"We can save atheism from the New Atheists"

It's all about imperialism, apparently.

Atheism, secularism & freethought etc.

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Re: "We can save atheism from the New Atheists"

#21  Postby truelgbt » Oct 03, 2018 9:44 pm

The 'New Atheism' engenders a certain 'in your face' and confrontational type of discourse, if it can even be called discourse. It is associated with lots of cussing, swearing, and demeaning of opposing views. They label others 'intolerant', 'hateful' and 'fundamentalist' while they themselves exhibit many of the same poor behaviors. Such individuals (Dawkins, etc.) do not deserve any platform to represent atheism. I completely remove myself from them.
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Re: "We can save atheism from the New Atheists"

#22  Postby Keep It Real » Oct 03, 2018 9:48 pm

I'm sure we're all beside ourselves with inconsolable grief you don't count yourself among us currently.
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Re: "We can save atheism from the New Atheists"

#23  Postby Thomas Eshuis » Oct 03, 2018 10:04 pm

truelgbt wrote:The 'New Atheism' engenders

There's no such thing, it's a dismissive slur made up by theists, similar to 'evolutionist' or 'Darwinist'.

truelgbt wrote:a certain 'in your face' and confrontational type of discourse, if it can even be called discourse. It is associated with lots of cussing, swearing, and demeaning of opposing views.

False, it's a straw-man erected to dismiss atheism.

truelgbt wrote: They label others 'intolerant', 'hateful' and 'fundamentalist' while they themselves exhibit many of the same poor behaviors. Such individuals (Dawkins, etc.) do not deserve any platform to represent atheism.

They don't. Atheism isn't like organised religion. No-one speaks for atheism on behave of all atheists.
"Respect for personal beliefs = "I am going to tell you all what I think of YOU, but don't dare retort and tell what you think of ME because...it's my personal belief". Hmm. A bully's charter and no mistake."
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Re: "We can save atheism from the New Atheists"

#24  Postby Hermit » Oct 04, 2018 9:26 am

truelgbt wrote:The 'New Atheism'...

...is a term adopted by the same mob that came up with 'Social Justice Warriors', 'snowflakes' and 'libtards'.

truelgbt wrote:They label others 'intolerant', 'hateful' and 'fundamentalist' while they themselves exhibit many of the same poor behaviors. Such individuals (Dawkins, etc.) do not deserve any platform to represent atheism. I completely remove myself from them.

Damn. I suppose you'll knock back my request to act as my assistant. I have a couple of projects in the planning stages to promote 'New Atheism'. I need a bomb maker to blow up a couple of abortion clinics and a copilot to help me land a plane in a skyscraper.
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Re: "We can save atheism from the New Atheists"

#25  Postby Hermit » Oct 04, 2018 9:43 am

Thomas Eshuis wrote:
truelgbt wrote:The 'New Atheism' engenders

There's no such thing, it's a dismissive slur made up by theists, similar to 'evolutionist' or 'Darwinist'.

Not so. The term was coined by Gary Wolf, who describes himself as a lax agnostic and a noncommittal nonbeliever, in 2006.
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Re: "We can save atheism from the New Atheists"

#26  Postby Thomas Eshuis » Oct 04, 2018 9:55 am

Hermit wrote:
Thomas Eshuis wrote:
truelgbt wrote:The 'New Atheism' engenders

There's no such thing, it's a dismissive slur made up by theists, similar to 'evolutionist' or 'Darwinist'.

Not so. The term was coined by Gary Wolf, who describes himself as a lax agnostic and a noncommittal nonbeliever, in 2006.

The way it is used today is what I meant, no the origin of the word itself.
"Respect for personal beliefs = "I am going to tell you all what I think of YOU, but don't dare retort and tell what you think of ME because...it's my personal belief". Hmm. A bully's charter and no mistake."
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Re: "We can save atheism from the New Atheists"

#27  Postby Fallible » Oct 04, 2018 3:16 pm

truelgbt wrote:The 'New Atheism' engenders a certain 'in your face' and confrontational type of discourse, if it can even be called discourse. It is associated with lots of cussing, swearing, and demeaning of opposing views. They label others 'intolerant', 'hateful' and 'fundamentalist' while they themselves exhibit many of the same poor behaviors. Such individuals (Dawkins, etc.) do not deserve any platform to represent atheism. I completely remove myself from them.


