Democrat Watch

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Re: Democrat Watch

#1021  Postby willhud9 » Feb 21, 2020 11:31 pm

Seabass wrote:
willhud9 wrote: :roll:
It’s people like Dodo that make me not want to vote for Bernie.

This is like when Trumpists say they support Trump because of the SJWs or the PC crowd or whatever. Vote for Bernard or don't, but don't blame his supporters for your actions.


Truth be told, its either Sanders or Warren for me at this point. I vote March 3rd and Ill most likely be voting for Sanders.

But by god, it annoys me when fellow progressives act sanctimonious whenever someone does not line their exact feelings up with their cause. You say I sounded like a Trumpist but progressives act worse than conservatives whenever someone disagrees with them.

Case in point: My home state just passed a sweeping array of progressive to moderate legislation due to the fact we voted last November and switched our state legislative to a majority Democratic representation. It's felt great to see codified into law anti-LGBT discrimination policy protecting us from a SCOTUS ruling that could overturn what current federal protections we have. I know at least in Virginia, I am safe to be gay in case the federal government ceases to recognize that as a protection.

Yet, despite all that success, their is a vocal group of progressive calling for Northam to retire. Despite the fact that Virginia has seen one of the most progressive budgets in ages and just narrowly failed passing an assault rifles ban. It is that subset of my peers who frustrate me because they step in the way of progress so many times.

The more I read up on the subject we need bold and innovate ideas to counter Trump. But seeing all my fellow progressive friends on social media continuously call for Northam and Fairfax to resign just makes me resent them.

It is similar feelings I have for the Bernie Sanders fandom. It just feels so arrogant and fake, that it makes me resent the whole thing. The whole political process. Not Sanders, but just the idea of voting and staying informed.

So yes, I roll my eyes at Dodo. No, his demeanor won't actually stop me from voting or effect my actions, but it sure does sour any enthusiasm I may have had.
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Re: Democrat Watch

#1022  Postby Spinozasgalt » Feb 21, 2020 11:34 pm

willhud9 wrote: :roll:

It’s people like Dodo that make me not want to vote for Bernie.

Maybe look at it this way. If you put them in power based on their promises to get better healthcare, etc, then they either succeed and get you better healthcare or they fail and you never have to hear about the Sanders revolution again.

Win-win! :awesome:

(I know things are much more complicated than that.)
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Re: Democrat Watch

#1023  Postby Macdoc » Feb 22, 2020 5:41 am

She got him ...

Democratic presidential hopeful Michael Bloomberg has bowed to pressure to release former female employees from non-disclosure agreements (NDAs).
He said his company was prepared to void three NDAs "with women to address complaints about comments they said I had made".
His Democratic White House rivals have been pounding away at him on the issue.
Critics of NDAs argue these legal gag orders on employees serve to cover up workplace misconduct.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-51593293

Warren 1, Bloomberg 0 :coffee:
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Re: Democrat Watch

#1024  Postby Hermit » Feb 22, 2020 6:53 am

WayOfTheDodo wrote:As expected, evidence is never presented. Rather, endless accusations and smears with zero substance. Zero actual data showing that Bernie supporters are somehow worse than anyone else.

Um...

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Re: Democrat Watch

#1025  Postby felltoearth » Feb 22, 2020 6:28 pm

What that poll shows to me is that Sanders (and Yang for that matter) supporters are the “soft Dem” vote that they need to win.
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Re: Democrat Watch

#1026  Postby SafeAsMilk » Feb 22, 2020 6:41 pm

How do you win over the "my way or the highway" crowd?
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Re: Democrat Watch

#1027  Postby laklak » Feb 22, 2020 6:59 pm

Show them the highway's final destination?
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Re: Democrat Watch

#1028  Postby felltoearth » Feb 22, 2020 8:43 pm

SafeAsMilk wrote:How do you win over the "my way or the highway" crowd?

Stop nominating the billionaire friendly? Offer UHC as a policy plank? Cheaper or free education? Note the Sanders “It depends” percentage is higher than “No.”
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Re: Democrat Watch

#1029  Postby Seabass » Feb 22, 2020 8:53 pm

felltoearth wrote:Note the Sanders “It depends” percentage is higher than “No.”

