The Final Battle Between Love & Hate

jamest · #1 by **jamest** » Nov 24, 2018 1:50 am

I've lost count of the times I've heard some dummy 'inform' me that God is love (as a mantra). So, I've decided to investigate.

To my shame, I've rarely pondered the prospect of an omnipresent God - essentially the only existing entity - being 'essentially loving'. However since I've finally gotten around to doing so I've realised that such an entity could not be essentially loving since fundamentally it would have nothing to love but itself. That's not really a problem though, as we might discuss, as God is not some relative puppet character such as Donald Trump.

Prior to this discussion, note that an omnipresent God cannot of course 'hate' anyone because there would be (essentially) nobody else to hate. So, without a doubt, though we could say that God has the capacity to hate, we cannot say that God hates anyone/anything except in ignorance of its own reality. The bottom-line is that hatred is an emotion which cannot occur, except relative to the notion that other entities exist according to a God in ignorance of its own reality, which runs at the heart of my philosophy to you all here.

Therefore, the conclusion(s) wrt my idealism is that Absolute Love is very-much different to relative love and that Absolute Hate (The Devil) is hence badgered up the...

I.e.: Whereas the Absolute Love of God is facilitated by my idealism, yet severely shatfed by relativism, the devil turns out to be yet another cunt with a sore arsehole.

In other words, according to my philosophy. God exists and the notion of Absolute Love is credible, whereas The Devil does not and the notion of Absolute Hell cannot.

Discuss, or else take the piss. It matters not in the end for any puppet. What does matter is that you're only a puppet for as long as you decide to act like one. The clue there is that you all have the capacity to escape the brainwashing currently afflicting you.

Cito di Pense · #2 by **Cito di Pense** » Nov 24, 2018 6:45 am

jamest wrote:In other words, according to my philosophy. God exists and the notion of Absolute Love is credible, whereas The Devil does not and the notion of Absolute Hell cannot.

The Final Battle Between Love And Hate? Isn't this overplaying it a bit, even for you? You're doing the best you can, I'm sure.

Are you trying to explain why everything isn't just hunky-dory?

Or is everything really hunky-dory, and you're the one who's just not getting it?

Or is everything really hunky-dory, and you're just trying to make sure everyone knows it? Or maybe I'm the shepherd and you're the tyranny of evil men.

There's certainly a lot of conversation around here about the way things are just not all hunky-dory. Whatever happened to the good old notion that this is the best of all possible worlds? If this really is an optimum, any efforts to change things just make it worse, which is certainly what we should conclude, if we're not just trying to dream perfection into reality. If it is, instead, the worst of all possible worlds, anything we change makes it better. Be the change you wish to see in the world!

jamest wrote:The clue there is that you all have the capacity to escape the brainwashing currently afflicting you.

Who do you suppose is responsible for that? I mean, God is everything, after all. My conclusion is that everything works according to specs. It's not a bug -- it's a feature!

laklak · #3 by **laklak** » Nov 24, 2018 10:37 pm

I was going to have "HATE" tattooed on one set of knuckles and "LOVE" on the other, but then I remembered they were already named "Iron" and "Steel".

SafeAsMilk · #4 by **SafeAsMilk** » Nov 25, 2018 2:28 am

Cito di Pense wrote:
jamest wrote:The clue there is that you all have the capacity to escape the brainwashing currently afflicting you.

Who do you suppose is responsible for that? I mean, God is everything, after all. My conclusion is that everything works according to specs. It's not a bug -- it's a feature!

I'm still waiting to hear why, since god specifically brainwashed himself, jamest finding out that he's been brainwashed doesn't ruin the plan.

LucidFlight · #5 by **LucidFlight** » Nov 25, 2018 3:19 am

I have heard that one should love oneself One's self before experiencing to love experienced others.

laklak · #6 by **laklak** » Nov 25, 2018 3:28 am

So, are you experienced? Have you ever been experienced? Well, I have.

Not necessarily stoned, but beautiful.

jamest · #7 by **jamest** » Nov 27, 2018 2:23 am

Cito di Pense wrote:
jamest wrote:In other words, according to my philosophy. God exists and the notion of Absolute Love is credible, whereas The Devil does not and the notion of Absolute Hell cannot.

The Final Battle Between Love And Hate? Isn't this overplaying it a bit, even for you? You're doing the best you can, I'm sure.

I'm the whole hog, henceforth.

Are you trying to explain why everything isn't just hunky-dory?

No, I'm trying to explain why it's ALL shit. Even the beauty of the Lake District, etc..

Or is everything really hunky-dory, and you're the one who's just not getting it?

I'm not the first unhappy person who ever lived, if that's the question.

Or is everything really hunky-dory, and you're just trying to make sure everyone knows it? Or maybe I'm the shepherd and you're the tyranny of evil men.

You're akin to an intelligent wolf/fox, seeking a kill. That doesn't position you above 'me' though I suspect that you realise this, though if mistaken I make no apologies for saying so. You've certainly failed to kill me after numerous attempts. I'm still here, according to my sensations.

