The Properties of Angels

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Re: The Properties of Angels

#21  Postby falasha » Jun 23, 2010 5:22 pm

Angel comes from the Aramaic words En Gel. En Gel means Living waters of the covenant stone. Living waters of the covenant stone was the "Good News" that Jesus spread throughout eretz Israel (but is not the same thing as the New Testament.) Engel/Injeel/Enjil came to mean 'message' or 'messenger'. The messengers of ancient Israel/Canaan were the first born male without blemish that passed through the fire. In other words, male children were burnt alive in the Kippurah to become messengers between the physical world and god. The most holy angel was Enoch who passed through the fire to become Metatron and sit at the right hand of God as he rode through the sky on his merkavah (throne). Metatron was also the scribe of God and translated his messages to men. The tradition of supernatural beings messengers of god began in Nilotic valley where the winged scarab guarded the throne of Isis. The scarab became cherub but retained the youth and innocence (male only) of the sacrificed children. These sacrifices also were the inspiration for Houris who were virgin messengers without gender and is what Islamic men will be rewarded with upon entry to Paradise. There was another post that said the angels were the beings that were buggered by priests. Actually, that is kind of correct. This undercurrent of pederasty is still very much alive in the Bacha Bazi but has roots in ancient child sacrifice.
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Re: The Properties of Angels

#22  Postby Abstract-Art » Jun 23, 2010 9:53 pm

falasha wrote:Angel comes from the Aramaic words En Gel. En Gel means Living waters of the covenant stone. Living waters of the covenant stone was the "Good News" that Jesus spread throughout eretz Israel (but is not the same thing as the New Testament.) Engel/Injeel/Enjil came to mean 'message' or 'messenger'. The messengers of ancient Israel/Canaan were the first born male without blemish that passed through the fire. In other words, male children were burnt alive in the Kippurah to become messengers between the physical world and god. The most holy angel was Enoch who passed through the fire to become Metatron and sit at the right hand of God as he rode through the sky on his merkavah (throne). Metatron was also the scribe of God and translated his messages to men. The tradition of supernatural beings messengers of god began in Nilotic valley where the winged scarab guarded the throne of Isis. The scarab became cherub but retained the youth and innocence (male only) of the sacrificed children. These sacrifices also were the inspiration for Houris who were virgin messengers without gender and is what Islamic men will be rewarded with upon entry to Paradise. There was another post that said the angels were the beings that were buggered by priests. Actually, that is kind of correct. This undercurrent of pederasty is still very much alive in the Bacha Bazi but has roots in ancient child sacrifice.


I said based upon what the BIBLE said not the APOCRYPHA.
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Re: The Properties of Angels

#23  Postby chippy » Jun 23, 2010 11:16 pm

The line between BIBLE and APOCRYPHA is so thin, how is one to discern between the two? Both are equally spurious
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Re: The Properties of Angels

#24  Postby twistor59 » Jun 24, 2010 6:50 am

Abstract-Art wrote:

I said based upon what the BIBLE said not the APOCRYPHA.


According to the bible, angels have super-strength. Isn't there some bit in Jesus' resurrection where it says:

"an angel rolled away the stone, and sat upon it" (can't be arsed to look it up, but certain biblical phrases are burnt into my brain and always will be).
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Re: The Properties of Angels

#25  Postby chippy » Jun 24, 2010 11:32 am

twistor59 wrote:
Abstract-Art wrote:

I said based upon what the BIBLE said not the APOCRYPHA.


According to the bible, angels have super-strength. Isn't there some bit in Jesus' resurrection where it says:

"an angel rolled away the stone, and sat upon it" (can't be arsed to look it up, but certain biblical phrases are burnt into my brain and always will be).


