Another Police Shooting Of An Unarmed Black Man.

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Re: Another Police Shooting Of An Unarmed Black Man.

#81  Postby HughMcB » Apr 10, 2015 4:28 pm

Jerome Da Gnome wrote:The good news is there has been a huge movement over the past couple of generations in which blacks are not any longer believing the lies told to them by liberals.

Oh this is going to be good. :popcorn:

Jerome Da Gnome wrote:Lies such as, that society is out to get them and they can't succeed, and their falters are due in no part to their individual abilities and choices. The self fulling prophecy propaganda is falling apart.

So their falters are due to their individual abilities and choices? And nothing else?

Jerome Da Gnome wrote:We no longer believe it, go find some other group to feel superior to.

Lol. Now we're really trolling rolling. :drunk:

Jerome Da Gnome wrote:Black people no longer believe the liberal lie that they need whitey to help them.

Who told them that?

Jerome Da Gnome wrote:Pompous liberal white assholes always putting themselves in the position of savior for the inferior black race.

Who said they were inferior? And who said they need saving? They need understanding, and for us to get the fuck out of their way.

Jerome Da Gnome wrote:They can deny their racism all they want, twisting their racism is not racism because they define people by race, but the fact remains their words demonstrate exactly what they are.

Oh what a joyous world you live in. Where whites who highlight institutionalized racism against blacks are racist, and saying that blacks faltering is due to their own individual abilities and choices is not racist. :lol:
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Re: Another Police Shooting Of An Unarmed Black Man.

#82  Postby Warren Dew » Apr 10, 2015 4:36 pm

Teague wrote:
Warren Dew wrote:
Actually, more whites get killed by police than blacks. It's just that when a white person gets killed by police, it doesn't make the national news. The problem is not race specific; it's a general issue with police getting away with murder.

Really?

Even when you account for the fact that blacks make up 13% of the population in the US?

When you also account for the fact that those 13% commit about as much violent crime as the 60% or whatever that are white, yes.
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Re: Another Police Shooting Of An Unarmed Black Man.

#83  Postby Teague » Apr 10, 2015 4:46 pm

Michael Slager Had History Of Violence Against Black People


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Re: Another Police Shooting Of An Unarmed Black Man.

#84  Postby Willie71 » Apr 10, 2015 4:57 pm

Warren Dew wrote:
Teague wrote:
Warren Dew wrote:
Actually, more whites get killed by police than blacks. It's just that when a white person gets killed by police, it doesn't make the national news. The problem is not race specific; it's a general issue with police getting away with murder.

Really?

Even when you account for the fact that blacks make up 13% of the population in the US?

When you also account for the fact that those 13% commit about as much violent crime as the 60% or whatever that are white, yes.


And those stats come from police arrest records, don't they? How many examples of 'resisting arrest" or other nonsense trumped up charges skew the national statistics. The Ferguson report showed convictions in spite of clear evidence to drop charges. Maybe, just maybe, the police have skewed those results by overcharging blacks, and undercharging whites?

After the Ferguson report, and the hundreds of video recordings of police brutality against blacks people would start questioning their beliefs, but that doesn't seem to be happening. It's a sad day.
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Re: Another Police Shooting Of An Unarmed Black Man.

#85  Postby Teague » Apr 10, 2015 4:58 pm

Warren Dew wrote:
Teague wrote:
Warren Dew wrote:
Actually, more whites get killed by police than blacks. It's just that when a white person gets killed by police, it doesn't make the national news. The problem is not race specific; it's a general issue with police getting away with murder.

Really?

Even when you account for the fact that blacks make up 13% of the population in the US?

When you also account for the fact that those 13% commit about as much violent crime as the 60% or whatever that are white, yes.


You didn't just go there..... :doh:
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Re: Another Police Shooting Of An Unarmed Black Man.

#86  Postby Warren Dew » Apr 10, 2015 5:05 pm

HughMcB wrote:So yes, police shoot unarmed white people, they shoot unarmed fat people, and tall people, and people named Frank. But have the police been demonstrably shown to shoot the aforementioned groups BECAUSE of those defining features and preconceptions based thereon? Or are you just trotting out the tired old canard of "won't somebody please think of the white people".

The evidence is that police are 25 times more likely to shoot an unarmed white person than to shoot an unarmed black person in the same circumstances:

http://www.infowars.com/shock-study-cop ... an-whites/

If there is institutionalized racism in police shootings, it is against whites, not blacks. Individual policement might do the opposite, of course, but individual cases say nothing about the institutional bias.
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Re: Another Police Shooting Of An Unarmed Black Man.

#87  Postby Warren Dew » Apr 10, 2015 5:07 pm

Teague wrote:
Warren Dew wrote:
Teague wrote:
Warren Dew wrote:
Actually, more whites get killed by police than blacks. It's just that when a white person gets killed by police, it doesn't make the national news. The problem is not race specific; it's a general issue with police getting away with murder.

Really?

Even when you account for the fact that blacks make up 13% of the population in the US?

