To be haunted

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Re: To be haunted

#121  Postby jamest » Feb 16, 2018 12:35 am

Fallible wrote:Shakespeare didn't say life is a stage.

You're technically right, my apologies. He said that the world's a stage - for life. Yet, if you read his proceeding lines, he clearly believed (as do I) that most of us "players" don't realise this - to the extent that [indeed] life has become integral to the stage.

The point I should be making is that you might want to wipe your make-up off before the end of the show.
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Re: To be haunted

#122  Postby Keep It Real » Feb 16, 2018 12:38 am

"The world's a stage" - sounds a bit narcissistic to me TBH...I am an actooooooooooooooooor - observe and be dazzled by the show! etc.
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Re: To be haunted

#123  Postby SafeAsMilk » Feb 16, 2018 12:47 am

Keep It Real wrote:"The world's a stage" - sounds a bit narcissistic to me TBH...I am an actooooooooooooooooor - observe and be dazzled by the show! etc.

Hey, nobody said the actors are any good.
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Re: To be haunted

#124  Postby jamest » Feb 16, 2018 12:57 am

SafeAsMilk wrote:
Keep It Real wrote:"The world's a stage" - sounds a bit narcissistic to me TBH...I am an actooooooooooooooooor - observe and be dazzled by the show! etc.

Hey, nobody said the actors are any good.

I'm hoping to be up for a badger this year. Or some reward ending in 'r'. Any r in any port... whatever.
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Re: To be haunted

#125  Postby SkyMutt » Feb 16, 2018 4:16 am

jamest wrote:I start a serious thread and [say] 85% of the responses are piss-takes and/or 'politicial' (tribal). And you wonder why it becomes increasingly difficult for me to motivate myself to give 'my' precious time to this place. Really?


Perhaps at least some of your perception of "tribal" response is overblown. When I posted a quote that referred to the views of two well respected mid-20th century historians of the Tudor era, neither of whom can be considered feminists nor even influenced by feminism, you replied with a mini-rant about how "you lot" are "all lost [totally] to your 21st century politics." When I failed to take the bait and addressed your assertions from a historical (not based on 21st century politics) viewpoint, you merely carried on with the same irrelevant line about "your (plural] 21st century pc disgust on the matter." If I weren't already familiar with your posting history on this site I would have found that puzzling.
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Re: To be haunted

#126  Postby Fallible » Feb 16, 2018 7:48 am

jamest wrote:
Fallible wrote:Shakespeare didn't say life is a stage.

You're technically right, my apologies. He said that the world's a stage - for life. Yet, if you read his proceeding lines, he clearly believed (as do I) that most of us "players" don't realise this - to the extent that [indeed] life has become integral to the stage.

The point I should be making is that you might want to wipe your make-up off before the end of the show.


I don't think that's what he meant. The seven ages of man was a common construct, as was the world as a stage. He was pondering the transience of human life, and its cyclical nature. How we come in helpless and leave the same way.
John Grant wrote:They say 'let go, let go, let go, you must learn to let go'.
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Re: To be haunted

#127  Postby Thommo » Feb 16, 2018 11:44 am

jamest wrote:
Thommo wrote:Serious answers in this thread - none.
Serious answer in the serious answers thread - none.

Remind me why you think people should take you seriously?

I start a serious thread and [say] 85% of the responses are piss-takes and/or 'politicial' (tribal). And you wonder why it becomes increasingly difficult for me to motivate myself to give 'my' precious time to this place. Really?


No, I didn't wonder that, I wondered why you think people should take you seriously.

The thing is that you do give the time, you just devote it to back and forth like this, instead of making the serious posts that you say you crave. You did get a few serious questions (not least from me) which you totally ignored. Since you placed your emphasis on the frivolous stuff, you can hardly complain about other people doing the same.
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Re: To be haunted

#128  Postby BWE » Feb 16, 2018 3:53 pm

Haunted is a weird word fer sure. It doesn't really happen to me much in any of its forms, but I've had glimpses of that sort of feeling and it seems to me like the ineffable dread of a chaotic world. Perhaps with a small brick holding a large compartment closed where we keep the realization that it's really all just models and what's really going on is that we are hyper concerned with engineering and have made a really mammoth category error and mistaken being right for being happy. One thing we know for sure, if that compartment gets bumped open even accidentally, it will either lead to enlightenment or to a complete mental breakdown from which recovery is not possible. With the stakes so high, it is hard to completely ignore the compartment and society is our collective effort to do so.
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Re: To be haunted

