Jeffrey Epstein’s connections to Donald Trump and Bill Clint

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Re: Jeffrey Epstein’s connections to Donald Trump and Bill Clint

#81  Postby purplerat » Aug 12, 2019 5:46 pm

So let me get this straight, part of the reason for believing he was murdered is that he was recently taken off suicide watch yet simultaneously we should be incredulous that he would be motivated to kill himself despite having just recently been on suicide watch.
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Re: Jeffrey Epstein’s connections to Donald Trump and Bill Clint

#82  Postby Scot Dutchy » Aug 12, 2019 5:50 pm

Just one opinion. Why was he off suicide watch after having so called attempted suicide? Also the day after the first documents were released. Scum like Epstein have no morals or conscience. They go on to the bitter end taking as many with them as they can.
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Re: Jeffrey Epstein’s connections to Donald Trump and Bill Clint

#83  Postby Scot Dutchy » Aug 12, 2019 5:53 pm

Barr criticises 'serious irregularities' at jail where Jeffrey Epstein found dead


Barr under pressure to explain apparent lapses in protocol
Attorney general: ‘Any co-conspirators should not rest easy’


Yep sheer coincidence.
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Re: Jeffrey Epstein’s connections to Donald Trump and Bill Clint

#84  Postby Scot Dutchy » Aug 12, 2019 5:56 pm

Ghislaine Maxwell: the woman accused of helping Jeffrey Epstein groom girls

The British socialite had a changing relationship with the disgraced financier who was found dead in his New York cell


The fall-guy?
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Re: Jeffrey Epstein’s connections to Donald Trump and Bill Clint

#85  Postby Spearthrower » Aug 12, 2019 6:59 pm

Scot Dutchy wrote:
Spearthrower wrote:Remember: rational skepticism, the entire fucking point of this forum is to challenge wishful thinking.


The wishful thinking is he killed himself.



No Scot. The default position is that he killed himself until evidence shows otherwise. The reason that's the default position is because it's not pluralizing events or actors without necessity, as in, he definitely died, and the simplest apparent cause is suicide. Does that mean I am saying it's 'sure' that he committed suicide? No, of course not, as I've already explained to you, regardless of how you're trying to formulate my position as a certain claim.

What we do know is that he already tried to commit suicide. The actual controversy isn't whether he was bumped off on the orders of the British monarchy, or shadowy rich and powerful figures, but why he wasn't closely watched, why his prior suicide attempt didn't result in him being monitored. That's the sane position.

What's you're doing is concocting stories out of thin air wholly in the absence of evidence.

That's pretty much as antithetical to rational skepticism as can be. It's standard conspiracy theory claptrap, and you're not going to get away with pretending otherwise by beating your chest and pretending everyone else is crazy for not believing in your wilful speculation.
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Re: Jeffrey Epstein’s connections to Donald Trump and Bill Clint

#86  Postby Spearthrower » Aug 12, 2019 7:00 pm

Scot Dutchy wrote:
aban57 wrote:
Scot Dutchy wrote:
Spearthrower wrote:Remember: rational skepticism, the entire fucking point of this forum is to challenge wishful thinking.


The wishful thinking is he killed himself.


Why did you come here in the first place ? I mean, you don't even know what reason or skepticism is, let alone exercising it, your posts are filled with generalizations or other fallacious "arguments", so, I'm wondering.
Wouldn't you fit right in on Infowars or any other conspiracy forum ?


Why do you come here? Just tell me? Your reasoning is non existent. Your posts are filled with crap. You dont even make generalisations because you are unable to. Stop the insults as I could tell you to go to other suitable forums.



For clarity and an impartial perspective Aban, your posts are absolutely not filled with crap, and you routinely exhibit much more competent rational discourse and thinking than I've ever seen Scot muster.
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Re: Jeffrey Epstein’s connections to Donald Trump and Bill Clint

#87  Postby Spearthrower » Aug 12, 2019 7:02 pm

Scot Dutchy wrote:Just one opinion. Why was he off suicide watch after having so called attempted suicide? Also the day after the first documents were released.


Valid questions. Unlike the wilful speculation.


