How did homosexuality become socially acceptable?

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How did homosexuality become socially acceptable?

#1  Postby Hugin » Sep 02, 2010 7:30 pm

From what I've understand, the change towards acceptance of homosexuality has happened very quickly from a historical point of view. It wasn't that many decades ago that a supposedly liberal Swedish newspaper called AIDS "the gay cancer" and the communists denounced homosexuality as one of the depravities of the class society. This was still slightly after homosexuality had stopped being classified as a disease by the Swedish government (decriminalization happen IIRC in 1944).

So how did this change happen? Which groups were responsible for it?
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Re: How did homosexuality become socially acceptable?

#2  Postby Kazaman » Sep 02, 2010 7:32 pm

Classical Europe was fairly tolerant of homosexuality, although it had quirks. It's a series of phases, really.
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Re: How did homosexuality become socially acceptable?

#3  Postby FACT-MAN-2 » Sep 02, 2010 7:33 pm

Hugin wrote:
So how did this change happen? Which groups were responsible for it?

Hugin, you're a master at one thing and one only -- coming up with dumb questions. :yuk:
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Re: How did homosexuality become socially acceptable?

#4  Postby mmmcheezy » Sep 02, 2010 7:34 pm

Which groups were responsible? The same groups that made being an African American acceptable I guess? :dunno:
Liberal folks have always existed, and once a liberal person gets to know a homosexual, they [for the most part] acknowledge that there's nothing evil or wrong or chosen about homosexuality. Attitudes spread. Pretty easily.
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Re: How did homosexuality become socially acceptable?

#5  Postby Animavore » Sep 02, 2010 7:36 pm

A few gay people made noise, everyone else said, "Oh let them have their rights ffs, if it'll shut them up".


:P
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Re: How did homosexuality become socially acceptable?

#6  Postby HughMcB » Sep 02, 2010 7:41 pm

I'm more interested to know how homosexuality became socially unacceptable, especially given that this event occurred first.
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Re: How did homosexuality become socially acceptable?

#7  Postby Animavore » Sep 02, 2010 7:42 pm

Good question.
The thing about Irish people is they're always just sort of angry.
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Re: How did homosexuality become socially acceptable?

#8  Postby Hugin » Sep 02, 2010 7:46 pm

HughMcB wrote:I'm more interested to know how homosexuality became socially unacceptable, especially given that this event occurred first.


Abrahamic religion (mostly).
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Re: How did homosexuality become socially acceptable?

#9  Postby Animavore » Sep 02, 2010 7:48 pm

There are some countries and cultures where it was never socially unacceptable. Mainly in the Far East.
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Re: How did homosexuality become socially acceptable?

#10  Postby Dr. Kwaltz » Sep 02, 2010 7:48 pm

Well, Hugin, in the case of Scandinavia, the modern gay movement can be traced back to the establishment of the Danish "Forbundet av 1948" (Union of 1948), followed in Norway by "Det norske forbundet av 1948" (The Norwegian Union of 1948) was started in 1953. English page

I remember the spokes woman from the 60's and 70's on Norwegian TV discussing the conditions for gays and lesbians. Here flanked by some helpers:

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Re: How did homosexuality become socially acceptable?

#11  Postby Tbickle » Sep 02, 2010 7:49 pm

Hugin wrote:
HughMcB wrote:I'm more interested to know how homosexuality became socially unacceptable, especially given that this event occurred first.


Abrahamic religion (mostly).


Is it that simple though? It would seem that this belief existed before it was written into their super special book. There's no doubt that this has certainly had a massive effect, but it most likely didn't originate from there.
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Re: How did homosexuality become socially acceptable?

#12  Postby tuco » Sep 02, 2010 8:02 pm

I like to believe such "progress" is/was "inevitable", I do not know how changes in societies occur, so I would not hold anyone in particular "responsible", as in: called to account as primary cause, for it. Though it is a matter of semantics and definitions I guess.

When gay movement started was pointed out already.

Reminds me of:

Derek Sivers: How to start a movement

http://www.ted.com/talks/derek_sivers_h ... ement.html
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Re: How did homosexuality become socially acceptable?

#13  Postby Seabass » Sep 02, 2010 8:03 pm

FACT-MAN-2 wrote:
Hugin wrote:
So how did this change happen? Which groups were responsible for it?