When you also account for the fact that those 13% commit about as much violent crime as the 60% or whatever that are white, yes.

You didn't just go there..... :doh:

Hey, you went there first in explaining why men get shot more by police than women do.
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Re: Another Police Shooting Of An Unarmed Black Man.

#88  Postby Blood » Apr 10, 2015 11:44 pm

Jerome Da Gnome wrote:Ohh good, a bunch of opinion articles on how viewing people as individuals as opposed to their race is racist.

The liberal mind is a wondrous thing.

The good news is there has been a huge movement over the past couple of generations in which blacks are not any longer believing the lies told to them by liberals. Lies such as, that society is out to get them and they can't succeed, and their falters are due in no part to their individual abilities and choices. The self fulling prophecy propaganda is falling apart. We no longer believe it, go find some other group to feel superior to.

Black people no longer believe the liberal lie that they need whitey to help them.

Pompous liberal white assholes always putting themselves in the position of savior for the inferior black race.

They can deny their racism all they want, twisting their racism is not racism because they define people by race, but the fact remains their words demonstrate exactly what they are.



You are so right. American Conservatives just love black people. They would never lie to them, because their hearts are so pure and the brotherhood of mankind is their mantra. :lol:
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Re: Another Police Shooting Of An Unarmed Black Man.

#89  Postby Blood » Apr 10, 2015 11:45 pm

Warren Dew wrote:
HughMcB wrote:So yes, police shoot unarmed white people, they shoot unarmed fat people, and tall people, and people named Frank. But have the police been demonstrably shown to shoot the aforementioned groups BECAUSE of those defining features and preconceptions based thereon? Or are you just trotting out the tired old canard of "won't somebody please think of the white people".

The evidence is that police are 25 times more likely to shoot an unarmed white person than to shoot an unarmed black person in the same circumstances:

http://www.infowars.com/shock-study-cop ... an-whites/

If there is institutionalized racism in police shootings, it is against whites, not blacks. Individual policement might do the opposite, of course, but individual cases say nothing about the institutional bias.


Ah, quoting the Alex Jones website. Always the most reliable source. :lol:
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Re: Another Police Shooting Of An Unarmed Black Man.

#90  Postby Willie71 » Apr 11, 2015 12:08 am

Whoops, wrong data.
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Re: Another Police Shooting Of An Unarmed Black Man.

#91  Postby Jerome Da Gnome » Apr 11, 2015 12:12 am

Willie71 wrote:This is from the FBI.

http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/cr ... micidemain
It seems that over half of the people killed by the cops were black, in spite of being less than 20% of the population.


It doesn't give the race of the person killed in a justified homicide.

Law enforcement reported 720 justifiable homicides in 2012. Of those, law enforcement officers justifiably killed 410 felons, and private citizens justifiably killed 310 people during the commission of crimes. (See Expanded Homicide Data Tables 14 and 15.)
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Re: Another Police Shooting Of An Unarmed Black Man.

#92  Postby Briton » Apr 11, 2015 9:09 am

This latest killing would no doubt have been classified as a justifiable homicide if the incident hadn't been videoed.
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Re: Another Police Shooting Of An Unarmed Black Man.

#93  Postby Jerome Da Gnome » Apr 11, 2015 10:57 am

That is why those are the appropriate stats to look at.
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Re: Another Police Shooting Of An Unarmed Black Man.

#94  Postby OlivierK » Apr 11, 2015 11:44 pm

Jerome Da Gnome wrote:Ever notice how people from predominately white countries always seem to view such things in terms of race.

No, I haven't noticed that. On the contrary, the US is the only country I know where political opinion polls are broken down with crosstabs by race, for example.

On the broader question, fivethirtyeight has had a look at the data here: http://fivethirtyeight.com/datalab/blac ... d-the-u-s/
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Re: Another Police Shooting Of An Unarmed Black Man.

#95  Postby Nicko » Apr 13, 2015 9:02 am

Warren Dew wrote:Hey, you went there first in explaining why men get shot more by police than women do.


Where did Teague do this?
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Re: Another Police Shooting Of An Unarmed Black Man.

#96  Postby Teague » Apr 13, 2015 9:30 am

Warren Dew wrote:
HughMcB wrote:So yes, police shoot unarmed white people, they shoot unarmed fat people, and tall people, and people named Frank. But have the police been demonstrably shown to shoot the aforementioned groups BECAUSE of those defining features and preconceptions based thereon? Or are you just trotting out the tired old canard of "won't somebody please think of the white people".

The evidence is that police are 25 times more likely to shoot an unarmed white person than to shoot an unarmed black person in the same circumstances:

http://www.infowars.com/shock-study-cop ... an-whites/

If there is institutionalized racism in police shootings, it is against whites, not blacks. Individual policement might do the opposite, of course, but individual cases say nothing about the institutional bias.


Not only do we not know the racial breakdown of police homicides, we don’t know with any precision how many homicides occur, period.