#129  Postby surreptitious57 » Feb 16, 2018 4:29 pm

I always thought that Shakespeare was referring to how we present ourselves to the world
So like actors on a stage we do not always show who we really are but who we want to be

Regardless of what he actually meant new interpretations will inevitably be put upon his words
And in this digital age it is now easier than ever to present yourself to the world any way at all

I think in days of olde it was harder to maintain a false persona because one had no technology to hide behind
But equally ones social circle would be significantly smaller as a result so it would not really matter that much
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Re: To be haunted

#130  Postby BWE » Feb 16, 2018 6:10 pm

I always saw it not as that we make the world a stage by our actions (presenting ourselves as we would like to be or whatever, something intentional) but that the audience is constructing a narrative from the cues of the actors. Meaning that it behooves one to recognize that we are behind the proscenium arch whenever we are in the presence of others whether we like it or not. It always made me feel a little bit justified for acting erratically.
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Re: To be haunted

#131  Postby jamest » Feb 17, 2018 1:36 am

Fallible wrote:
jamest wrote:
Fallible wrote:Shakespeare didn't say life is a stage.

You're technically right, my apologies. He said that the world's a stage - for life. Yet, if you read his proceeding lines, he clearly believed (as do I) that most of us "players" don't realise this - to the extent that [indeed] life has become integral to the stage.

The point I should be making is that you might want to wipe your make-up off before the end of the show.


I don't think that's what he meant. The seven ages of man was a common construct, as was the world as a stage. He was pondering the transience of human life, and its cyclical nature. How we come in helpless and leave the same way.

I disagree. He clearly marked us as 'players' (actors) on this stage, thus clearly understood that none of us were being ourselves. Unless your argument is (ridiculously) that he was a Buddhist, I don't even know where you're going with this.

I'm not here arguing that the big S had the exact same philosophy as myself, but I don't see how it's possible to write those words and not comprehend that the essence of humanity transcends the world upon which 'it' explores and expresses the fullness of itself.
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Re: To be haunted

#132  Postby SafeAsMilk » Feb 17, 2018 4:39 am

jamest wrote:
Fallible wrote:
jamest wrote:
Fallible wrote:Shakespeare didn't say life is a stage.

You're technically right, my apologies. He said that the world's a stage - for life. Yet, if you read his proceeding lines, he clearly believed (as do I) that most of us "players" don't realise this - to the extent that [indeed] life has become integral to the stage.

The point I should be making is that you might want to wipe your make-up off before the end of the show.


I don't think that's what he meant. The seven ages of man was a common construct, as was the world as a stage. He was pondering the transience of human life, and its cyclical nature. How we come in helpless and leave the same way.

I disagree. He clearly marked us as 'players' (actors) on this stage, thus clearly understood that none of us were being ourselves. Unless your argument is (ridiculously) that he was a Buddhist, I don't even know where you're going with this.

I'm not here arguing that the big S had the exact same philosophy as myself, but I don't see how it's possible to write those words and not comprehend that the essence of humanity transcends the world upon which 'it' explores and expresses the fullness of itself.

You've never actually read it, have you? What it's about is exactly as Fallible said, there's nothing in there at all about "none of us being ourselves".

All the world's a stage,
And all the men and women merely players;
They have their exits and their entrances,
And one man in his time plays many parts,
His acts being seven ages. At first, the infant,
Mewling and puking in the nurse's arms.
Then the whining schoolboy, with his satchel
And shining morning face, creeping like snail
Unwillingly to school. And then the lover,
Sighing like furnace, with a woeful ballad
Made to his mistress' eyebrow. Then a soldier,
Full of strange oaths and bearded like the pard,
Jealous in honor, sudden and quick in quarrel,
Seeking the bubble reputation
Even in the cannon's mouth. And then the justice,
In fair round belly with good capon lined,
With eyes severe and beard of formal cut,
Full of wise saws and modern instances;
And so he plays his part. The sixth age shifts
Into the lean and slippered pantaloon,
With spectacles on nose and pouch on side;
His youthful hose, well saved, a world too wide
For his shrunk shank, and his big manly voice,
Turning again toward childish treble, pipes
And whistles in his sound. Last scene of all,
That ends this strange eventful history,
Is second childishness and mere oblivion,
Sans teeth, sans eyes, sans taste, sans everything.
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Re: To be haunted

