UK EU Referendum

Byron · **#6801** by **Byron** » Mar 26, 2017 9:07 pm

ronmcd wrote:I'm not sure what power they have though? (Im not sure what power I'd want that group of cockwombles to have, but, then I think, May Davis Boris etc ... )

Formal power, none ATM, but they've packed the media and much of the Commons (the Cameroons are self-styled heirs to Blair), and if May looks like losing the financial passport and tariff/reg-free access to the EEA, the City and business -- the people who bankroll the Tories -- will turn on her with fury.

Both Blairites and headbangers are odious spivs, but between Blairites and bastards, the Blairites at least won't bankrupt the UK: since I want the union to be dissolved, preference would probably be for them to guide iEngland into the EEA while Scotland takes her own path, and N.I. comes to some kinda federal arrangement with Ireland.

angelo · **#6802** by **angelo** » Mar 27, 2017 10:31 am

Corneel wrote:
angelo wrote:The Guardian has as much credibility as The Daily Mail hasn't it?

Maybe in dark, fetal infested corners of the internet you just crawled out, but in the real world, no.

I could report this post as an attack on my person. But seeing where you're coming from, I would not waste my time!

Corneel · **#6803** by **Corneel** » Mar 27, 2017 10:40 am

angelo wrote:
Corneel wrote:
angelo wrote:The Guardian has as much credibility as The Daily Mail hasn't it?

Maybe in dark, fetal infested corners of the internet you just crawled out, but in the real world, no.

I could report this post as an attack on my person.

Where, oh where did I attack your person. It's just a comment on the type of posting and links you usually come up with on this site.

But seeing where you're coming from, I would not waste my time!

Please explain.

ronmcd · **#6804** by **ronmcd** » Mar 27, 2017 10:47 am

Corneel wrote:Please explain.

Sounds like angelo is a Strigiformephobe :nono:

ronmcd · **#6805** by **ronmcd** » Mar 27, 2017 12:14 pm

It's amazing, in an extraordinary week for the UK, Theresa May has managed to give a speech in Glasgow without saying anything interesting.

https://twitter.com/JamieRoss7/status/8 ... 6463175680

ronmcd · **#6806** by **ronmcd** » Mar 27, 2017 12:37 pm

.@Number10gov pushing out press releases while not giving the Scottish lobby any access to ask Qs or even watch speech today. #democracy

https://twitter.com/C_KAndrews/status/8 ... 1358814208

Fallible · **#6807** by **Fallible** » Mar 27, 2017 12:44 pm

angelo wrote:The Guardian has as much credibility as The Daily Mail hasn't it?

Lol...

Scot Dutchy · **#6808** by **Scot Dutchy** » Mar 27, 2017 2:31 pm

So the divorce will take place before the trade deal (which I have always said).

Brexit: EU's chief negotiator tells Theresa May she won't get a new trade deal if she slashes taxes and rights

A deal depends on 'fair competition and high environmental, social and consumer protection standards' Prime Minister is told

The EU’s chief negotiator has warned it will crush Theresa May’s hopes of a new trade deal if she slashes business taxes, workers’ rights and environmental standards.

Michel Barnier said an “ambitious free-trade agreement” was possible if the two sides can first reach agreement on the ‘divorce bill’, EU citizens’ rights and Northern Ireland’s border.

But he warned it could only be agreed “provided that it ensures fair competition and guarantees high environmental, social and consumer protection standards”.

The warning flows from the EU’s fears that Britain, under a Conservative Government, will embark on a “race to the bottom” after Brexit.

Ministers will come under pressure to slash so-called ‘red tape’ to win a competitive advantage – partly to compensate for being out of the EU’s single market and customs union.

At the weekend, The Independent revealed that Michael Gove wants to rip up Brussels regulations on clinical trials for new drugs and on building near protected wildlife habitats, for example.

Theresa May has promised to protect existing workers’ right, but the Government rebuffed an attempt to put that commitment into law.
....
He wrote: “This means agreeing on the orderly withdrawal of the UK before negotiating any future trade deal.

More...

Alan B · **#6809** by **Alan B** » Mar 27, 2017 3:59 pm

The EU’s chief negotiator has warned it will crush Theresa May’s hopes of a new trade deal if she slashes business taxes, workers’ rights and environmental standards.

Michel Barnier said an “ambitious free-trade agreement” was possible if the two sides can first reach agreement on the ‘divorce bill’, EU citizens’ rights and Northern Ireland’s border.

But he warned it could only be agreed “provided that it ensures fair competition and guarantees high environmental, social and consumer protection standards”.

My Bold.
I see. Does the EU trade with Saudi Arabia, China, India, etc.?

Seems like double standards here. :think:

ronmcd · **#6810** by **ronmcd** » Mar 27, 2017 4:07 pm

Alan B wrote:
The EU’s chief negotiator has warned it will crush Theresa May’s hopes of a new trade deal if she slashes business taxes, workers’ rights and environmental standards.

Michel Barnier said an “ambitious free-trade agreement” was possible if the two sides can first reach agreement on the ‘divorce bill’, EU citizens’ rights and Northern Ireland’s border.

But he warned it could only be agreed “provided that it ensures fair competition and guarantees high environmental, social and consumer protection standards”.
My Bold.
I see. Does the EU trade with Saudi Arabia, China, India, etc.?

Seems like double standards here.

Not "free trade" though, which was the context. “ambitious free-trade agreement”

(I assume?)

