As for the supposed ignorance of the Arabs, Hellenistic thought and culture were spread throughout the Middle East all the way to India after Alexander the Great's conquests, and even though much of the Arabian peninsula remained unconquered, they surely interacted with their neighbours. Especially a trading city like Mecca.

The Islamists say something about embryology, Myers points out that then the Quran is wrong, and this is how embryos really evolve. Guess what, the Quranic text can mean that as well. What the fuck?

Reportedly, one of the Islamists is a professor at a university. Is British education going down the shit?

Do I hear Aaron Ra sporadically in the background of this?

And wtf is that alien speaking at 5.30?

Hugin wrote:Reportedly, one of the Islamists is a professor at a university. Is British education going down the shit?

Yes, but so far mostly in the university departments bought by Arab oil money. I kept waiting for PZ to challenge the pair to a beard-removing contest. His image might have been dented for a couple of months, heaven alone knows what would happen to loonies shown to be less than devout. Would they cop out, or would it just be a version of lying for Allah?

People have commented on how educated and articulate these men sounded, but I'm inclined to suspicion. I think the demonstrated nothing more than that they had memorised their shallow apologetic shtick down pat. Richard Feynman used to talk a lot about bright people who knew a lot about the surface words of a subject, but never really drew together a deep, coherent, insightful understanding of it. Nothing they said couldn't have been said by someone who had read more than a few 'Introduction to Philosophy' books. Indeed, nothing they said probably couldn't be refuted by someone who read more than a few 'introduction to philosophy' books. Look at the way they rapidly changed topics whenever Myers said anything penetrating, rather than attempting to explore and defend it with any kind of robustness. Their knowledge may be broad but it also may be spread thin. I imagine that if they had to discuss a particular issue with a contemporary pro philosopher they would soon find themselves rapidly out of their depth. I once tried to read A.C Grayling's academic work, and despite having a fairly decent amateur grasp of philosophy and history of philosophy, I had to give up after about 5 pages. Modern philosophers have moved far on from the likes of Kant, as great and essential those thinkers were.

"Are you an embryologist?"

"Yes."

Priceless.

he's just parroting what's written in the quran etc anything beyond that wont be accepted no matter if it makes sense or not,sorry for that,these muslims really have no other way of arguing since they have to believe all this stuff.

Get out of jail free card: "That's an existential question."

The Plc wrote:People have commented on how educated and articulate these men sounded, but I'm inclined to suspicion. I think the demonstrated nothing more than that they had memorised their shallow apologetic shtick down pat.

Figures. After all, many Muslims have been trained to memorise the entire koran without being able to understand a word of it.

Hugin wrote:Reportedly, one of the Islamists is a professor at a university. Is British education going down the shit?

Where have you got that from? Can you identify the Professor?

It isn't either of the two I saw.

HomerJay wrote:

Hugin wrote:Reportedly, one of the Islamists is a professor at a university. Is British education going down the shit?

Where have you got that from? Can you identify the Professor?

It isn't either of the two I saw.

According to Wikipedia, Hamza Tortzis' occupation is listed as "a Project Manager and Programme Office Manager."

The article also has this notice at top:

The topic of this article may not meet the notability guideline for biographies. Please help to establish notability by adding reliable, secondary sources about the topic. If notability cannot be established, the article is likely to be merged, redirected, or deleted.

The reputation of British academia remain unsullied.

The other guy said something about history being his "background" or something. Probably means he stays at home watching the History Channel.

Why aren't Christian young earth creationists and evolution deniers called Christianists? Islamophobia.

Shrunk wrote:

HomerJay wrote:

Hugin wrote:Reportedly, one of the Islamists is a professor at a university. Is British education going down the shit?

Where have you got that from? Can you identify the Professor?

It isn't either of the two I saw.

According to Wikipedia, Hamza Tortzis' occupation is listed as "a Project Manager and Programme Office Manager."

Yes, Tzortzis is well known as a self taught islamic apologist and self publicist. he does describe himself sometimes as a 'lecturer', in the sense that he likes lecturing people, not that he has a professional position as a lecturer.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, I would kiss PZ on the bum

this is their site islamic-education& research academy

from that site

mattwilson wrote:I've said it before and I'll say it again, I would kiss PZ on the bum

You should save your kisses for the bums of the Islamists, they looked pretty butt-hurt by the end of the video

Their site says

The team have also prepared and written a leaflet specific for the conference entitled "Do we have good reasons to believe?" which highlights how science and rational thinking leads to Islam.

Funny that - I thought they spent all their time saying that science stems from their koran. Anyway, talk about wishful thinking!

haha,the video says that richard dawkins declined to debate with hamza andreas tzortzis and called him a fuck wit but nonetheless when dawkins left the conference hamza managed to have some words with him at 32.47on the vid

SafeAsMilk wrote:

mattwilson wrote:I've said it before and I'll say it again, I would kiss PZ on the bum

You should save your kisses for the bums of the Islamists, they looked pretty butt-hurt by the end of the video

No they didn't. They looked defiantly, obliviously victorious. It was a great, but depressing, exhibition of Morton's Demon at work.

"The Quran says that, in the embryo, bone is formed first, then muscle, then flesh."

"Well, then, the Quran is wrong. I'm an embryologist and I know they all form simultaneously."

"Then the Quran is correct! It says, linguistically, that they all form simultaneously! Alhamdulillah!"

How do you argue with someone whose brain is malfunctioning like that?

Shrunk wrote:

SafeAsMilk wrote:

mattwilson wrote:I've said it before and I'll say it again, I would kiss PZ on the bum

You should save your kisses for the bums of the Islamists, they looked pretty butt-hurt by the end of the video

No they didn't. They looked defiantly, obliviously victorious. It was a great, but depressing, exhibition of Morton's Demon at work.

"The Quran says that, in the embryo, bone is formed first, then muscle, then flesh."

"Well, then, the Quran is wrong. I'm an embryologist and I know they all form simultaneously."

"Then the Quran is correct! It says, linguistically, that they all form simultaneously! Alhamdulillah!"

How do you argue with someone whose brain is malfunctioning like that?

Whatever is true, the Quran says so. Except for evolution, which is not really true. Or something.