Teen With Autism Shot By Police

Sovereign · #1 by **Sovereign** » Feb 02, 2012 2:39 pm

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/loca ... 9817.story

Calumet City police had been called to subdue Stephon Watts 10 times in less than two years, using Tasers at least once on the 15-year-old withAsperger's syndrome.

On Wednesday, officers were called again to the teen's home, where two officers found Watts in his basement wielding a kitchen knife. Watts "lashed out" with the knife and struck one of the officers in the forearm, said police Chief Edward Gilmore. Continued...

FreshwaterSeaCowHero · #2 by **FreshwaterSeaCowHero** » Feb 02, 2012 2:42 pm

What the hell were the parents doing calling the cops on their autistic son 10 times? Why not get that child help?
I can't help but believe that it was the mother's fault.

Wiðercora · #3 by **Wiðercora** » Feb 02, 2012 2:43 pm

Can't help but wonder if they'd have shot a white teen.

To clarify, I don't think the police involved shot him because he was black nor that they wouldn't have shot a white teen because he was white.

trubble76 · #4 by **trubble76** » Feb 02, 2012 2:48 pm

FreshwaterSeaCowHero wrote:What the hell was the parent doing calling the cops on her autistic daughter 10 times? Why not get that child help?
I can't help but believe that it was the mother's fault.

The article explains that they were following the official advice.

Mojzu · #5 by **Mojzu** » Feb 02, 2012 2:58 pm

The parents were following official advice to contact authorities when things got out of hand. However both parents and the authorities were in the wrong here, autistic kids can be hard to predict and suddenly violent and I can understand from personal experience why some parents wouldn't be able to cope by themselves. But if that's the case, both the parents and authorities should be looking for a way to reduce the burden on the parents and perhaps alleviate some behavioural problems. A friend of mine had great success with a school specifically run for kids with conditions such as Autism and Downs, it meant he could return to work from what was effectively full time care (though at the moment he's having a bitch of a time trying to convince the council to continue helping to pay for care services, because although severely autistic and requiring 24/7 care his son is over 18).

There were a lot of possible solutions here that probably wouldn't have ended in the teens death.

FreshwaterSeaCowHero · #6 by **FreshwaterSeaCowHero** » Feb 02, 2012 3:00 pm

Mojzu wrote:The parents were following official advice to contact authorities when things got out of hand. However both parents and the authorities were in the wrong here, autistic kids can be hard to predict and suddenly violent and I can understand from personal experience why some parents wouldn't be able to cope by themselves. But if that's the case, both the parents and authorities should be looking for a way to reduce the burden on the parents and perhaps alleviate some behavioural problems. A friend of mine had great success with a school specifically run for kids with conditions such as Autism and Downs, it meant he could return to work from what was effectively full time care (though at the moment he's having a bitch of a time trying to convince the council to continue helping to pay for care services, because although severely autistic and requiring 24/7 care his son is over 18).

There were a lot of possible solutions here that probably wouldn't have ended in the teens death.

Sityl · #7 by **Sityl** » Feb 02, 2012 3:02 pm

It's sad. Not sure what else is to be expected when you cut a police officer with a weapon though :/

I don't know what I would do if I were the parent in that situation.

mattwilson · #8 by **mattwilson** » Feb 02, 2012 3:04 pm

Well clearly he shouldn't have had a knife

trubble76 · #9 by **trubble76** » Feb 02, 2012 3:14 pm

mattwilson wrote:Well clearly he shouldn't have had a knife

They manage to make shivs in prison, how you propose keeping him away from all things pointy/sharp?
Apparently it was a butterknife. :dunno:

FreshwaterSeaCowHero · **#10** by **FreshwaterSeaCowHero** » Feb 02, 2012 3:15 pm

trubble76 wrote:
mattwilson wrote:Well clearly he shouldn't have had a knife

They manage to make shivs in prison, how you propose keeping him away from all things pointy/sharp?
Apparently it was a butterknife.

Oh shit, that autistic kid has a butter knife! Call in the SWAT team!

mattwilson · **#11** by **mattwilson** » Feb 02, 2012 3:16 pm

trubble76 wrote:
mattwilson wrote:Well clearly he shouldn't have had a knife

They manage to make shivs in prison, how you propose keeping him away from all things pointy/sharp?
Apparently it was a butterknife.

I don't, I just thought I'd play along with all the gun toting yanks about to show up and blame it on the one who got shot...

trubble76 · **#12** by **trubble76** » Feb 02, 2012 3:16 pm

mattwilson wrote:
trubble76 wrote:
mattwilson wrote:Well clearly he shouldn't have had a knife

They manage to make shivs in prison, how you propose keeping him away from all things pointy/sharp?
Apparently it was a butterknife.

I don't, I just thought I'd play along with all the gun toting yanks about to show up and blame it on the one who got shot...

