Peanut Gallery: "Existence of ghosts & apparitions"

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Peanut Gallery: "Existence of ghosts & apparitions"

#1  Postby Thommo » May 16, 2010 9:25 pm

This is the peanut gallery for the formal debate between Jerome and Campermon on the topic

"Some Ghost cases may represent discarnate consciousness or the remote operation of a living human consciousness".


Observers and interested parties are free to post here, but it's probably best if the two participants refrain from commenting here during the debate.

The debate thread can be found here:-

formal-debates/formal-debate-existence-of-ghosts-apparitions-t6927.html

Good luck to both Jerome who will be arguing for the postion and Campermon who will be arguing against the proposition.
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Re: Peanut Gallery: "Existence of ghosts & apparitions"

#2  Postby Thommo » May 16, 2010 9:29 pm

Perhaps Life would be so kind as to provide a link to the peanut gallery from the debate thread itself?
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Re: Peanut Gallery: "Existence of ghosts & apparitions"

#3  Postby hackenslash » May 16, 2010 9:34 pm

Woohoo! About time the formal debate forum were christened. I shall watch with interest, but quite probably without comment. Let battle commence!
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Re: Peanut Gallery: "Existence of ghosts & apparitions"

#4  Postby LIFE » May 16, 2010 9:51 pm

Thommo wrote:Perhaps Life would be so kind as to provide a link to the peanut gallery from the debate thread itself?


I wanted to open a comment thread myself but you beat me to it :smug:

I'll link it in a sec :thumbup:

Btw, maybe add a poll once the debate starts?
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Re: Peanut Gallery: "Existence of ghosts & apparitions"

#6  Postby Thommo » May 16, 2010 9:53 pm

LIFE wrote:
Thommo wrote:Perhaps Life would be so kind as to provide a link to the peanut gallery from the debate thread itself?


I wanted to open a comment thread myself but you beat me to it :smug:

I'll link it in a sec :thumbup:

Btw, maybe add a poll once the debate starts?


Oh sorry, I probably jumped the gun! Thanks for setting this up and yes, adding a poll would be a good idea at the end of the debate assuming Jerome and Campermon think it's appropriate! :cheers:
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Re: Peanut Gallery: "Existence of ghosts & apparitions"

#7  Postby LIFE » May 16, 2010 9:57 pm

Thommo wrote:
LIFE wrote:
Thommo wrote:Perhaps Life would be so kind as to provide a link to the peanut gallery from the debate thread itself?


I wanted to open a comment thread myself but you beat me to it :smug:

I'll link it in a sec :thumbup:

Btw, maybe add a poll once the debate starts?


Oh sorry, I probably jumped the gun! Thanks for setting this up and yes, adding a poll would be a good idea at the end of the debate assuming Jerome and Campermon think it's appropriate! :cheers:


No problem! Everything that means less work for me is fine by me too :D
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Re: Peanut Gallery: "Existence of ghosts & apparitions"

#8  Postby hackenslash » May 16, 2010 9:57 pm

Please add smiley to database.

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Re: Peanut Gallery: "Existence of ghosts & apparitions"

#10  Postby Lion IRC » May 17, 2010 6:19 am

Of course people can PM either party with ideas/input.
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Re: Peanut Gallery: "Existence of ghosts & apparitions"

#11  Postby Lion IRC » May 17, 2010 6:42 am

I would think the best approach in the debate would be to show that "ghost" equates to "soul".
A force which I call “soul” (ghost) can be proven to exist by scientific method. Take a rock and drop it. Physics can predict quite accurately what will happen to the rock. The rock will land on the floor and remain there until……???
………until I walk over and pick it up.

I can lift the rock using my own free will/volition. Physics cannot predict when or if I will pick up the rock. Physics has no name for the unpredictable and VERY REAL force acting upon the matter of my shoulder, my arm, my hand, the rock in the EXACT OPPOSITE DIRECTION of gravity. It is not hormones – hormones are matter. It is not brain – brain cells are matter. Matter has no free will. It is not electricity. A light switch needs someone to turn it on or off.

The evidence is a physical rock being moved by a force unpredictable in physics. It is not a matter of you measuring how big/heavy/long/wide the soul is. Why let yourself be forced to accept an argument framed in terms of empirical proof.

If you can establish the existence of incarnate free will and join the dots with/to "soul", then "ghost" is a piece of cake. (Out of body experience, mental telepathy, mind over matter, placebo effect - all related)

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Re: Peanut Gallery: "Existence of ghosts & apparitions"

#12  Postby z8000783 » May 17, 2010 6:48 am

Lion IRC wrote:I would think the best approach in the debate would be to show that "ghost" equates to "soul".
A force which I call “soul” (ghost) can be proven to exist by scientific method. Take a rock and drop it. Physics can predict quite accurately what will happen to the rock. The rock will land on the floor and remain there until……???
………until I walk over and pick it up.

I can lift the rock using my own free will/volition. Physics cannot predict when or if I will pick up the rock. Physics has no name for the unpredictable and VERY REAL force acting upon the matter of my shoulder, my arm, my hand, the rock in the EXACT OPPOSITE DIRECTION of gravity. It is not hormones – hormones are matter. It is not brain – brain cells are matter. Matter has no free will. It is not electricity. A light switch needs someone to turn it on or off.

The evidence is a physical rock being moved by a force unpredictable in physics. It is not a matter of you measuring how big/heavy/long/wide the soul is. Why let yourself be forced to accept an argument framed in terms of empirical proof.

If you can establish the existence of incarnate free will and join the dots with/to ................ "soul", then ................ "ghost" is a piece of cake. (Out of body experience, mental telepathy, mind over matter, placebo effect - all related)

A little more detail in the dots would be required I think.

John
Last edited by z8000783 on May 17, 2010 6:54 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Peanut Gallery: "Existence of ghosts & apparitions"

#13  Postby Lion IRC » May 17, 2010 6:53 am

We shall see.
Perhaps "quantum weirdness" will be enough for a blurred connection to suffice.
Energy IN or OUT of a "living" body might "appear" identical.
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Re: Peanut Gallery: "Existence of ghosts & apparitions"

#14  Postby z8000783 » May 17, 2010 7:03 am

I think we need a new Law like Goodwin's, or perhaps a Conjecture will do - whenever the word Quantum appears in a discussion then rational discourse comes to an end.

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Re: Peanut Gallery: "Existence of ghosts & apparitions"

#15  Postby tnjrp » May 17, 2010 7:05 am

Bookmarking this thread (and the debate, by proxy)
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Re: Peanut Gallery: "Existence of ghosts & apparitions"

#16  Postby josephchoi » May 17, 2010 7:06 am

:popcorn:
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Re: Peanut Gallery: "Existence of ghosts & apparitions"

#17  Postby jerome » May 17, 2010 12:03 pm

I know we are not meant to comment, I just wanted to "bookmark" the comment thread by adding to "Your Posts" so I can steal any ideas! I shall have to debate the Metratron and AE next, on a different topic. :)
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Re: Peanut Gallery: "Existence of ghosts & apparitions"

#18  Postby tnjrp » May 17, 2010 12:08 pm

Well, my hint ATM is to not use the word "quantum" unless actually refering to sub-atomic physics... Inspired by z8000783 of course :teef:

Good luck to both you and Campermon :cheers:
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Re: Peanut Gallery: "Existence of ghosts & apparitions"

#19  Postby jerome » May 17, 2010 1:22 pm

Submitted opening statement. Can a moderator approve it please? :)
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Re: Peanut Gallery: "Existence of ghosts & apparitions"

#20  Postby Tbickle » May 17, 2010 1:27 pm

:coffee:
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