Yep. I can't really blame people for not wanting to vote for Bloomberg. He is a racist, right-wing, billionaire, authoritarian Republican after all... which is EXACTLY what we're trying to get rid of FFS... :facepalm:


eta: having said that, as awful as Bloomberg is, I'd still rather have him than Trump. My sense is that most of the Bernie or bust crowd are white people who can survive another four years of Trump...
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Re: Democrat Watch

#1030  Postby theropod_V_2.0 » Feb 22, 2020 9:02 pm

3? 3 of how many? Wow, and there’s not a chance in hell Mike didn’t up the payoff for these 3? It’s all or none if he wants to get past this. Without that complete release of all from the NDA’s it’s a bad joke to pick and choose, and will effectively end his chances. If he releases all the NDA signatories his chances drop past the event horizon.

I found his fake Obama endorsement commercials enough to sour me on the guy. Note those no longer run.

I suspect the DNC to pull some dirty shit at the convention. It’s what they do. For some reason the DNC just can’t tolerate the idea of an FDR style liberal being the nominee.

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Re: Democrat Watch

#1031  Postby felltoearth » Feb 22, 2020 9:10 pm

One thing to note, those will be the “best” three.
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Re: Democrat Watch

#1032  Postby OlivierK » Feb 22, 2020 10:15 pm

Not voting for the Democratic candidate when the alternative is Trump is deeply immature. That poll is a good measure of the immaturity of each candidate's base, in my opinion.

I loathe Bloomberg as a Democratic candidate (if he had balls, he'd be running for the Republican nomination, given his policies), but I'd still hold my nose and vote for him if the choice came down to him or Trump, were I an American, even though I'd far, far, far, far prefer to see Warren get the nom.

On Bloomberg, I think Warren was smart to say up-front that his participation in the last debate would allow Democrats to see how their candidates would deal with an arrogant billionaire like Trump. That she backed up those fighting words by reducing Bloomberg to a stuttering mess should be reassuring to those who worry about she'd go head to head with Trump in the general election.

On that score, Warren and Sanders are far ahead of the others to me, because they both have the thick-skinned, "no fucks to give" approach required, as well as better policy sets. Klobuchar and Biden would be roadkill, and Buttigieg could do OK, but only by completely refusing to engage and just running his own race.
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Re: Democrat Watch

#1033  Postby WayOfTheDodo » Feb 23, 2020 1:28 am

willhud9 wrote::roll:

It’s people like Dodo that make me not want to vote for Bernie.

Great reason for not wanting poor people to get healthcare.

willhud9 wrote:It is similar feelings I have for the Bernie Sanders fandom. It just feels so arrogant and fake, that it makes me resent the whole thing. The whole political process. Not Sanders, but just the idea of voting and staying informed.

So yes, I roll my eyes at Dodo. No, his demeanor won't actually stop me from voting or effect my actions, but it sure does sour any enthusiasm I may have had.

That's a pretty shitty take. There's no Bernie "fandom". People are fucking desperate. He's the only one who has the policies to set things right, and the willingness and ability to actually fight for those policies. It's not about Bernie, it's about the policies and the way he will fight for those policies.

This is basically the only chance Americans have to elect a president who will actually try to do something, and who isn't easily controlled like Warren is (notice how her campaign tanked when she decided to bring Obama/Clinton people in?).
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Re: Democrat Watch

#1034  Postby WayOfTheDodo » Feb 23, 2020 1:30 am

laklak wrote:It's Bernie that makes me not want to vote for Bernie.

What about him is it that makes you not want to vote for him?


OlivierK wrote:I loathe Bloomberg as a Democratic candidate (if he had balls, he'd be running for the Republican nomination, given his policies), but I'd still hold my nose and vote for him if the choice came down to him or Trump, were I an American, even though I'd far, far, far, far prefer to see Warren get the nom.

The problem is that Bloomberg and Trump are both racist, sexist abusers, but Bloomberg is a capable racist, sexist abuser. He would be able to get far more done than Trump is able to - that is, he would be able to do far more damage.
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Re: Democrat Watch

#1035  Postby WayOfTheDodo » Feb 23, 2020 1:31 am

Spinozasgalt wrote:
willhud9 wrote: :roll:

It’s people like Dodo that make me not want to vote for Bernie.

Maybe look at it this way. If you put them in power based on their promises to get better healthcare, etc, then they either succeed and get you better healthcare or they fail and you never have to hear about the Sanders revolution again.