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Re: "We can save atheism from the New Atheists"

#28  Postby Keep It Real » Oct 04, 2018 3:28 pm

Please dry your eyes Fal! I'm sure truelgbt will come round one day!... :cry: ...oh no you've got me started now...truelgbt! Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo :waah:
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Re: "We can save atheism from the New Atheists"

#29  Postby Fallible » Oct 04, 2018 3:38 pm

DAMN IT ALL TO HELL!!!!!! :whine:
She battled through in every kind of tribulation,
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She never listened to no hater, liar,
Breaking boundaries and chasing fire.
Oh, my my! Oh my, she flies!
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Re: "We can save atheism from the New Atheists"

#30  Postby Blackadder » Oct 04, 2018 4:01 pm

Old atheists, new atheists, vintage atheists, ancient atheists, lightly used atheists, refurbished atheists. Who gives a shit?
Last edited by Blackadder on Oct 04, 2018 4:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: "We can save atheism from the New Atheists"

#31  Postby Keep It Real » Oct 04, 2018 4:05 pm

Shut up Blackadder! I think truelgbt might be serious!
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Re: "We can save atheism from the New Atheists"

#32  Postby Blackadder » Oct 04, 2018 4:14 pm

Serious? Damn right it’s serious. Labels are a form of oppression. I feel threatened and demand a safe space from the categorisation fascists.
That credulity should be gross in proportion to the ignorance of the mind that it enslaves, is in strict consistency with the principle of human nature. - Percy Bysshe Shelley
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Re: "We can save atheism from the New Atheists"

#33  Postby scott1328 » Oct 04, 2018 4:15 pm

Blackadder wrote:Serious? Damn right it’s serious. Labels are a form of oppression. I feel threatened and demand a safe space from the categorisation fascists.

So that makes you a Snowflake?
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Re: "We can save atheism from the New Atheists"

#34  Postby laklak » Oct 04, 2018 4:19 pm

Theists are all about schisms.
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Re: "We can save atheism from the New Atheists"

#35  Postby Blackadder » Oct 04, 2018 4:21 pm

scott1328 wrote:
Blackadder wrote:Serious? Damn right it’s serious. Labels are a form of oppression. I feel threatened and demand a safe space from the categorisation fascists.

So that makes you a Snowflake?


Waaaah! I see what you did there!
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Re: "We can save atheism from the New Atheists"

#36  Postby Alan B » Oct 07, 2018 1:12 pm

Blackadder wrote:Old atheists, new atheists, vintage atheists, ancient atheists, lightly used atheists, refurbished atheists. Who gives a shit?


I'm a pure atheist. :snooty:
I have NO BELIEF in the existence of a God or gods. I do not have to offer evidence nor do I have to determine absence of evidence because I do not ASSERT that a God does or does not or gods do or do not exist.
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Re: "We can save atheism from the New Atheists"

#37  Postby Calilasseia » Oct 07, 2018 5:10 pm

truelgbt wrote:The 'New Atheism' engenders a certain 'in your face' and confrontational type of discourse, if it can even be called discourse.


Which tends to happen whenever those of us who paid attention in class, see the same tired old and repeatedly destroyed canards being peddled yet again, by someone who thinks said canards constitute some fantastic brand of wisdom. In such circumstances, we're allowed to express our exasperation however we wish.

Plus, we're also pretty sick and tired of seeing the usual suspects claiming that robust dismantling of bad ideas is "confrontational". That's how proper discourse is conducted - bad ideas are dismantled.

Meanwhile, I'm also darkly amused to see someone responsible for numerous ad hominems in this thread, now posture as being in a position to lecture the rest of us on proper conduct of discourse.

Finally, I'm aware of the fact that a treatise resembling Dawkins' The God Delusion, both in substance and style, was written in 1732 by Jean Meslier, a former Catholic priest. So the idea that there's anything "new" about robust, vigorous defence of atheism in the face of supernaturalist duplicity, is another of those bad ideas we dismantle here.

truelgbt wrote:It is associated with lots of cussing, swearing, and demeaning of opposing views.


Oh look, tone policing. Yawn.

Come back when you've learned to distinguish between attacks on substance, and attacks on style, the latter frequently deployed by supernaturalists as a means of trying to preserve the stolen privileges they think their ideas should have.

truelgbt wrote:They label others 'intolerant', 'hateful' and 'fundamentalist' while they themselves exhibit many of the same poor behaviors.


Poppycock.

Here's a clue for you. We distinguish properly between the ideas and the person. Not least because we're aware of the fact that a person can change the ideas he or she holds. Persons are treated with at least a certain elementary level of courtesy. Ideas, on the other hand, are a free-fire zone.

truelgbt wrote: Such individuals (Dawkins, etc.) do not deserve any platform to represent atheism. I completely remove myself from them.


Who cares? Quite a few people here have substantive bones to pick with Dawkins over his handling of a past forum, but we'll still judge his ideas on merit.
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