UK Coalition watch

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Re: Uk Coalition watch

#581  Postby Strontium Dog » Apr 18, 2012 2:36 pm

andyx1205 wrote:So when you linked Nazi Germany with socialism, you were being sincere instead of simply trolling?


Would you happen to have the precise quote? Your description rings no bells, and the search function is unable to assist either.

chairman bill wrote:
Strontium Dog wrote:But nobody has ever once suggested that the sole purpose of the Labour Party is to start illegal wars or whatever.


Really? It bloody well seems like it at times. A balanced, critical analysis seems beyond some people.


Balanced and critical are my middle names.
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Re: Uk Coalition watch

#582  Postby CarlPierce » Apr 18, 2012 2:37 pm

The leftist trolls on this site never bother to say exactly which lib-dem policies they hate.

Instead we get idiot comments like this

Lib Dems, lol. No reason I should waste time discussing the Lib Dems. RIP LDs!


Labour represent the 'working man'
Conservatives the business man big or small
The Lib Dem's represent PR and (no CCTV cameras)


Why not say the Lib-dems represent a sensible compromise between the two - and in neither's pocket.

I'm seriously considering not bothering with this site any more as its usually descends to content free insults and opinions based on nothing I could describe as rational or skeptical.
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Re: Uk Coalition watch

#583  Postby chairman bill » Apr 18, 2012 2:43 pm

CarlPierce wrote:I'm seriously considering not bothering with this site any more as its usually descends to content free insults and opinions based on nothing I could describe as rational or skeptical.


Frankly Carl, given some of your posts, I thought that was precisely why you came here. Your 'leftish trolls' comment being a case-in-point.
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Re: Uk Coalition watch

#584  Postby Strontium Dog » Apr 18, 2012 2:44 pm

CarlPierce wrote:Why not say the Lib-dems represent a sensible compromise between the two - and in neither's pocket.


People who view the world in black and white are sadly unable to appreciate shades of grey.
If a liberal party does something, then that act, by definition, is a liberal one. The only alternative is that they are not a liberal party.

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Re: Uk Coalition watch

#585  Postby Scot Dutchy » Apr 18, 2012 2:51 pm

Strontium Dog wrote:
CarlPierce wrote:Why not say the Lib-dems represent a sensible compromise between the two - and in neither's pocket.


People who view the world in black and white are sadly unable to appreciate shades of grey.


Is that the colour for the LibDems taxi? :lol:
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Re: Uk Coalition watch

#586  Postby chairman bill » Apr 18, 2012 2:54 pm

Strontium Dog wrote:
CarlPierce wrote:Why not say the Lib-dems represent a sensible compromise between the two - and in neither's pocket.


People who view the world in black and white are sadly unable to appreciate shades of grey.


And some of us realise that sometimes the answer is indeed either black or white, and not some grubby shade in-between
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Re: Uk Coalition watch

#587  Postby mattthomas » Apr 18, 2012 3:00 pm

CarlPierce wrote:The leftist trolls on this site never bother to say exactly which lib-dem policies they hate.

Instead we get idiot comments like this

Lib Dems, lol. No reason I should waste time discussing the Lib Dems. RIP LDs!


Labour represent the 'working man'
Conservatives the business man big or small
The Lib Dem's represent PR and (no CCTV cameras)


Why not say the Lib-dems represent a sensible compromise between the two - and in neither's pocket.

I'm seriously considering not bothering with this site any more as its usually descends to content free insults and opinions based on nothing I could describe as rational or skeptical.


Frankly I can't see what gains they have made which haven't been massively outweighed, I don't view them as being in the pocket of the tores but their policies which have been put through have been (in my opinion) piecemeal and bowdlerised until they were of little consequence. While the policies they have supported; i.e. tuition fees, the health and social care bill, welfare reform act have/will have massive consequences for the young/the sick/the disabled.. and THAT is why as a political party I just can't find support for them anymore though previously having been a lib dem voter.
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Re: Uk Coalition watch

#588  Postby rJD » Apr 18, 2012 3:06 pm

Scot Dutchy wrote:
Strontium Dog wrote:
CarlPierce wrote:Why not say the Lib-dems represent a sensible compromise between the two - and in neither's pocket.


People who view the world in black and white are sadly unable to appreciate shades of grey.


Is that the colour for the LibDems taxi? :lol:

Surely a big yellow one? :shifty:

It's funny how neither SD nor Carl seems to appreciate that many previously Lib Dem supporters are now as thoroughly pissed off with them as we were with Labour. The LD lies over tuition fees, and their utter capitulation over NHS privatisation are utterly disgraceful, and I will not be voting for them again in the forseeable future, having voted for them in the last two general elections.
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Re: Uk Coalition watch

#589  Postby andyx1205 » Apr 18, 2012 3:08 pm

The Lib Dems were not a compromise between the two, to say such means they were politically in the middle of the two. Instead, the Lib Dems were a leftist alternative to Labour.

Btw, this picture never gets old.

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From political compass, UK 2010 election.