Scot Dutchy wrote:Scum like Epstein have no morals or conscience. They go on to the bitter end taking as many with them as they can.


Non-sequitur. The second sentence doesn't follow from the first. He was at the bitter end facing a life time in prison where, thanks to his publicized proclivities, he wasn't likely to have a very good time at all.
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Re: Jeffrey Epstein’s connections to Donald Trump and Bill Clint

#88  Postby Spearthrower » Aug 12, 2019 7:09 pm

Scot Dutchy wrote:Barr criticises 'serious irregularities' at jail where Jeffrey Epstein found dead


Barr under pressure to explain apparent lapses in protocol
Attorney general: ‘Any co-conspirators should not rest easy’


Yep sheer coincidence.



Co-conspirators being those who conspired WITH him to murder him? :scratch:

While it's intriguing to see how you're appealing to Barr now, clearly he's talking about those people who were involved with Epstein's crimes prior to being caught and jailed.

Also, the term 'coincidence' specifically denotes two events occurring together in a manner that is unlikely. What's the other event coinciding with Epstein's death? Being taken off suicide watch? Well, that would be an explanation as to how he committed suicide, not a 'coincidence' but a prerequisite; a causal link. That's the 'irregularity' as he should not have been taken off. So at the very best in conspiracy land, he was maliciously taken off suicide watch in order to allow him to kill himself. Not quite the murder by shadowy powerful cabal narrative you've been expounding on with much certainty.
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Re: Jeffrey Epstein’s connections to Donald Trump and Bill Clint

#89  Postby Spearthrower » Aug 12, 2019 7:11 pm

SafeAsMilk wrote:Says the guy working overtime at the tin foil factory :lol:


SafeAsMilk wrote:If I didn't know any better, I'd say you're trying to reason with Scot. You must be new here :)



Apparently both points represent a very popular perspective here.
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Re: Jeffrey Epstein’s connections to Donald Trump and Bill Clint

#90  Postby The_Piper » Aug 12, 2019 7:22 pm

Spearthrower wrote:
Scot Dutchy wrote:
Spearthrower wrote:Remember: rational skepticism, the entire fucking point of this forum is to challenge wishful thinking.


The wishful thinking is he killed himself.



No Scot. The default position is that he killed himself until evidence shows otherwise. The reason that's the default position is because it's not pluralizing events or actors without necessity, as in, he definitely died, and the simplest apparent cause is suicide. Does that mean I am saying it's 'sure' that he committed suicide? No, of course not, as I've already explained to you, regardless of how you're trying to formulate my position as a certain claim.

What we do know is that he already tried to commit suicide.
The actual controversy isn't whether he was bumped off on the orders of the British monarchy, or shadowy rich and powerful figures, but why he wasn't closely watched, why his prior suicide attempt didn't result in him being monitored. That's the sane position.

While I agree with the crux of the quoted, in that right now the default position is that he committed suicide, I didn't see where it was reported that the prior incident was definitely a botched suicide. The reports said it was unclear if those wounds were self-inflicted.
"The brief hearing on Wednesday morning ended without mention of the July 23 incident at the Metropolitan Correctional Center, where Mr. Epstein was found passed out in his jail cell with marks on his neck.

The authorities have yet to explain what happened to Mr. Epstein. It remains unclear whether he attempted suicide or was attacked by another inmate."
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/07/31/nyregion/jeffrey-epstein-court.html
Here's another article from the time.
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/investigations/jeffrey-epstein-found-injured-marks-his-neck-new-york-jail-n1034301
And according to this article it wasn't reported that attempted suicide was a certainty-
http://nymag.com/intelligencer/2019/08/jeffrey-epstein-dies-by-suicide-report.html
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Re: Jeffrey Epstein’s connections to Donald Trump and Bill Clint

#91  Postby aban57 » Aug 12, 2019 7:38 pm

Scot Dutchy wrote:[ You dont even make generalisations because you are unable to.