#133  Postby UncertainSloth » Feb 17, 2018 7:37 am

Aye, it takes the analogy of the theatre but the representation of each stage is actually fairly literal....theres no further metaphor in there to analyse, the 'playing many parts' refers to the 7 acts/ages/stages of life, nothing more..
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Re: To be haunted

#134  Postby LucidFlight » Feb 17, 2018 7:53 am

UncertainSloth wrote:Aye, it takes the analogy of the theatre but the representation of each stage is actually fairly literal....theres no further metaphor in there to analyse, the 'playing many parts' refers to the 7 acts/ages/stages of life, nothing more..

Perhaps, as an observed Shakespeare, this was the analogy to be had. However, an experienced Shakespeare [existing in Itself] would have imbued more transcendental qualities into the analogy.
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Re: To be haunted

#135  Postby Fallible » Feb 17, 2018 9:05 am

jamest wrote:
Fallible wrote:
jamest wrote:
Fallible wrote:Shakespeare didn't say life is a stage.

You're technically right, my apologies. He said that the world's a stage - for life. Yet, if you read his proceeding lines, he clearly believed (as do I) that most of us "players" don't realise this - to the extent that [indeed] life has become integral to the stage.

The point I should be making is that you might want to wipe your make-up off before the end of the show.


I don't think that's what he meant. The seven ages of man was a common construct, as was the world as a stage. He was pondering the transience of human life, and its cyclical nature. How we come in helpless and leave the same way.

I disagree. He clearly marked us as 'players' (actors) on this stage, thus clearly understood that none of us were being ourselves. Unless your argument is (ridiculously) that he was a Buddhist, I don't even know where you're going with this.


That's because, if I may say so, you seem unfamiliar with the piece in question. Read the last line, which SAM has quoted - '[...]mere oblivion, Sans teeth, sans eyes, sans taste, sans everything'. In case you don't know what 'sans' means, it's 'without'. He's saying that we all go through the same phases in life, life after life after life after life, until we leave it altogether, just as powerless and blind as we were when we came in. 'and all the men and women merely players'- this is all we are, just fleeting walk-ons whose path has been trodden countless times before, nevertheless treading it yet again until we gutter out, all our efforts leaving no mark. In short, the world as a stage is a metaphor, a common one in times gone by, not a literal claim.

I'm not here arguing that the big S had the exact same philosophy as myself,


Good, because that would be silly.

but I don't see how it's possible to write those words and not comprehend that the essence of humanity transcends the world upon which 'it' explores and expresses the fullness of itself.


Word salad notwithstanding, you should know that 'I don't see how' is just about as silly a non-way to argue your point as you could find. Should know.
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If I hear that fucking phrase again, this baby's gonna blow
Into a million itsy bitsy tiny pieces, don't you know,
Just like my favourite scene in Scanners .
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Re: To be haunted

#136  Postby SafeAsMilk » Feb 17, 2018 1:37 pm

Maybe he's thinking of the Rush song, Limelight:

All the world's indeed a stage
And we are merely players
Performers and portrayers
Each another's audience
Outside the gilded cage


Though even that, being about the parts we play, is more about the pitfalls of fame than some sort of comment about who we are.
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Re: To be haunted

#137  Postby UncertainSloth » Feb 17, 2018 1:48 pm

take this line in isolation/out of context andd i think you could place that definition on it - in the context of that speech, which follows on from duke senior's line earlier in the play

Thou seest we are not all alone unhappy.
This wide and universal theatre
Presents more woeful pageants than the scene
Wherein we play in


and it's harder to defend...
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Re: To be haunted

#138  Postby laklak » Feb 17, 2018 5:29 pm

Merely a play? Nonsense. It's a fabulous Broadway production! With Show Tunes!
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Re: To be haunted

#139  Postby UncertainSloth » Feb 17, 2018 5:36 pm

i guess i could be a quiet hero
no one knows the good i've done

e
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