Hugin, you're a master at one thing and one only -- coming up with dumb questions. :yuk:

What an excellent way for a 78 year old man to speak to a 21 year old. Congratulations. :clap:
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Re: How did homosexuality become socially acceptable?

#14  Postby Matt H » Sep 02, 2010 8:22 pm

Well, this is what sociology is for. My own opinion would be the introduction of democracy in the early 20th century, and massive social upheavals caused by two devastating World Wars and easier travel methods all contributed to the biggest change Western society has ever seen. People were exposed to new ways of life, and a higher degree of personal freedom than they ever had before.
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Re: How did homosexuality become socially acceptable?

#15  Postby HughMcB » Sep 02, 2010 8:26 pm

Animavore wrote:There are some countries and cultures where it was never socially unacceptable. Mainly in the Far East.

Depends how far back in "culture" you go. Of course cultural and social interactions can be viewed as somewhat different, but looking at our closest ancestors I don't think its unreasonable to extrapolate that homosexuality has played a social role in primates for millions of years. It was only more recently with our "developed" human brain and moral codes that we decided it was unnatural. Thankfully, we've gotten past that fallacious taboo and we can adopt a more natural, grass roots policy towards homosexuality. Or at least take a step in the right direction.
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Re: How did homosexuality become socially acceptable?

#16  Postby Peter Brown » Sep 02, 2010 9:16 pm

So how did this change happen? Which groups were responsible for it?


Interesting question.
Now my knowledge of history was gay sex was often used to enforce superiority in ancient societies. A master could rape a slave or someone lower down the social scale. Ancient Greece was different though as they had theories on having and seeking pleasure so gay sex could just be for pleasure. So gay sex wasn’t always performed by homosexuals, it was also cultural so heterosexuals sometimes did it as well.

Taking the above paragraph as a rough idea of the world cultural situation then the first groups to demand change would have been the religions that called it a sin. I think I sort of understand the reason why. If homo rape was happening as a social one-upmanship well you’re not going to get a religion that says one form of gay sex is wrong, but consensual is ok, the religion is going to ban all forms to keep it simple.

Changes to the attitudes of a society to homosexuality has had its minor periods of acceptance in small localities. However it hasn’t been until the start of the 1970’s that real progress has been made. It doesn’t seem to be localized but more a western change in attitudes at more or less the same decades.

Second important foundation of change was women’s suffrage. Huge concept where women were starting to have the same equality of rights as men. It must have started with education, followed by female self awareness and then female politics. This opened up the average westerner to more education. The first foundation could have been a turn against slavery, but as education wasn’t tied in with that it took a long time before woman’s suffrage came along.

So in the end I think it came down to education that allowed self awareness, and in turn realising there was no us and them, but the knowledge we are the same. It just seems a logical progression that after slaves and females gaining freedom from societies and religious rules that homosexuals said we are normal too so give us the respect we deserve as we are not raping anyone.

All I’ve written might be utter garbage, but it sort of makes sense too me as a chain of events.
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Re: How did homosexuality become socially acceptable?

#17  Postby katja z » Sep 02, 2010 9:35 pm

Peter Brown wrote:
Taking the above paragraph as a rough idea of the world cultural situation then the first groups to demand change would have been the religions that called it a sin. I think I sort of understand the reason why. If homo rape was happening as a social one-upmanship well you’re not going to get a religion that says one form of gay sex is wrong, but consensual is ok, the religion is going to ban all forms to keep it simple.

By that logic, they should have banned hetero sex as well, and for exactly the same reasons.
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Re: How did homosexuality become socially acceptable?

#18  Postby Sityl » Sep 02, 2010 9:38 pm

It became unacceptable because of religious idiocy.

It became acceptable because it IS acceptable.
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Re: How did homosexuality become socially acceptable?

#19  Postby Hugin » Sep 02, 2010 9:40 pm

Sityl wrote:It became unacceptable because of religious idiocy.

It became acceptable because it IS acceptable.


However, Tacitus recorded that the Germanic peoples used to drown those convicted of homosexual acts in marshes, centuries before they adopted Christianity.
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Re: How did homosexuality become socially acceptable?

#20  Postby Kazaman » Sep 02, 2010 9:41 pm

The Germanic people had religion before they adopted Christianity specifically.
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