Corneel · **#6811** by **Corneel** » Mar 27, 2017 4:08 pm

Alan B wrote:
The EU’s chief negotiator has warned it will crush Theresa May’s hopes of a new trade deal if she slashes business taxes, workers’ rights and environmental standards.

Michel Barnier said an “ambitious free-trade agreement” was possible if the two sides can first reach agreement on the ‘divorce bill’, EU citizens’ rights and Northern Ireland’s border.

But he warned it could only be agreed “provided that it ensures fair competition and guarantees high environmental, social and consumer protection standards”.
My Bold.
I see. Does the EU trade with Saudi Arabia, China, India, etc.?

Seems like double standards here.

If the UK is satifisfied with getting the deal that those countries are getting at the moment, then there is no need for negociation over those points. It seems that Ms May is looking for a bit more.

Alan B · **#6812** by **Alan B** » Mar 27, 2017 4:13 pm

I was thinking in terms of the "...high environmental, social and consumer protection standards”.

Tzelemel · **#6813** by **Tzelemel** » Mar 27, 2017 4:13 pm

Alan B wrote:
The EU’s chief negotiator has warned it will crush Theresa May’s hopes of a new trade deal if she slashes business taxes, workers’ rights and environmental standards.

Michel Barnier said an “ambitious free-trade agreement” was possible if the two sides can first reach agreement on the ‘divorce bill’, EU citizens’ rights and Northern Ireland’s border.

But he warned it could only be agreed “provided that it ensures fair competition and guarantees high environmental, social and consumer protection standards”.
My Bold.
I see. Does the EU trade with Saudi Arabia, China, India, etc.?

Seems like double standards here.

I'm sorry, I'm confused as to what you're suggesting here.

A cursory glance at the EU-China trade webpage suggests that the trade agreement with China can't really be described as "ambitious free-trade".

To me, Barnier is suggesting that if we don't ensure "fair competition and... high environmental, social and consumer protection standards", then the best we can hope for is a trade agreement similar to that of China. I could be wrong, though, because, as I said, I've only taken a cursory glance at this, and I'm not an economist.

Alan B · **#6814** by **Alan B** » Mar 27, 2017 4:15 pm

Perhaps I'm misreading this...

But, we'll see.

ronmcd · **#6815** by **ronmcd** » Mar 27, 2017 4:17 pm

He's surely saying ... actually I was going to try and rewrite it in my own words, but doesn't this actually say it? :smile:

The EU’s chief negotiator has warned it will crush Theresa May’s hopes of a new trade deal if she slashes business taxes, workers’ rights and environmental standards.

Michel Barnier said an “ambitious free-trade agreement” was possible if the two sides can first reach agreement on the ‘divorce bill’, EU citizens’ rights and Northern Ireland’s border.

But he warned it could only be agreed “provided that it ensures fair competition and guarantees high environmental, social and consumer protection standards”.

ie It's saying in order to have a "free trade" agreement, which we have currently as part of EU but don't with other countries generally, we would need to agree to standards etc.

Scot Dutchy · **#6816** by **Scot Dutchy** » Mar 27, 2017 8:08 pm

Anyone watching this thing they call Question Time? How in the hell did UKIP get so many people into the audience?

Talk about one sided. Why is UKIP there? They are not a party in Westminster. It is a typical BBC farce.

ronmcd · **#6817** by **ronmcd** » Mar 27, 2017 8:22 pm

Scot Dutchy wrote:Anyone watching this thing they call Question Time? How in the hell did UKIP get so many people into the audience?

Talk about one sided. Why is UKIP there? They are not a party in Westminster. It is a typical BBC farce.

I forgot it was on, I'll catch it later on ... Alex Salmond is on I believe? Always entertaining, as much because of how much the anti independence brigade on social media *hate* the man :smile:

Even my dad hates him :smile:

but I always like watching him.

Byron · **#6818** by **Byron** » Mar 27, 2017 8:51 pm

Corneel wrote:
Alan B wrote:
[...] But [Michel Barnier] warned it could only be agreed “provided that it ensures fair competition and guarantees high environmental, social and consumer protection standards”.
My Bold.
I see. Does the EU trade with Saudi Arabia, China, India, etc.?

Seems like double standards here.

If the UK is satifisfied with getting the deal that those countries are getting at the moment, then there is no need for negociation over those points. It seems that Ms May is looking for a bit more.

Exactly, she wants EEA membership in all but name, with unrestricted access to the single market and the financial passport. With Britain's economy built on financial services, Brussels holds all the cards.

Byron · **#6819** by **Byron** » Mar 27, 2017 8:53 pm

Scot Dutchy wrote:Anyone watching this thing they call Question Time? How in the hell did UKIP get so many people into the audience?

Talk about one sided. Why is UKIP there? They are not a party in Westminster. It is a typical BBC farce.

They've been packing the audience for months. It's a joke, rarely worth watching, although Eck's always entertaining.

Byron · **#6820** by **Byron** » Mar 27, 2017 8:58 pm

And more generally, the BBC's been hopelessly subservient to Whitehall since the Hutton report castrated the corporation back in '04, forcing the resignation of its chairman and director general.

It's always been establishment, but at least used to have some measure of independence, and seriously challenged the government of the day. Now it's just a Whitehall Pravda, doing the government's bidding. Right now, that's bigging up Brexit: once May and her pack of bastards are driven from office, Auntie will bellow Ode to Joy if she's ordered.

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