The F.B.I.’s Uniform Crime Reporting Program tabulates deaths at the hands of police officers. So does the National Center for Health Statistics. So does the Bureau of Justice Statistics. But the totals can vary wildly.

By the F.B.I.’s figures, there were between 378 and 414 police homicides in the five years ending in 2012, the most recent year available. Those numbers, however, include only justifiable homicides without reference to race; mistaken or unjustified killings are not reported. Years of academic research indicate that the actual total is considerably higher.

A 2012 study by David A. Klinger, a former police officer and professor of criminology at the University of Missouri-St. Louis, compared 13 years of internal reports on homicides by Los Angeles police officers and sheriffs’ deputies with the figures published by the F.B.I. The result: the 184 homicides reported by the F.B.I. were 46 percent fewer than the 340 logged by the departments themselves.



Studies have long concluded that police killings are more common in cities with more violent crime and larger minority populations, yet some researchers have found no positive association between race and killings. Others, however, have concluded that fewer black suspects were killed in cities with black mayors, and, in one city, that blacks made up a greater share of police homicide victims than of arrests overall.

But all those studies used the government’s imperfect data and measured only homicides, excluding the greater number of shootings in which suspects survived. A more comprehensive analysis exists: Dr. Klinger and Dr. Rosenfeld, among others, examined all 230 instances over 10 years in which officers of the St. Louis police fired their weapons (the city’s police, in contrast to the police in Ferguson involved in Mr. Brown’s shooting).
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Their conclusions, presented last November at the American Society of Criminology’s annual meeting, were striking. Officers hit their targets in about half of the 230 incidents; in about one-sixth, suspects died. Of the 360 suspects whose race could be identified — some fled before being seen clearly — more than 90 percent were African-American.

But most interesting, perhaps, was the race of the officers who fired their weapons. About two-thirds were white, and one-third black — effectively identical to the racial composition of the St. Louis Police Department as a whole. In this study, at least, firing at a black suspect was an equal-opportunity decision.

In laboratory experiments, meanwhile, subjects who see pictures or videos of threatening activity, and then punch “shoot” or “don’t shoot” buttons befitting their evaluations of the threat, consistently “shoot” black suspects more often than white ones.

But a different experiment last year at Washington State University in Spokane suggested that the opposite might be true: In realistic simulations of confrontations, subjects armed with laser-firing pistols acted in ways that left black suspects less likely to be shot at — not more.

The experiment’s 102 subjects, a mixture of police officers, combat veterans and civilians, were run through a random sample of 60 scenarios drawn from actual police encounters. The scenarios, using white, black and Hispanic actors, were projected in life-size high-definition video on laboratory screens.

Whether officers, veterans or civilians, the subjects consistently hesitated longer before firing at black suspects and were much more likely to mistakenly shoot an unarmed white suspect, the researchers found. And when they failed to fire at an armed suspect — a potentially fatal mistake — the suspect was about five times more likely to be black than white. The study’s 36 police officers were the lone exception in failing to fire: The suspect’s race wasn’t a factor in their decision not to shoot. “The findings were very unexpected given the previous experimental research,” said Lois James, an assistant professor who conducted the research.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/08/31/sunda ... -more.html


That's just one study which is inconclusive. The real shocker here though is the lack of reporting! Cops in the US can kill someone and then not even report it to the Feds? I mean wtf? It seems even when they make their report, it doesn't go into a national database at all.

The study doesn't say anything really because in the study, people know they're being watched. How many people in another study "plant" evidence after murdering a guy? I bet they'd all press the button not to "shoot in the back" - it's different when you're being watched. The only way to get reliable data is for all homicides by police need to be reported and put into a national database - it's quite shocking that this isn't already being done, isn't it?

Considering other races make up 87% of the population, I'd expect a much higher percentage of other races killed by police, like 87% worth - do you think that's how it would be represented if we had national stats?
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Re: Another Police Shooting Of An Unarmed Black Man.

#97  Postby Teague » Apr 13, 2015 11:06 am

Previous attempts to analyze racial bias in police shootings have arrived at similar conclusions. In 2007, ColorLines and the Chicago Reporter investigated fatal police shootings in 10 major cities, and found that there were a disproportionately high number of African Americans among police shooting victims in every one, particularly in New York, San Diego, and Las Vegas.

http://mjdwcharts.s3.amazonaws.com/sSwtw/6/fs.html - (chart - I can't put here as not an image)

Image


http://www.motherjones.com/politics/201 ... -black-men
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Re: Another Police Shooting Of An Unarmed Black Man.

#98  Postby Teague » Apr 13, 2015 2:37 pm

And here come fox blaming the black guy..... :roll:






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Re: Another Police Shooting Of An Unarmed Black Man.

#99  Postby Sendraks » Apr 13, 2015 2:40 pm

It's not racism though, right. Only us white folks in Europe are racists, right?
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Re: Another Police Shooting Of An Unarmed Black Man.

#100  Postby HughMcB » Apr 13, 2015 3:04 pm

Don't know who said that. Oh wait, no one did.
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