recognized by the Malaysian courts. Though her change of name was recognized in 1999 and so noted on her identity card, her change of religion was not (since it is without the Mahkamah Syariah[3] confirmation document); for this reason, she filed suit with the High Court in 1999, bypassing the Syariah Court (Islamic court). She later filed suit with the Federal Court in 2006.[4][5] Joy hopes to live openly as a Christian; she was forced to go into hiding by the publicity surrounding her case.[6]

In a majority verdict delivered on May 30, 2007, the Federal Court rejected her appeal.[7] Her appeal was dismissed 2-1 by Chief Justice Tun Ahmad Fairuz Sheikh Abdul Halim and Datuk Alauddin Mohd Sheriff. The ruling stated that "a person who wanted to renounce his/her religion must do so according to existing laws or practices of the particular religion. Only after the person has complied with the requirements and the authorities are satisfied that the person has apostatised, can she embrace Christianity.... In other words, a person cannot, at one's whims and fancies renounce or embrace a religion."[8]

The dissenting Chief Judge of Sabah and Sarawak Datuk Richard Malanjum wrote that "Hence, in my view this is tantamount to unequal treatment under the law. In other words it is discriminatory and unconstitutional and should therefore be struck down. For this reason alone, the relief sought for by the appellant should be granted, namely for a declaration that she is entitled to have an identity card in which the word 'Islam' does not appear."[9]

Legal recognition would have allowed her to have the change of religion noted on her national identity card; it would also remove the legal barrier to her marrying her Christian fiancé (marriage between Muslim women and non-Muslim men is forbidden under Malaysian law and under the Shariah/Islamic Jurisprudence; the non-Muslim man is required to convert to Islam under Malaysian law; Under Shariah, Muslim men are only allowed to marry “people of the book,” those who believe in One God, however with conditions and restrictions). In Malaysia, the Shariah Court alone has the power to deal with Islamic issues, including legal recognition for conversion to and from Islam. Conversely, the Shariah Court has no jurisdiction over those who are not Muslims. Joy, by her own admission, is no longer Muslim, but only the Shariah Court can legally recognize this. Conversion is not something unknown, and according to Muslim Lawyers Association spokesman Pawanchek Merican, "…In Negeri Sembilan, the Shariah court allowed 16 people to renounce Islam…"[10]

According to a senior official in the National Registration Department (NRD), for the NRD to change the religion on her identity card would mean that the department would be officially declaring her an apostate, which falls under the jurisdiction of the Shariah Court.[11] The jurisdiction of the Shariah Court over converts from Islam to other religions has been hotly debated by the Malaysian public in the past few years, with this and other court cases involving converts closely followed by the media.[12] Joy is not the first person to apply for recognition of conversion from Islam; another woman named only as "Maria" by the BBC is also pursuing a similar case. In 2006, the Negeri Sembilan Syariah High Court in Seremban granted recognition for the conversion from Islam to Buddhism of Wong Ah Kiu (also known as Nyonya Tahir). However, being raised by a Chinese Buddhist family despite her Malay origins, Wong had never practiced Islam in her life and was deceased at the time of the ruling.[5][6]

Anubis wrote:If I were religious, I would expect my "God" to recognize a sincere prayer regardless of setting, posture, gestures and shit.

Juliuseizure wrote:

Anubis wrote:If I were religious, I would expect my "God" to recognize a sincere prayer regardless of setting, posture, gestures and shit.

It's about adhering to the tradition in order to glean a coherent sense of communal identity...that and fitting in at the mosque.

Juliuseizure wrote:It's about adhering to the tradition in order to glean a coherent sense of identity...that and fitting in at the mosque.