Well, one must ask how the stone got there in the first place. Turns out a mere mortal :roll:, Joseph, rolled it into place by himself. Mathew 27:60

The angel came and rolled it away three days later. Mathew 28:2

So. In order to find "evidence" for super strength angels, we'd have to determine the topography of the ground around the mouth of the tomb. Otherwise, nothing suggests that this angel was any stronger than a mortal, that I'm aware of.
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Re: The Properties of Angels

#26  Postby twistor59 » Jun 24, 2010 12:09 pm

Ah well, Joseph was clearly on the juice !
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Re: The Properties of Angels

#27  Postby chippy » Jun 24, 2010 12:19 pm

twistor59 wrote:Ah well, Joseph was clearly on the juice !
:shhh: :shhh:


:lol: Just had an old image pop into my head from an old sat night live... "We-uh gonna ... pomp... :clap: ... you op!"
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Re: The Properties of Angels

#28  Postby falasha » Jun 24, 2010 4:38 pm

Abstract-Art wrote:
falasha wrote:Angel comes from the Aramaic words En Gel. En Gel means Living waters of the covenant stone. Living waters of the covenant stone was the "Good News" that Jesus spread throughout eretz Israel (but is not the same thing as the New Testament.) Engel/Injeel/Enjil came to mean 'message' or 'messenger'. The messengers of ancient Israel/Canaan were the first born male without blemish that passed through the fire. In other words, male children were burnt alive in the Kippurah to become messengers between the physical world and god. The most holy angel was Enoch who passed through the fire to become Metatron and sit at the right hand of God as he rode through the sky on his merkavah (throne). Metatron was also the scribe of God and translated his messages to men. The tradition of supernatural beings messengers of god began in Nilotic valley where the winged scarab guarded the throne of Isis. The scarab became cherub but retained the youth and innocence (male only) of the sacrificed children. These sacrifices also were the inspiration for Houris who were virgin messengers without gender and is what Islamic men will be rewarded with upon entry to Paradise. There was another post that said the angels were the beings that were buggered by priests. Actually, that is kind of correct. This undercurrent of pederasty is still very much alive in the Bacha Bazi but has roots in ancient child sacrifice.


I said based upon what the BIBLE said not the APOCRYPHA.


None of this will be found in any apocryphal texts or any book of the bible. The one exception is Enoch myth and was thought to have been brought with the group of Israelites that left Egypt.
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Re: The Properties of Angels

#29  Postby Shrunk » Jun 24, 2010 4:46 pm

In Islam, angels are made out of light. Jinn, OTOH, are made out of smoke, IIRC, and are further distinguished from angels by having wills of their own.

I can't recall if anyone offered an explanation why, if they are made of light or smoke, we can't see them.
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Re: The Properties of Angels

#30  Postby Teuton » Jun 25, 2010 5:45 pm

Shrunk wrote:In Islam, angels are made out of light. Jinn, OTOH, are made out of smoke, IIRC, and are further distinguished from angels by having wills of their own.


All beings that are made out of something are material beings. But angels are said to be purely spiritual, i.e. wholly immaterial, beings; and to be immaterial is to consist of nothing.
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Re: The Properties of Angels

#31  Postby Shrunk » Jun 25, 2010 5:57 pm

Teuton wrote:
Shrunk wrote:In Islam, angels are made out of light. Jinn, OTOH, are made out of smoke, IIRC, and are further distinguished from angels by having wills of their own.


All beings that are made out of something are material beings. But angels are said to be purely spiritual, i.e. wholly immaterial, beings; and to be immaterial is to consist of nothing.


Is light considered "something"? I would think it would be, but of course I wouldn't be surprised if Muhammed got that wrong.
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Re: The Properties of Angels

#32  Postby Teuton » Jun 25, 2010 6:11 pm

Shrunk wrote:
Is light considered "something"? I would think it would be, but of course I wouldn't be surprised if Muhammed got that wrong.


