UN Panel seem confused re idea of being a fugitive.

Think Assange claiming asylum is same as jail?

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Re: UN Panel seem confused re idea of being a fugitive.

#501  Postby GrahamH » May 19, 2017 9:31 am

Today's development follows a letter sent to the Swedish government by the government of Ecuador saying there had been a "serious failure" by the prosecutor, including a "lack of initiative" to complete inquiries.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/05 ... stigation/
Why do you think that?
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Re: UN Panel seem confused re idea of being a fugitive.

#502  Postby proudfootz » May 19, 2017 9:47 am

There's some good news, at least.
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Re: UN Panel seem confused re idea of being a fugitive.

#503  Postby Macdoc » May 19, 2017 11:48 am

I suspect there is some aspect of the degradation of world leadership by the dumpf ...no need to curry favour with an idjit. :coffee:
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Re: UN Panel seem confused re idea of being a fugitive.

#504  Postby monkeyboy » May 19, 2017 5:06 pm

I see in the bullshit surrounding this story, Assange is whining about spending "7 years of detention without charge" instead of 7 years dodging being charged. I still have little sympathy for this man who chose to skip bail and hide from being arrested whilst in plain view moaning about the length of time his case took when he was the one holding it up.
The poor victim in this piece is the person who accused him of rape who never got their day in court. 7 years hoping to have a shot at justice and someone decides it's not worth it any more.
No doubt Assange will get sympathy from some but not from here. He's nothing but a victim of his own choices.
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Re: UN Panel seem confused re idea of being a fugitive.

#505  Postby Macdoc » May 19, 2017 5:34 pm

Do you actually understand the circumstances.....I don't think so...

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-12-07/j ... ns/8099276

Let's take one single point

Agreed facts to the UK Supreme Court 2012 Ecuador Foreign Minister Ricardo Paino Asylum Grant Press Conference transcript
6. Assange has already been cleared and the woman says the police made it up in order to ’get him’. On August 25 2010, Assange was cleared of the suspicion of ’rape’ by Stockholm’s Chief Prosecutor Eva Finne, who stated she "made the assessment that the evidence did not disclose any offence of rape". On 25 of August, the prosecutor stated that "The conduct alleged disclosed no crime at all and that file (K246314-10) would be closed".

The case was only resurrected after a politician, Claes Borgstrom, intervened in the case. The police report states that she felt “railroaded by police and others around her”. While she was at the police station to inquire about HIV tests she sent messages to friends saying that she that she "did not want to put any charges on JA but that the police were keen on grabbing him" (14:26) and “did not want to accuse JA for anything”; that “it was the police who made up the charges”; and that she was “shocked when they arrested JA" because she "only wanted him to take a [HIV] test” (17:06).
Agreed facts to the UK Supreme Court 2012


You better read the entire thing as you clearly have zero understanding of it

https://justice4assange.com/assange-cas ... ecker.html

It's been a witch hunt from the get go ....even the girl he was with acknowledged that....that she did not want him charged with anything and just wanted him to have a STD test.....

Your view is substantially flawed...... just what don't you understand about this?

Stockholm’s Chief Prosecutor Eva Finne, who stated she "made the assessment that the evidence did not disclose any offence of rape".
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Re: UN Panel seem confused re idea of being a fugitive.

#506  Postby monkeyboy » May 19, 2017 6:10 pm

Think you'll find I have had a clear understanding since I started this thread and contributed heavily to it earlier.
He chose to put himself in there to avoid being charged. He skipped bail from a UK court to try to fight this from outside of a court. He has not been detained since he skipped bail, he has been a fugitive.
Had he not been in hiding he would have been charged. Whether anyone thinks the charges were spurious or not, he chose his manner of dealing with them, by hiding out in the embassy. He was not detained. It's not really so complicated.
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Re: UN Panel seem confused re idea of being a fugitive.

#507  Postby monkeyboy » May 19, 2017 6:14 pm

Hmm, the plaintiff is "shocked" the charges have been dropped and if he steps foot in Sweden before 2020 when the statute of limitations end, he could well be charged. Sounds like both of us are reading different scripts here.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-39979343
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Re: UN Panel seem confused re idea of being a fugitive.

#508  Postby tuco » May 19, 2017 6:44 pm

Lets assume he is indeed innocent of charges in Sweden, for sake of argument.

Mr Samuelson told Agence France-Presse: "This implies that we can now demonstrate that the US has a will to take action... this is why we ask for the arrest warrant to be cancelled."


Would it make sense that an innocent man, and not just any man but .. wikileaks man, would skip bail and hide when watchers of justice were after him? It would. It happens all the time where there is no rule of law. Would it be right?

"My legal staff have contacted the UK authorities and we hope to engage in a dialogue about what will be the best way forward," he added, saying he was also "happy to engage" with the US.


To be seen.

I guess it comes down to faith in justice system.
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Re: UN Panel seem confused re idea of being a fugitive.

#509  Postby Byron » May 19, 2017 6:55 pm

So not only does Assange evade justice, but having succeed, he doesn't even do Britain the favor of leaving her shores never to return. Talk about lose-lose.
I don't believe in the no-win scenario.
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Re: UN Panel seem confused re idea of being a fugitive.

#510  Postby Byron » May 19, 2017 7:01 pm

monkeyboy wrote:[...] He chose to put himself in there to avoid being charged. He skipped bail from a UK court to try to fight this from outside of a court. He has not been detained since he skipped bail, he has been a fugitive. [...]