Win-win! :awesome:

(I know things are much more complicated than that.)

This is what's so disgusting about the whole thing. Privileged people who have nothing on the line are free to ridicule people who are struggling to put food on the table, or are going bankrupt or even dying because of the broken healthcare system in the US. The "I have mine, so fuck you" attitude is truly vile.
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Re: Democrat Watch

#1036  Postby WayOfTheDodo » Feb 23, 2020 1:31 am

Hermit wrote:
WayOfTheDodo wrote:As expected, evidence is never presented. Rather, endless accusations and smears with zero substance. Zero actual data showing that Bernie supporters are somehow worse than anyone else.

Um...

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So is this supposed to "prove" that 16% of Sanders voters are mean on Twitter?
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Re: Democrat Watch

#1037  Postby Spinozasgalt » Feb 23, 2020 1:46 am

OlivierK wrote:On that score, Warren and Sanders are far ahead of the others to me, because they both have the thick-skinned, "no fucks to give" approach required, as well as better policy sets. Klobuchar and Biden would be roadkill, and Buttigieg could do OK, but only by completely refusing to engage and just running his own race.

I have trouble even imagining Klobuchar against Trump. I guess you'd get that sort of trembling lip and "standing up for America" thing. Sanders isn't as quick as Warren, but what he does really well is stay on message even when people try to sidetrack him.
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Re: Democrat Watch

#1038  Postby Spinozasgalt » Feb 23, 2020 2:30 am

WayOfTheDodo wrote:
Spinozasgalt wrote:
willhud9 wrote: :roll:

It’s people like Dodo that make me not want to vote for Bernie.

Maybe look at it this way. If you put them in power based on their promises to get better healthcare, etc, then they either succeed and get you better healthcare or they fail and you never have to hear about the Sanders revolution again.

Win-win! :awesome:

(I know things are much more complicated than that.)

This is what's so disgusting about the whole thing. Privileged people who have nothing on the line are free to ridicule people who are struggling to put food on the table, or are going bankrupt or even dying because of the broken healthcare system in the US. The "I have mine, so fuck you" attitude is truly vile.

Indeed. I think you'd agree then that well off people like the guy below, with listeners numbering in the "hundreds of thousands", should do better than to threaten not to show up unless they get their way with Sanders. If so, then we agree on something.
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Re: Democrat Watch

#1039  Postby willhud9 » Feb 23, 2020 2:53 am

WayOfTheDodo wrote:
willhud9 wrote::roll:

It’s people like Dodo that make me not want to vote for Bernie.

Great reason for not wanting poor people to get healthcare.


That's a strawman.

willhud9 wrote:It is similar feelings I have for the Bernie Sanders fandom. It just feels so arrogant and fake, that it makes me resent the whole thing. The whole political process. Not Sanders, but just the idea of voting and staying informed.

So yes, I roll my eyes at Dodo. No, his demeanor won't actually stop me from voting or effect my actions, but it sure does sour any enthusiasm I may have had.

That's a pretty shitty take. There's no Bernie "fandom". People are fucking desperate. He's the only one who has the policies to set things right, and the willingness and ability to actually fight for those policies. It's not about Bernie, it's about the policies and the way he will fight for those policies.


That's an opinion.

This is basically the only chance Americans have to elect a president who will actually try to do something, and who isn't easily controlled like Warren is (notice how her campaign tanked when she decided to bring Obama/Clinton people in?).


This is a dumb assertion.

The other reality is Sanders wins. In 2021, the US economy hits a recession/depression due to Trump's and the GOP's economic policies catching up. Sanders and the Democrats face the blunt of blame. "See, socialism cripples economies!" the uneducated voterbase buys into it and we have Trump 2024. Trump promises to save the people. Congress grants the President more authority and soon we have a direct dictatorship.

Im not saying we shouldn't vote for Sanders, but to think that this is our only chance as if the 4 years of the next President is our ONLY chance of progress in this country is just silly.
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Re: Democrat Watch

#1040  Postby theropod_V_2.0 » Feb 23, 2020 3:06 am

Bernie takes Nevada, by a lot. What happens if he wins most of super Tuesday, and by a lot?

I think the next president will be a democratic socialist. The “not upper middle class” have had it. Now the question is if he wins will “Dear Leader” step down? I have serious doubts. His declaration that he is the highest cop in the land is dangerous shit.

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