Photons or electromagnetic waves are physical somethings, but I doubt that any physicist will affirm that there could be conscious living beings solely consisting of light.
By the way, the philosophical notion of an angel is that of a completely nonphysical being, while the notions of angels and other spirits one finds in religious folk mythology are ones of "paraphysical" beings:

"We commonly think that we, as persons, have both a mental and a bodily dimension—or mental aspects and material aspects. Something like this dualism of personhood, I believe, is common lore shared across most cultures and religious traditions, although it is seldom articulated in the form of an explicit set of doctrines as in modern western philosophy and some developed theologies. It is often part of this 'folk dualism' that we are able to survive bodily deaths, as souls or spirits, and retain all or most of the mental aspects of ourselves, such as memory, the capacity for thought and volition, and traits of character and personality, long after our bodies have crumbled to dust.
Spirits and souls as conceived in popular lore seem not be entirely without physical properties, if only vestigially physical ones, and are not what Descartes and other philosophical dualists would call souls or minds—wholly immaterial and nonphysical substances with no physical properties whatever. For example, souls are commonly said to leave the body when a person dies and rise upward toward heaven, indicating that they are thought to have, and be able to change, locations in physical space. And they can be heard and seen, we are told, by people endowed with special powers and in an especially propitious frame of mind. Souls are sometimes pictured as balls of bright light, causing the air to stir as they glide through space and even emitting faint unearthly sounds. But souls and spirits depicted in stories and literature, and in films, are not the immaterial minds of the serious dualist. These latter souls are wholly immaterial and entirely outside physical space."


(Kim, Jaegwon. Physicalism or Something Near Enough. Princeton, NJ: Princeton University Press, 2005. p. 73)
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Re: The Properties of Angels

#33  Postby falasha » Jun 25, 2010 11:14 pm

For example, souls are commonly said to leave the body when a person dies and rise upward toward heaven, indicating that they are thought to have, and be able to change, locations in physical space

Ancient child sacrifice is probably the source of this myth. The sacrificed child would be annoited (shiach - to be made humble) with oil. Shiach is the root word of Messiah. Then the child would be placed in the arms of the Tophet (furnace - from the root; to burn) and the mechanism would vault the child into the mouth of the Tophet where a fire was burning. Subsequent smoke rising up toward the sky was considered the Shekinah or spirit of the child. Even today, the Jews have a custom whereby the parents of a male child (without blemish) gives the Rabbi a bribe of silver coins. They do not give the bribe if the child is a girl or if the male child is imperfect in some way.
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Re: The Properties of Angels

#34  Postby Mitts » Jun 30, 2010 4:55 pm

Twelvety!

:dance:
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Re: The Properties of Angels

#35  Postby OHSU » Jun 30, 2010 8:17 pm

One of the most important attributes of angels is the cleavage.

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Re: The Properties of Angels

#36  Postby Fallible » Jun 30, 2010 8:45 pm

It's good to see they have lip gloss in Heaven.
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Re: The Properties of Angels

#37  Postby The_Metatron » Jun 30, 2010 8:48 pm

It's obvious to the most casual observer that Batman would easily win the Angel -v- Superman deathmatch.
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Re: The Properties of Angels

#38  Postby chippy » Jul 01, 2010 12:01 pm

The_Metatron wrote:It's obvious to the most casual observer that Batman would easily win the Angel -v- Superman deathmatch.


You under-estimate the value of distraction. That is one angel that could have her way with Batman while he is all like ...
:jawdrop: :naughty2: ;) :dance:
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Re: The Properties of Angels

#39  Postby MrFungus420 » Jul 02, 2010 4:39 am

Teuton wrote:
Shrunk wrote:In Islam, angels are made out of light. Jinn, OTOH, are made out of smoke, IIRC, and are further distinguished from angels by having wills of their own.


All beings that are made out of something are material beings. But angels are said to be purely spiritual, i.e. wholly immaterial, beings; and to be immaterial is to consist of nothing.


Angels, demons and gods explained in three words...
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Re: The Properties of Angels

#40  Postby MrFungus420 » Jul 02, 2010 4:43 am

Fallible wrote:It's good to see they have lip gloss in Heaven.


I think this is needed now (mildly NSFW)

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QmZYIyySxPE[/youtube]
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