UK: Belief in ghosts is rising

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Re: UK: Belief in ghosts is rising

#21  Postby tolman » Sep 18, 2013 8:44 pm

What *kind* of belief are we talking about though?

Belief for entertainment (as Kaleid suggested), or belief that actually affects someone's behaviour?

Someone can 'believe' in Bigfoot, but if they live in Essex and don't even get to the point of spending a few quid buying a book about Bigfoot, what is the meaning of the belief?
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Re: UK: Belief in ghosts is rising

#22  Postby jerome » Sep 18, 2013 8:51 pm

tolman wrote:What *kind* of belief are we talking about though?

Belief for entertainment (as Kaleid suggested), or belief that actually affects someone's behaviour?

Someone can 'believe' in Bigfoot, but if they live in Essex and don't even get to the point of spending a few quid buying a book about Bigfoot, what is the meaning of the belief?



Exactly. When Dave Wood was designing the survey questions I asked exactly that. I can share with you some of the data though I think - well here it is anyway --

More than Half of Britons believe in Ghosts - Key Findings:
- 52% of Britons agreed to a greater or lesser extent with the question: I believe some people have experienced ghosts
- This is an increase on previous polls in 2005 (40%, Gallup) and 2009 (39%, Comres)
- 42% of British men believe in ghosts compared to 63% of women
- People aged 35-44 were most likely to believe (61%) whilst 18-24 were least likely (40%)
- Class was not a big indicator (ABC1 at 53% and C2DE at 52%)
- People from the East Midlands are most likely to believe (65%) and London the least (45%)
- 22% of people reported having had a paranormal experience, the majority of these (at 15%) being ghost experiences

Drop in Belief in UFOs in Britain - Key Findings:
- 39% of Britons agreed to a greater or lesser extent with the question: I believe some people have witnessed UFOs
- This is down from 44% in 2010 (YouGov)
- Fewer men believe in UFOs (36%) compared to women (41%)
- People aged 35-44 were most likely to believe (49%) whilst 18-24 were least likely (31%)
- Class was not a big indicator (ABC1 at 37% and C2DE at 40%)
- People from the North East are most likely to believe (51%) and London and the South West the least (32%)
- 2% of people reported having seen a UFO, down on previous studies suggesting one in ten people had seen UFOs.

You can probably find analysis somewhere at http://www.assap.ac.uk

However I totally agree tolman, as a (former) RE lecturer I would draw a firm distinction between professed beliefs and behaviours...

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Re: UK: Belief in ghosts is rising

#23  Postby Wortfish » Oct 22, 2018 11:41 pm

Fallible wrote:I think it gives people who like a quick ''fix'' some excitement in their lives, something that is mysterious. I speak from personal experience. I tried so desperately to believe in ghosts, because I just loved that delicious feeling of being spooked. I still do, I love a good ghost story. But I gave up the fight some years ago now to convince myself that they were somehow real.

They exist. Deal with it.
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Re: UK: Belief in ghosts is rising

#24  Postby The_Piper » Oct 23, 2018 2:55 am

Wortfish wrote:
Fallible wrote:I think it gives people who like a quick ''fix'' some excitement in their lives, something that is mysterious. I speak from personal experience. I tried so desperately to believe in ghosts, because I just loved that delicious feeling of being spooked. I still do, I love a good ghost story. But I gave up the fight some years ago now to convince myself that they were somehow real.

They exist. Deal with it.

I agree about that, The Ghost of Mr Woodchuckles presides over all. If you're good and eat all of your dandelion sprouts, He will provide you with a burrow all to yourself in your own happy little corner of The Great Green Lawn in the Sky. There will be rocks with which to sun yourself in the everlasting and eternal May morning sunshine. Bottomless baskets of nesting material.
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Re: UK: Belief in ghosts is rising

#25  Postby Animavore » Oct 23, 2018 10:30 am

Wortfish wrote:
Fallible wrote:I think it gives people who like a quick ''fix'' some excitement in their lives, something that is mysterious. I speak from personal experience. I tried so desperately to believe in ghosts, because I just loved that delicious feeling of being spooked. I still do, I love a good ghost story. But I gave up the fight some years ago now to convince myself that they were somehow real.

They exist. Deal with it.

Show me.
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Re: UK: Belief in ghosts is rising

#26  Postby Fallible » Oct 23, 2018 4:59 pm

Wortfish wrote:
Fallible wrote:I think it gives people who like a quick ''fix'' some excitement in their lives, something that is mysterious. I speak from personal experience. I tried so desperately to believe in ghosts, because I just loved that delicious feeling of being spooked. I still do, I love a good ghost story. But I gave up the fight some years ago now to convince myself that they were somehow real.

They exist. Deal with it.


The more you simply insist, the less likely I am to believe you. Deal with it.
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If I hear that fucking phrase again, this baby's gonna blow
Into a million itsy bitsy tiny pieces, don't you know,
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Re: UK: Belief in ghosts is rising

#27  Postby Scot Dutchy » Oct 23, 2018 5:59 pm

Bloody amazing. This is the 21st century? Here we are discussing ghosts. Mental.
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Re: UK: Belief in ghosts is rising

#28  Postby Blackadder » Oct 23, 2018 7:41 pm

Scot Dutchy wrote:Bloody amazing. This is the 21st century? Here we are discussing ghosts. Mental.


