Our existence and behavior undermines their beliefs: we exist and we're demonstrably not that bad, giving the lie to scriptures that say we're foolish and evil, particularly that one that says not one of us does any good.

I do often wonder if religions never claimed to be true in the first place would there be such arguements between atheists and theists (with agnostics in the middle) along with the religious and the non-religious.

Many different answers to this one; depends on the theist you ask.

For many, I think it's as simple as they see it as an either/or: You are either on God's side, or Satan's (or on God's side, or opposing God). So inadvertently or not, atheists then are on the wrong, 'evil' side.

Then you have the "How can you be good without (the authority of) God?", combined with a form of Just World Hypothesis.

Slave mentality? Perhaps he has a point, but I think he overdoes it a bit. However, there are Bible verses (NT) which seem to support his basic idea:

John 6:65-68 wrote:And he said, "This is why I told you that no one can come to me unless it is granted him by the Father." | After this many of his disciples turned back and no longer walked with him. | So Jesus said to the Twelve, "Do you want to go away as well?" | Simon Peter answered him, "Lord, to whom shall we go? You have the words of eternal life,

So basically there was no where else to go.

Then you have other verses that have been used to further the 'us vs. them' attitude, like Luke 13:25-28:

When once the master of the house has risen and shut the door, and you begin to stand outside and to knock at the door, saying, 'Lord, open to us,' then he will answer you, 'I do not know where you come from.' | Then you will begin to say, 'We ate and drank in your presence, and you taught in our streets.' | But he will say, 'I tell you, I do not know where you come from. Depart from me, all you workers of evil!' | In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when you see Abraham and Isaac and Jacob and all the prophets in the kingdom of God but you yourselves cast out.

And you have passages that imply or state outright that people are chosen, and that if they are not convinced by the power of the message, then they are not 'meant to be', and you can as a Christian then 'shake the dust off your feet at them' and walk on.

In most Christian's minds though (of those who would say atheists are evil), I think the first two reasons I mentioned would come to mind first.

We are soul murderers. We are not like normal sinners sending themselves to hell, we are encouraging the whole of humanity to burn in hell.

All those things - what has only been hinted at is that many theists just cannot get their heads around the concept of just not believing. So we get the ridiculousness of them feeling we are just being disobedient or rebellious (disobeying God is a massive crime to those ones), or actively supporting "the other side".

And if you define yourself and your group as good, it's easy to regard anyone who doesn't belong automatically becomes not good, and those completely antithetical to it become evil.

How often do we hear "atheism is just another religion"?
We have picked the wrong religion in their minds. Christ, look at how many of the fuckers kill people of their own religion, let alone followers of different religions. Protestants vs catholics, sunnis vs shi-ites, etc etc
I imagine that's one reason, plus we eat babies.

Na - kitten recipes! Is it true a kitten dies every time someone plays with themselves?

Clive Durdle wrote:Na - kitten recipes! Is it true a kitten dies every time someone plays with themselves?

They're doing it wrong.

I think he's essentially correct, although not comprehensive.

Ultimately, it stems from fear. It's precisely the same root as racism, homophobia, etc. We fear what we don't understand, and the one thing that the believer doesn't understand is that it's possible to live without belief, and to think for oneself, and to formulate one's own paradigm for living, and it frightens them horribly.

An interesting perspective, though.

It is inherently evil to point out that the emperor has no clothes when all others have deluded themselves into thinking that the emperor is draped in fine silk shirts, satin britches, and sable robes.

Indeed, and if it weren't for the Courtier's Reply...

Mister Agenda wrote:Our existence and behavior undermines their beliefs: we exist and we're demonstrably not that bad.

What you say doesn't make any sense. Of course from an atheistic perspective (ie from whatever moral code du jour the majority of atheists adhere to) you're not that bad. You're probably even better than a lot of Christians. However, from a Christian perspective, you ARE demonstrably that bad, since you aren't a Christian. According to Christianity, you are guilty of the worst possible act of evil, rejecting Christ. In other words, you are morally worse than a pedophile, or a serial killer. Pedophiles and serial killers can ultimately have their sins washed away by Christ's blood; atheists can't, since they deny the very mechanism that allow them to wash away their sins and evil.

hackenslash wrote:I think he's essentially correct, although not comprehensive.

Ultimately, it stems from fear. It's precisely the same root as racism, homophobia, etc. We fear what we don't understand, and the one thing that the believer doesn't understand is that it's possible to live without belief, and to think for oneself, and to formulate one's own paradigm for living, and it frightens them horribly.

An interesting perspective, though.

Hon, you seem to forget a lot of people become Christian after years of being intectually duped by the atheist flavor of the day. Alister McGrath comes to mind. How can people possibly fear something they fully understand, since they used to be atheist themselves?

ispoketoanangel wrote:What you say doesn't make any sense. Of course from an atheistic perspective (ie from whatever moral code du jour the majority of atheists adhere to) you're not that bad. You're probably even better than a lot of Christians. However, from a Christian perspective, you ARE demonstrably that bad, since you aren't a Christian. According to Christianity, you are guilty of the worst possible act of evil, rejecting Christ. In other words, you are morally worse than a pedophile, or a serial killer. Pedophiles and serial killers can ultimately have their sins washed away by Christ's blood; atheists can't, since they deny the very mechanism that allow them to wash away their sins and evil.

Only an insane person could put a pedophile or serial killer above an law-abiding atheist. If this represents your beliefs it is truly disgusting and deserves to be exposed for the perverse sham that it is.