Extinction Rebellion are on point.

tuco · **#321** by **tuco** » Jun 21, 2019 3:57 pm

I think a debate on immigration could be interesting for many reasons and from many perspectives. It's global, it's connected to climate change, foreign policies, domestic policies, racism, nationalism, tribalism, terrorism, aging population, it's not gonna go away .. multileveled topic with far-reaching consequences.

Cito di Pense · **#322** by **Cito di Pense** » Jun 22, 2019 9:28 am

tuco wrote:I think a debate on immigration could be interesting for many reasons and from many perspectives. ... it's not gonna go away ...

It's got consequences no one can predict. See chaos theory. So, it's interesting to anyone who treats 'debating' as a synonym for 'trolling', mainly because it's not gonna go away, so it hangs around as an excuse for trolling. There ya go, tuco. Got your wish.

laklak · **#323** by **laklak** » Jun 22, 2019 2:42 pm

One man's immigrant is another man's emigrant.

Keep It Real · **#324** by **Keep It Real** » Jul 28, 2019 3:00 pm

the grapevine wrote:Wouldn't it be a good idea for XR to form a wide reaching Citizen's Assembly itself, to devise the changes needed to avoid an ecological and societal catastrophe, and then to demand those changes be brought about, perhaps one at a time? Finite, pointed, specific demands, to focus on something tight, might galvanise the Rebels after the government's appeasing "lip-service" treatment of the original, broad 3 XR demands. Did I say demands? I meant objectives.

Keep It Real · **#325** by **Keep It Real** » Jul 28, 2019 8:17 pm

I'm watching "Jesus Camp" (2006) atm and it has a scene where a spot on US dude sums up evangelical fundy Christianity circa "Rape the earth of oil and everything else we might fancy, fuck global warming concern, Jesus second coming is immanent, rape rape rape!" - words and stuff.

Svartalf · **#326** by **Svartalf** » Jul 28, 2019 8:21 pm

Never understood how anybody can be moronic enough to wish for the end of the world... guess hubris can serve as an excuse for being confindent in being among the Chosen for Heavens.

Keep It Real · **#327** by **Keep It Real** » Jul 28, 2019 8:23 pm

I fucked up a little and had to edit my post, FYI Svartalf, but yes, very.

Svartalf · **#328** by **Svartalf** » Jul 28, 2019 8:28 pm

Well, one thing I don't get either is how they know the second cumming of Jesus is about to take place, the signs in REvelation don't clearly happen, and anyway, the people who were there when Jesus was alive expected him to come back during their lifetime, and it's been that way for a solid 2000 years, what's to tell you the cumming is not going to wait for some few millenia more?

Keep It Real · **#329** by **Keep It Real** » Jul 28, 2019 8:38 pm

Something todo with Koolaid I think...have to ask Lak, he's the authority on such things round here methinks.

RE XR business, I learnt recently that XR has cancelled ALL drone based Heathrow etc actions, which is nice. : )

tuco · **#330** by **tuco** » Jul 28, 2019 8:41 pm

Well, its a question whether or not to care what is going to come when I will not be here anymore. So .. understand .. do you understand people who weight 300 pounds or climb mountains? Wishing for the end of the world is kind of weird but let's say fascination with apocalyptic scenarios seems to be quite common. I would guess it's cultural.

btw I always thought that Jesus loves all. Does it mean I can go to hell even if he loves me?

Keep It Real · **#331** by **Keep It Real** » Aug 15, 2019 4:37 pm

Catchphrase I'm thinking of proposing for the October Rebellion - "We Want Recession!"

felltoearth · **#332** by **felltoearth** » Aug 15, 2019 7:20 pm

What? You think recessions hurt the rich?

Agi Hammerthief · **#333** by **Agi Hammerthief** » Aug 15, 2019 8:31 pm

eh, wrong thread

Keep It Real · **#334** by **Keep It Real** » Aug 15, 2019 8:40 pm

felltoearth wrote:What? You think recessions hurt the rich?

This isn't about wealth inequality fellto, it's about REDUCING consumption and by extension economic activity AKA recession pls.

theropod · **#335** by **theropod** » Aug 15, 2019 8:49 pm

It is often the case that when people get desperate, which not having any money tends to induce, they find ways to stay warm. Cheap dirty fuel is then their only choice.

Only when infrastructure, and society as a whole, is developed to allow for such economic restrictions without tertiary consequences does a recession make sense.

RS

tuco · **#336** by **tuco** » Aug 15, 2019 9:36 pm

Keep It Real wrote:
felltoearth wrote:What? You think recessions hurt the rich?

This isn't about wealth inequality fellto, it's about REDUCING consumption and by extension economic activity AKA recession pls.

If tech (together with habits) is our way out, and it seems to me that it plays a premier role with regards to our impact on the environment ("clean" energy, GMO food, efficient machines, etc.) recession is not a long-term plan. It's like halving the population plan. Sure it helps in the short term but it solves nothing. We need sustainable, long-term, solutions.

Shall I link the post again where I was asking: What are we running out? because that is the question to ask when we talk about reducing consumption. Obviously, there is little point of reducing consumption of I dunno .. carrots? There is no shortage of carrots and there will probably be enough carrots for 20B people. But what do we need to reduce?

Keep It Real · **#337** by **Keep It Real** » Aug 15, 2019 9:39 pm

Foreign holidays? Snazzy new motors? The latest, greatest smartphones? Conservatories (extensions)? Tobacco? I could of course go on all day...

tuco · **#338** by **tuco** » Aug 15, 2019 9:46 pm

So oil, design without a circular economy in mind, bad habits .. Let people develop and manufacture new efficient motors running clean. They get something to do, money goes around, the motor does not vaporize and can be recycled which again gives people something to do and money go around. Recessions have a bad rep for leading to let's rise of extremism. Then some idiot comes and says .. I will build highways or wall or leave a good relationship .. you know.

Macdoc · **#339** by **Macdoc** » Aug 15, 2019 10:28 pm

Keep It Real » Aug 15, 2019 10:39 pm

Foreign holidays? Snazzy new motors? The latest, greatest smartphones? Conservatories (extensions)? Tobacco? I could of course go on all day...

We have the technology for a sustainable technological civilization ...we don't have the political structure to get there.

gobshite · **#340** by **gobshite** » Aug 16, 2019 2:12 am

Macdoc wrote:
Keep It Real » Aug 15, 2019 10:39 pm

Foreign holidays? Snazzy new motors? The latest, greatest smartphones? Conservatories (extensions)? Tobacco? I could of course go on all day...

We have the technology for a sustainable technological civilization

No we don't. Recycling is nowhere near the efficiency needed to reduce our exponential use of resources.

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