In addition to the 'good guy with a gun' bollocks and the 'resist government tyranny' bullshit that gets trotted out there is another aspect to 2nd amendment rights that doesn't get mentioned by the gun rights brigade. Namely, if there is widespread gun ownership, then the police have to take into account that anyone they may interact with might be armed. This gives the police the ability to turn every traffic stop/ door knock for a noise complaint/ juvenile shoplifter fleeing with a packet of Oreos into a guns out, 'Don't fucking' move. Show me your hands' type interaction.

In my trips to the US I am always surprised and often a bit unsettled by the police I see. Seeing them lounging about in diners, leaning on the hood of their cars drinking a coffee, and generally behaving in a casual way does not sit right with me. Uniformed men and women carrying firearms openly should behave in a very professional and detached way, not like a bunch of guys on a smoke break from a cubicle job.

It seems ironic to me that the 'cold dead hands' rhetoric enables a militarized and often designedly intimidating police force to place itself in the heart of civil life.

well actually...
„we need good guys with guns to stop bad guys with guns“
implies that cops aren’t good guys with guns (capable of stopping bad guys with guns)

Agi Hammerthief wrote:well actually...
„we need good guys with guns to stop bad guys with guns“
implies that cops aren’t good guys with guns (capable of stopping bad guys with guns)

But cops can't be everywhere !

aban57 wrote:

Agi Hammerthief wrote:well actually...
„we need good guys with guns to stop bad guys with guns“
implies that cops aren’t good guys with guns (capable of stopping bad guys with guns)

But cops can't be everywhere !

yeah, but see the comic I linked to the other page.

I never thought of the ‘cops lounging about’ thing before, I think mainly because I’ve only been to the US as a child and hadn’t noticed, but yes, that strikes me as a difference between them there and here in the UK. I e never seen cops lounging about here. Maybe because there’s a shortage. Whenever I see police, they do seem to be comporting themselves in a certain ‘I’m on duty’ fashion, and they don’t have the guns. But then I guess when guns are a matter of everyday life, it can be easy to get casual about them. On the rare occasions when I’ve seen police here with guns, I have a real sense of ‘eek, things are serious’. If I had my own casual pistol in my handbag, I doubt the impact would be the same.

The_Metatron wrote:

Agi Hammerthief wrote:well actually...
„we need good guys with guns to stop bad guys with guns“
implies that cops aren’t good guys with guns (capable of stopping bad guys with guns)

You should understand police in this country have no duty to protect citizens.

Cops, as it turns out, aren't good guys here.

yeah, I heared about the court ruling that basically demoted „to serve and protect“ to a marketing slogan.

The_Metatron wrote:
Cops, as it turns out, aren't good guys here.

Nope, they're not. In general, I mean. I've met a few good ones, and the very few interactions I've had with them were polite, businesslike, and not a problem. BUT - here's a Helpful Hint for anyone thinking about visiting - you have a right to remain silent. Fucking use it. You have a right to an attorney. Fucking use it.

I'll add that you have a right to keep and bear arms. I fucking use it regularly, YMMV.

Agi Hammerthief wrote:well actually...
„we need good guys with guns to stop bad guys with guns“
implies that cops aren’t good guys with guns (capable of stopping bad guys with guns)

My trust in copes being good guys is about equivalent to my trust in the truthfulness of used car salesmen...

Svartalf wrote:

Agi Hammerthief wrote:well actually...
„we need good guys with guns to stop bad guys with guns“
implies that cops aren’t good guys with guns (capable of stopping bad guys with guns)

My trust in copes being good guys is about equivalent to my trust in the truthfulness of used car salesmen...

If'n you cain't ignore 'em, dey's sump'n wrong, may not be yo' fault. Don't fight da cops. Change da law. Cain't change da law? Welcome to da real world.

Um.

The_Metatron wrote:
Cops, as it turns out, aren't good guys here.

I imagine that the cops themselves may argue with that. Just as UK police will argue against similar suggestions here.