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Last edited by andyx1205 on Apr 18, 2012 3:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Uk Coalition watch

#590  Postby ED209 » Apr 18, 2012 3:09 pm

But....but...75% of their manifesto! Where it coincided with the Tory plans anyway :lol:

Don't forget their VAT increase, either.
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Re: Uk Coalition watch

#591  Postby andyx1205 » Apr 18, 2012 3:11 pm

If the UK had PR we could all forget about this nonsensical debate, have a group hug, and vote Green.
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Re: Uk Coalition watch

#592  Postby mrjonno » Apr 18, 2012 3:12 pm

chairman bill wrote:
Strontium Dog wrote:I wonder at what point this cavalcade of complete and utter lying bullshit becomes trolling of Liberal Democrat members here.


In part I agree with you, that the LibDems have always been for far more than is suggested, but given that lying bullshit never seems to be seen as trolling of Labour members here, I fail to see that you really have grounds for complaint.


Does anyone seriously think the Lib Dem's would have joined the coalition without a referendum on electoral reform regardless of anything else in the coalition agreement?. I do understand why they did it but it was a massive gamble which they lost. The Tories and Labour win and lose elections but know they will get back in eventually Clegg put his entire parties future on an all or nothing policy and lost
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Re: Uk Coalition watch

#593  Postby Scot Dutchy » Apr 18, 2012 3:14 pm

Yes @andy I think that photo will be used over and over again in the next election.
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Re: Uk Coalition watch

#594  Postby Scot Dutchy » Apr 18, 2012 3:16 pm

mrjonno wrote:
chairman bill wrote:
Strontium Dog wrote:I wonder at what point this cavalcade of complete and utter lying bullshit becomes trolling of Liberal Democrat members here.


In part I agree with you, that the LibDems have always been for far more than is suggested, but given that lying bullshit never seems to be seen as trolling of Labour members here, I fail to see that you really have grounds for complaint.


Does anyone seriously think the Lib Dem's would have joined the coalition without a referendum on electoral reform regardless of anything else in the coalition agreement?. I do understand why they did it but it was a massive gamble which they lost. The Tories and Labour win and lose elections but know they will get back in eventually Clegg put his entire parties future on an all or nothing policy and lost


Of couse they did. The rest of their policies did not matter just change the election system.

I want to know why it was done so early. I think later would have been better.
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Re: Uk Coalition watch

#595  Postby ED209 » Apr 18, 2012 3:23 pm

Ah yes; that is because they got absolutely everything about it hopelessly wrong.

The losing team on the apprentice normally exhibits greater competence and better judgement than the parliamentary fibdems :lol:
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Re: Uk Coalition watch

#596  Postby surreptitious57 » Apr 18, 2012 3:23 pm

Scot Dutchy wrote:

I wonder why so many Brits are so anti European


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Re: Uk Coalition watch

#597  Postby chairman bill » Apr 18, 2012 3:25 pm

Contrary to the assertions of SD & Carl, I don't hate the LibDems, and in fact have always had a good deal of respect for them as a party. When Jackie Ballard was our local MP, I was happy to vote, not tactically, but positively LibDem. I've never liked the sometimes authoritarian streak that has so undermined a truly democratic left agenda in the Labour Party, and the LibDems have always been a pretty damned good voice for civil liberties & democratic freedoms in the UK. They aren't the only voice (both Labour & the Greens have a substantial track record in this regard too), but have always been an important & impassioned one.

The experience of LibDems in government has been disappointing. Not because I wanted a more left-leaning government (though clearly I do), but because I think they've been largely ineffective, and downright wrong on a number of things - NHS & Social Care Bill/Act being one, failing to stop Tory excess in kicking the disabled, and over tuition fees. And frankly it does no good to say, "Ah, but Labour introduced the fees", or "Labour allowed the private sector into the NHS first", not least because I opposed these policies when New <hawk, spit> Labour did them. What's wrong is plain fucking wrong, whatever stripe the politicians doing it.

This government seems to be happily doing the sort of thing Tory governments are want to do. There may be some LibDem tinkering around the edges, but the thrust is a Tory government, implementing Tory policies. And I just don't like the company the LibDems are keeping these days.
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Re: Uk Coalition watch

#598  Postby THWOTH » Apr 18, 2012 3:28 pm

The most recent YouGov results on voting intentions, 17th April 2012:

    Conservative: 32%
    Labour: 41%
    LibDem: 8%
    Other: 19%
One might say that that's 40% for the government and 41% for Labour, or 60% for the opposition. However...

Of the 'Others.'

    UKIP 9%
    SNP/PCY 4%
    Green 3%
    BNP 1%
    Respect 0%
    Other 1%
    _____________________
    Would Not Vote 9%
    Don't know 17%
So more people would vote UKIP than LibDem at the moment.

Source (PDF) »»
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Re: Uk Coalition watch

#599  Postby andyx1205 » Apr 18, 2012 3:32 pm

The LDs were gambling in that any electoral reform would benefit the LDs in future elections considering the great disproportionality in seat outcomes. Sadly they got nothing and instead of improving their prospects in the future they have greatly harmed them. Funny ain't it, they went in thinking they'd benefit in the future only for the opposite to happen LOL.
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Re: Uk Coalition watch

#600  Postby andyx1205 » Apr 18, 2012 3:35 pm

8% LOL.
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