Right-oh

Mojzu · **#13** by **Mojzu** » Feb 02, 2012 3:17 pm

mattwilson wrote:Well clearly he shouldn't have had a knife

The ingenuity of autistic kids continues to astound me to this day. You can have locks on every cupboard and on the fridge, and they can still find a way to get a hold of the whipped cream and spray it all over the kitchen. Obviously autism covers a great range of disorders and behaviour is very variable, some parents will be better equipped to deal with it then others in terms of teaching/control of more extreme behaviour and financial state. What works for one family isn't guaranteed to work for another, so there need to be a range of care options and aid so that parents and the state can tailor a care plan which reduces the personal/fiscal burden on the parents and gives autistic kids a good quality of life. Unfortunately in this case it looks as though the authorities wanted to deal with the teen as a common criminal with a knife rather then a teen with a medical condition who probably didn't understand the situation he was in.

FreshwaterSeaCowHero · **#14** by **FreshwaterSeaCowHero** » Feb 02, 2012 3:23 pm

Why treat a child like an armed criminal? Why treat this autistic kid the same way that they treated that guy with a crowbar?

ED209 · **#15** by **ED209** » Feb 02, 2012 3:26 pm

FreshwaterSeaCowHero wrote:
trubble76 wrote:
mattwilson wrote:Well clearly he shouldn't have had a knife

They manage to make shivs in prison, how you propose keeping him away from all things pointy/sharp?
Apparently it was a butterknife.

Oh shit, that autistic girl's got a butter knife! Call in the SWAT team!

It was a boy, wasn't it?

And when the shit hits the fan, the smart thing is to do what the officers tell you otherise POW they will put you on the ground, a madman has the strength of ten, a butterknife is a dangerous and deadly weapon, my friend's father-in-laws next-door neighbour's dog's previous owner was a security guard and he says the officers are 100% right, crazy liberals would have let the boy stab everyone in the town to death before intervening, and so on :coffee:

FreshwaterSeaCowHero · **#16** by **FreshwaterSeaCowHero** » Feb 02, 2012 3:29 pm

ED209 wrote:
FreshwaterSeaCowHero wrote:
trubble76 wrote:
mattwilson wrote:Well clearly he shouldn't have had a knife

They manage to make shivs in prison, how you propose keeping him away from all things pointy/sharp?
Apparently it was a butterknife.

Oh shit, that autistic girl's got a butter knife! Call in the SWAT team!

It was a boy, wasn't it?

I fixed it.

ED209 wrote:And when the shit hits the fan, the smart thing is to do what the officers tell you otherise POW they will put you on the ground, a madman has the strength of ten, a butterknife is a dangerous and deadly weapon, my friend's father-in-laws next-door neighbour's dog's previous owner was a security guard and he says the officers are 100% right, crazy liberals would have let the boy stab everyone in the town to death before intervening, and so on

A special education teacher told me that the best way to calm down an autistic child is to restrain the child, and then let the child calm down.

orpheus · **#17** by **orpheus** » Feb 02, 2012 3:30 pm

bookmarking

Jumbo · **#18** by **Jumbo** » Feb 02, 2012 3:37 pm

It all really rather depends upon the knife.The father claims it was a butter knife. The other description is a kitchen knife which could range from the aforementioned butter knife to any of a swathe of rather more lethal implements.

If it was say a carving knife (or the officer in question had reasonable cause to think it was, perhaps say in poor light inn the basement) and the officer was at risk of his life due to the boy involved thrusting it at him then lethal force could be justified as being self defence. (Given the claim of being cornered and already having had the knife used). That would be the same level of defence a member of the public would be allowed in a similar situation. A dangerous knife is no less lethal if its wielded by someone who is autistic.

However If he was not at risk of his life due to it either being a butter knife or other factors then the officer should be in some very serious trouble over this.

The other scenario is one where it was a dangerous knife and the threat was neutralised by the first shot but the officer fired again after the threat had passed. I know here officers are required to account for each round they fire, assuming its the same there there would be questions to answer in that scenario.

All in all a whole lot more information is needed before any conclusions on whether the shooting was justifiable and be reached.

Mojzu · **#19** by **Mojzu** » Feb 02, 2012 3:49 pm

Depending on the situation the shooting may have been justified if the lives of the police officers were directly at risk, it's a tragedy and an avoidable one at that, but you can't expect all police to be given training on how to deal with such cases because autism can be so variable. However, what isn't justifiable is a situation where authorities tell parents to contact police when their son gets out of hand due to a medical condition. If it got that far and the parents couldn't handle it the state should be sending social care and health workers rather then the police to figure out what solution is in everyone's best interest.

Jumbo · **#20** by **Jumbo** » Feb 02, 2012 3:50 pm

That is true.

One would hope that cases like this are actually handled by some other body rather than having to wait for the situation to possibly become an emergency call to the police.