And in the process of jumping bail, betrayed the trust of his sureties, costing them tens of thousands they could ill-afford to lose. Hero to some.
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Re: UN Panel seem confused re idea of being a fugitive.

#511  Postby tuco » May 19, 2017 7:39 pm

Possibly. To another its lets say unpleasant case questioning the rule of law. Its not comfortable not to have (complete) confidence in justice system.
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Re: UN Panel seem confused re idea of being a fugitive.

#512  Postby monkeyboy » May 19, 2017 7:49 pm

tuco wrote:Lets assume he is indeed innocent of charges in Sweden, for sake of argument.
.

I sooner would not. This has not been demonstrated. Charges have been dropped because they can't charge him because he's been a fugitive for the last 5 yrs hiding from facing charges. That's not the same as it being decided there's no case to prosecute.
The chief prosecutor has explained the reasons they have dropped the case for now but has said if he does return, they may well charge him if he returns within the statute of limitations on the case.

As Byron pointed out, he's financially fucked his supporters who funded his bail.

He's frightened of being extradited to the USA because he's likely to be charged regarding actions on Wikileaks. He chose his path at every point and then whines about the consequences. Funny, but life's like that. Actions have consequences. If you're sensible, they don't get you in trouble. If you make choices like he has, well, it clearly goes differently.
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Re: UN Panel seem confused re idea of being a fugitive.

#513  Postby tuco » May 19, 2017 8:40 pm

How come you would not? Innocent until found guilty.

For the sake of argument, for evaluating various scenarios. I dunno if he is innocent or not, well, since there are no charges even no more he is. The question, for me, is: How to deal with it now? Considering he is innocent, considering circumstances.

Sympathy, hero, etc .. that is cool story.

btw I understood the article.
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Re: UN Panel seem confused re idea of being a fugitive.

#514  Postby Thomas Eshuis » May 19, 2017 10:01 pm

Byron wrote:So not only does Assange evade justice, but having succeed, he doesn't even do Britain the favor of leaving her shores never to return. Talk about lose-lose.


How do you figure? The moment he steps outside the embassy the UK police will arrest him.
Or have they changed their mind in the last couple of hours as well?
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Re: UN Panel seem confused re idea of being a fugitive.

#515  Postby ronmcd » May 19, 2017 10:17 pm

Thomas Eshuis wrote:
Byron wrote:So not only does Assange evade justice, but having succeed, he doesn't even do Britain the favor of leaving her shores never to return. Talk about lose-lose.


How do you figure? The moment he steps outside the embassy the UK police will arrest him.
Or have they changed their mind in the last couple of hours as well?

He'll definitely be arrested, he broke the law not handing himself in when required to. Unless the police decide not to have officers 24hrs a day wasting money standing outside an embassy waiting for a dickhead to appear.
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Re: UN Panel seem confused re idea of being a fugitive.

#516  Postby ronmcd » May 19, 2017 10:19 pm

tuco wrote:How come you would not? Innocent until found guilty.

For the sake of argument, for evaluating various scenarios. I dunno if he is innocent or not, well, since there are no charges even no more he is. The question, for me, is: How to deal with it now? Considering he is innocent, considering circumstances.

Sympathy, hero, etc .. that is cool story.

btw I understood the article.

as far as I know, there are still charges, or could be. The prosecutor would still charge him if he went back, they just cant justify continuing an open investigation when there is no likelihood of that happening.
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Re: UN Panel seem confused re idea of being a fugitive.

#517  Postby ronmcd » May 19, 2017 10:20 pm

Byron wrote:
monkeyboy wrote:[...] He chose to put himself in there to avoid being charged. He skipped bail from a UK court to try to fight this from outside of a court. He has not been detained since he skipped bail, he has been a fugitive. [...]

And in the process of jumping bail, betrayed the trust of his sureties, costing them tens of thousands they could ill-afford to lose. Hero to some.

And millions in police time, twiddling thumbs outside.
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Re: UN Panel seem confused re idea of being a fugitive.

#518  Postby tuco » May 19, 2017 10:36 pm

Its hard if not willing to entertain the option that he is indeed innocent, despite that for the time being he in fact is.

Millions in police time, well yes. Democracy, rule of law, is not free. Easiest would be to enter the embassy and arrest him, Chuck Norris style ;)
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Re: UN Panel seem confused re idea of being a fugitive.

#519  Postby Nicko » May 19, 2017 11:15 pm

monkeyboy wrote:He chose to put himself in there to avoid being charged.


You see, assertions like this are what give the impression you don't know thing one about this case.

How exactly would Assange being beyond the reach of the Swedish government prevent them from filing charges against him?

As I pointed out quite a while upthread, if there is enough evidence to lay charges then an interview with Assange wouldn't make that evidence go away, while if there is not enough evidence then an interview wouldn't provide it. If Ny's case is dependent upon getting Assange in an interrogation room and hoping he incriminates himself, she's got no case at all.

The thing that has actually prevented Assange being charged is the lack of evidence.
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Re: UN Panel seem confused re idea of being a fugitive.

#520  Postby Macdoc » May 20, 2017 3:19 am

Which is exactly what the Chief prosecutor stated in the first place.

Then Ny either for personal grandstanding or political influence decided to re-open a case the other party wanted no part of beyond an STD test. The whole thing stinks of US covert interference and goverment fears of whistleblowers. :coffee:
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