Your attempts at attacking me are as stupid as your attempts at thinking. What you're saying here doesn't make any sense. I can't produce logical fallacies because I'm unable to ? Come on, even from you that's just ridiculous. What does that mean, that being unable to think properly is somehow a good thing now ? No wonder you produce so much bullshit.
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Re: Jeffrey Epstein’s connections to Donald Trump and Bill Clint

#92  Postby Spearthrower » Aug 12, 2019 7:47 pm

The_Piper wrote:
While I agree with the crux of the quoted, in that right now the default position is that he committed suicide, I didn't see where it was reported that the prior incident was definitely a botched suicide. The reports said it was unclear if those wounds were self-inflicted.


All the various reports I read about the earlier event said 'apparent suicide attempt'. I'm not sure if it was ever confirmed beyond all doubt, but if it had been an attack by another prisoner, then I can't see why he would have been put on suicide watch in the first place. If another prisoner had tried to murder him and he had a normal sense of self-preservation, I imagine he'd have asked for protection, and given his stature and the public interest in the case, I don't see why it wouldn't have been granted. I was under the impression, perhaps wrongly, that the first time he apparently attempted suicide, he was actually locked in his room alone - and that was in the Special Housing Unit separating high-profile inmates from the other prisoners.

The post-mortem result is pending further information, but the current verdict is 'presumed suicide'.

Given the events in court, just the day before he died, where some 2000 documents were reviewed containing graphic allegations about his conduct by his accusers, there seems to be a pretty simple motive for him to have concluded that he was royally fucked and that suicide was preferable to 40+ years among hardened prisoners who might fancy a little additional extra-judicial response against a previously rich and powerful pedophile rapist.
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Re: Jeffrey Epstein’s connections to Donald Trump and Bill Clint

#93  Postby The_Piper » Aug 12, 2019 8:18 pm

Right, of course he's had motive to commit suicide this whole time. Atm the only information we know is that Epstein died from an apparent suicide. I'm not implying that he was murdered, I couldn't know that unless/until it's reported to the public. Which is the same reason that I don't know if he tried to commit suicide in July or not, because afaik it wasn't reported that he had. They just said it's unclear.
I just wanted to point that out, and if you had read something to the contrary, to refer to the source.
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Re: Jeffrey Epstein’s connections to Donald Trump and Bill Clint

#94  Postby felltoearth » Aug 12, 2019 8:54 pm

Scot Dutchy wrote:
Animavore wrote:Nothing to lose? Here's an obscenely wealthy person who lives a high life with private jets and yaughts, expensive cars, huge mansions and a social life away from the rabble whose friends have now abandoned him and was looking at a long time in a prison among the poor environment that's hostile to child molesters.

He had more to lose than most of us could ever dream of.


Bollocks. People like him dont give up. They take revenge. Taking the kool-aid. Well done.

What better revenge than topping yourself and letting loose a plethora of conspiratorial speculations.
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Re: Jeffrey Epstein’s connections to Donald Trump and Bill Clint

#95  Postby Agi Hammerthief » Aug 12, 2019 8:57 pm

how about this one: he’s not dead, it’s just a ruse to cover up that he went into whiteness protection. :tinfoil:
* my (modified) emphasis ( or 'interpretation' )

meh
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Re: Jeffrey Epstein’s connections to Donald Trump and Bill Clint

#96  Postby Rachel Bronwyn » Aug 12, 2019 10:39 pm

Why wouldn't someone who had carefully designed and executed every aspect of their life for decades take control of their death as well? I imagine I would.
what a terrible image
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Re: Jeffrey Epstein’s connections to Donald Trump and Bill Clint

#97  Postby Macdoc » Aug 12, 2019 10:48 pm

I think you give a horny scam artist too much credit.
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Re: Jeffrey Epstein’s connections to Donald Trump and Bill Clint

#98  Postby laklak » Aug 13, 2019 2:35 am

William of Occam didn't know the Clintons, if there's even a chance Hillary and Slick Willy are involved parsimony goes out the window.
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Re: Jeffrey Epstein’s connections to Donald Trump and Bill Clint

#99  Postby SafeAsMilk » Aug 13, 2019 3:07 am

Thanks for the Fox News talking point. You clearly gave it a lot of thought.
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Re: Jeffrey Epstein’s connections to Donald Trump and Bill Clint

#100  Postby Thommo » Aug 13, 2019 3:08 am

Evidence.

It matters.
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