Cito di Pense · #8 by **Cito di Pense** » Nov 27, 2018 7:01 am

jamest wrote:
You're akin to an intelligent wolf/fox, seeking a kill. That doesn't position you above 'me' though I suspect that you realise this, though if mistaken I make no apologies for saying so. You've certainly failed to kill me after numerous attempts. I'm still here, according to my sensations.

I'm just waiting for you to motivate the story that what's going on is the final battle between love and hate. I could simply decide to believe it, if only I could make myself believe something because you told me it has lovely consequences, but without proving anything formally. Of course, logic is the last thing you want to engage. The emotional appeal is in full swing again, this time with a predator-prey model.

jamest wrote:
Cito di Pense wrote:Are you trying to explain why everything isn't just hunky-dory?

No, I'm trying to explain why it's ALL shit. Even the beauty of the Lake District, etc..

Well, you seem to claim you can make something better, and that is how you are positioning yourself 'above' vs. 'below'. Even I have modest aims in terms of making something better. That just gets us into the same holier-than-thou game that's cropped up in another AGW/carbon offsets thread lately, and in which I remark that public piety is visible even among atheists. You're not wrong that a particular defect is the one-upmanship game, but unless you believe we're something other than just ground apes competing for social status (which you do, manifestly), it's hard to see a path to salvation that does not come into being by fiat. That's no vehicle.

bogdan9310 · #9 by **bogdan9310** » Feb 07, 2019 12:42 pm

I have this idea that emotions are just more complex thoughts. By changing your thought patterns, you can manipulate emotions. Has anyone tried NLP?

LucidFlight · **#10** by **LucidFlight** » Feb 07, 2019 12:52 pm

I read somewhere (I can't remember where) that emotions evolved from our motor functions. Also, have you noticed that the word emotion contains motion? Uncanny.

Cito di Pense · **#11** by **Cito di Pense** » Feb 07, 2019 1:12 pm

bogdan9310 wrote:I have this idea that emotions are just more complex thoughts. By changing your thought patterns, you can manipulate emotions. Has anyone tried NLP?

Me, I have this idea that ideas are just ideas. There's also this idea that spoons are just spoons. Bending them is easy, as long as you don't try to do it just by manipulating your emotions.

Mike_L · **#12** by **Mike_L** » Feb 07, 2019 1:19 pm

jamest wrote:...
Prior to this discussion, note that an omnipresent God cannot of course 'hate' anyone because there would be (essentially) nobody else to hate. So, without a doubt, though we could say that God has the capacity to hate, we cannot say that God hates anyone/anything except in ignorance of its own reality.
...

The Bible is the true word of God, and...

2“I have loved you,” says the Lord. But you say, “How have you loved us?” “Is not Esau Jacob’s brother?” declares the Lord. “Yet I have loved Jacob 3 but Esau I have hated. I have laid waste his hill country and left his heritage to jackals of the desert.”

Malachi 1:2–3

:grin:

Thommo · **#13** by **Thommo** » Feb 07, 2019 1:28 pm

laklak wrote:I was going to have "HATE" tattooed on one set of knuckles and "LOVE" on the other, but then I remembered they were already named "Iron" and "Steel".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RRh0QiX ... u.be&t=114

surreptitious57 · **#14** by **surreptitious57** » Feb 07, 2019 1:30 pm

bogdan9310 wrote:
I have this idea that emotions are just more complex thoughts
By changing your thought patterns you can manipulate emotions . Has anyone tried NLP ?

You can also change behaviour by changing your thought patterns
In psychology this is known as Cognitive Behavioral Therapy / CBT
I know nothing at all about NLP or how effective it is by comparison

bogdan9310 · **#15** by **bogdan9310** » Feb 07, 2019 4:14 pm

Cito di Pense wrote:
bogdan9310 wrote:I have this idea that emotions are just more complex thoughts. By changing your thought patterns, you can manipulate emotions. Has anyone tried NLP?

Me, I have this idea that ideas are just ideas. There's also this idea that spoons are just spoons. Bending them is easy, as long as you don't try to do it just by manipulating your emotions.

You deny everything I say. Don't you think this is personal somehow?

bogdan9310 · **#16** by **bogdan9310** » Feb 07, 2019 4:15 pm

surreptitious57 wrote:
bogdan9310 wrote:
I have this idea that emotions are just more complex thoughts
By changing your thought patterns you can manipulate emotions . Has anyone tried NLP ?

You can also change behaviour by changing your thought patterns
In psychology this is known as Cognitive Behavioral Therapy / CBT
I know nothing at all about NLP or how effective it is by comparison

Right, check out this thread.
http://www.rationalskepticism.org/post2 ... P#p2679303

felltoearth · **#17** by **felltoearth** » Feb 07, 2019 10:18 pm

Thommo wrote:
laklak wrote:I was going to have "HATE" tattooed on one set of knuckles and "LOVE" on the other, but then I remembered they were already named "Iron" and "Steel".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RRh0QiX ... u.be&t=114

My mom and dad were in the iron and steel business. My mom ironed and my dad stealed.

Thommo · **#18** by **Thommo** » Feb 08, 2019 8:20 am

The Final Battle Between Love & Hate

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