Not everyone has joined the 21st Century. Some people are still trapped in 15th Century beliefs.
That credulity should be gross in proportion to the ignorance of the mind that it enslaves, is in strict consistency with the principle of human nature. - Percy Bysshe Shelley
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Re: UK: Belief in ghosts is rising

#29  Postby Hamster » Oct 23, 2018 11:11 pm

Why anyone would concern themselves with believing in nonsense like ghosts is beyond me.
It's zombies people! They're coming.
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Re: UK: Belief in ghosts is rising

#30  Postby Scot Dutchy » Oct 24, 2018 6:47 am

Blackadder wrote:
Scot Dutchy wrote:Bloody amazing. This is the 21st century? Here we are discussing ghosts. Mental.


Not everyone has joined the 21st Century. Some people are still trapped in 15th Century beliefs.


I agree that is part of the problem but they did receive some formal education?
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Re: UK: Belief in ghosts is rising

#31  Postby Blackadder » Oct 25, 2018 8:29 am

Scot Dutchy wrote:
Blackadder wrote:
Scot Dutchy wrote:Bloody amazing. This is the 21st century? Here we are discussing ghosts. Mental.


Not everyone has joined the 21st Century. Some people are still trapped in 15th Century beliefs.


I agree that is part of the problem but they did receive some formal education?


Without doubt. But receiving an education and taking it on board are different things. As my late grandfather used to say, “You can load a donkey’s back with books, but that won’t make him any wiser.”
That credulity should be gross in proportion to the ignorance of the mind that it enslaves, is in strict consistency with the principle of human nature. - Percy Bysshe Shelley
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Re: UK: Belief in ghosts is rising

#32  Postby Wortfish » Nov 11, 2018 8:14 pm

trubble76 wrote:As I think Einstein once said, some people are really fucking stupid. :coffee:


As someone who has seen a ghost or spirit, I can categorically respond that you are ignorant.
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Re: UK: Belief in ghosts is rising

#33  Postby Fallible » Nov 11, 2018 9:53 pm

You've seen the sum total of fuck-all, and you know it.
John Grant wrote:They say 'let go, let go, let go, you must learn to let go'.
If I hear that fucking phrase again, this baby's gonna blow
Into a million itsy bitsy tiny pieces, don't you know,
Just like my favourite scene in Scanners .
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Re: UK: Belief in ghosts is rising

#34  Postby zulumoose » Nov 12, 2018 6:31 am

To my mind the best argument against the supernatural/spirits/ghosts etc is simply that everywhere education and science are advancing, such beliefs are receding. When such beliefs are on the rise, it is a sure sign the public are disillusioned and society is heading backwards

If there were truth to these beliefs, then we would see the opposite pattern at least somewhere, investigations would lead to some promising verifications, and more scrutiny, and some acceptance, and further investigation until something was confirmed. For that not to happen, there would have to be a ridiculous conspiracy among all possible investigators to leave it only to people who can be easily dismissed as wonky charlatans.
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Re: UK: Belief in ghosts is rising

#35  Postby Wortfish » Nov 12, 2018 1:28 pm

Fallible wrote:You've seen the sum total of fuck-all, and you know it.


How arrogant of you! Eye witness testimony does matter!
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Re: UK: Belief in ghosts is rising

#36  Postby Fallible » Nov 12, 2018 2:03 pm

You don't have any.
John Grant wrote:They say 'let go, let go, let go, you must learn to let go'.
If I hear that fucking phrase again, this baby's gonna blow
Into a million itsy bitsy tiny pieces, don't you know,
Just like my favourite scene in Scanners .
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Re: UK: Belief in ghosts is rising

#37  Postby laklak » Nov 13, 2018 3:16 am

From ghoulies and ghosties
And long-leggedy beasties
And things that go bump in the night,
Good Lord, deliver us!

Lol. Cat spirits, ghosts, God - what next, vampires and werewolves?
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Re: UK: Belief in ghosts is rising

#38  Postby BlackBart » Nov 13, 2018 10:01 am

Wortfish wrote:
Fallible wrote:You've seen the sum total of fuck-all, and you know it.


How arrogant of you! Eye witness testimony does matter!


Unless we have some method of differentiating eye witness testimony from fabrication, confabulation and delusion it's worthless.
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Re: UK: Belief in ghosts is rising

#39  Postby electricwhiteboy » Nov 13, 2018 12:33 pm

Wortfish wrote:
trubble76 wrote:As I think Einstein once said, some people are really fucking stupid. :coffee:


As someone who has seen a ghost or spirit, I can categorically respond that you are ignorant.


As someone who has seen the literal devil in a church yard, a manifestation witnessed by others, I can still categorically respond that it's all bollocks.

No I don't suffer from hallucinations, no I wasn't on drugs, etc. Nothing like that happened to me before or since. I looked the fucker directly in the eyes and watched him disappear before me. Just fear is enough to make you see things that are not there. Eyewitness testimony, from personal experience, can be complete bollocks. There are sound explanations for why what we sometimes see with our own eyes is not the objective truth.
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Re: UK: Belief in ghosts is rising

#40  Postby Scot Dutchy » Nov 13, 2018 1:49 pm

The mind is a magnificent piece of kit. It easily plays tricks on you. I often see the image of my late girlfriend around the place. Just my mind. After her death it was far worse. :ask:
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