Missouri has officially turned into a warzone

r.c · **#181** by **r.c** » Aug 19, 2014 5:36 am

CNN has the officer's side of the story. Refer to the video report in the link here. If the account is true, it looks like the officer was justified in killing Brown.

Peter Brown · **#182** by **Peter Brown** » Aug 19, 2014 6:41 am

Gallstones wrote:
NONE In The Back: Brown Autopsy Shows He Was Shot In The Front Of The Body
No exit wounds.

Michael Brown suffered a bullet wound to his right arm that may have occurred when he put his hands up or when his back was turned to the shooter, according to a pathologist hired by the teenager's family.

http://news.yahoo.com/none-back-brown-a ... 24156.html

Peter Brown · **#183** by **Peter Brown** » Aug 19, 2014 6:54 am

r.c wrote:CNN has the officer's side of the story. Refer to the video report in the link here. If the account is true, it looks like the officer was justified in killing Brown.

If true then yes it would seem defence was required. Armed or not Michael was a huge man, and not one I'd want running at me.

and now he was a dope smoker

GT2211 · **#184** by **GT2211** » Aug 19, 2014 8:05 am

^^One of the big issues with that video is that he keeps emphasizing that he got hit twice in the head.

But a) the cop was shooting from 35-45 feet away. Him getting struck in the head doesn't indicate that is where was aiming anymore than the shots in the arm indicate he was aiming for his arms. b) as the autopsy's show, Brown had his head lowered. So if Brown had ducked his down and the cop is aiming for center of mass.... Brown's head is right where he is aiming.

I would like to see the police release more details though. they are making themselves look bad with what appears to be slow, selective leaking of information.

Oldskeptic · **#185** by **Oldskeptic** » Aug 19, 2014 8:15 am

GT2211 wrote:
Oldskeptic wrote:
I want to know, and so should you, is how a cop in a police car got his left arm around the neck of a 6'4" Big Mike while the cop was still in his seat? I'll tell you how. Big Mike stuck his head through the window going for the cop. The lying sack of shit and his script writers were too fucking stupid to figure out that you can't just reach out the window of a car and grab a man that tall around the neck.

The cop was not in a car but an SUV I believe so grabbing the collar of his shirt wouldn't be that difficult.

The cop's car may look like an SUV, but it's no taller than a regular car. And the lying sack of shit didn't say that the cop grabbed Big Mike's shirt collar, he said the cop grabbed Big Mike around the neck with his left arm while the cop was sitting in his car.

Then according to the lying sack of shit Big Mike was running away and the cop shot Big Mike in the back. Good story, but according to Baden's autopsy Big Mike wasn't shot in the back.

It seems plausible that he was struck from behind in the arm based upon the location of the bullets. He certainly wasn't running with his hands down and palms forward. I believe Baden's assistant said as much.

Its also plausible that he was shot with his arms up either surrendering or perhaps trying to use them to shield bullets if he were charging. But they aren't locations you would expect to find on someone hit in front who was running in a typical running form.

Really! Running in a typical form involves pumping the arms. Try it. Where the assistant points to his own arm is consistent with a running towards you posture rather than a running away from you posture. Also a head down charging posture is consistent with the shot that hit the eyebrow, deflected out the eye socket, went through the chin, and into the chest. Just as the shot to the top of the head is consistent with a head down charging posture.

I think my plausibles are better than yours.

Seen ten minutes earlier pushing around and threatening a shop clerk and walking out of a store without paying for the cigars he was stealing was just minding his own business when a cop decided to shoot him for no other reason than that he was black. Give me a fucking break.

Here's a scenario for you. Big Mike and his pal are walking down the middle of the road blocking traffic. The cop pulls up and tells them to get out of the road. They tell the cop to fuck off. The cop opens the door of the police car. Big Mike slams it on the cop and goes for the cop through the window. The cop gets his arm around Big Mike's neck, pulls his gun, and shoots Big Mike in the arm. Big Mike backs off out of the car. The cop gets out of the car and 6'4" 300 lb Big Mike is still belligerent, not backing off, so the cop empties his revolver into poor innocent unarmed 6'4" 300 lb Big Mike.

Mike clearly had backed off since his body was found almost 15 yards from where the car was. So he had clearly ran at least that far.

Yeah, and the cop was running after him yelling, "stop," or, "freeze," and Big Mike figures out that he can't get away so comes back at the cop. Boom, boom, boom, boom, boom and poor innocent unarmed 6'4" 300 lb Big Mike isn't coming back at the cop any longer.

He apparently ran quite a bit further if we believe the officers account that Brown turned and was charging at him wouldn't go down despite getting hit multiple times.

Where did the cop say that Big Mike wouldn't go down despite being hit multiple times? That's a new one for me.

So in that case Brown would seem to have sprint at least 20-25 yards away, stopped and turned around then started charging back into the gunfire towards the cop. Not saying that didn't happen but it is bizarre behavior to say the least.

How do you figure that? Who said he was charging back into gunfire? Even if, how much ground do you think a healthy
man can cover in just few seconds at full speed from a standing start? Answer: About 25 yards in three and a half seconds. Even if Big Mike was 50 yards away and came charging back it would only be three and a half seconds until he was 25 yards away. Three and a half more seconds and Big Mike would be on you. Personally I don't want 6'4" 300 lb Big Mike on me. Unarmed or not he's a lethal weapon. How many seconds would you wait? And how many of those 6 or 7 seconds would you spend trying to determine if he was down or not?

And let's not forget that Big Mike was already showing bizarre behavior by robbing a store with video cameras running and manhandling and threatening the clerk.

Are police over reacting? You tell me what you'd want your police to do if protests were turning into looting riots and arson in your town? Yeah! Your town, your street, your business. What the fuck do you want them to do?

There have not been riots, arson, and looting in the town every night. In fact there was no real problems going on Wednesday until the cops showed up with their armored vehicles with snipers on top and the rest of their crew in full body armor and camo pointing rifles demanding the peaceful crowd to go home for no real reason.

Oh, excuse me. There weren't riots, arson, and looting every single night. My bad I guess. The police should have sat on their asses until their psychic could tell them when mayhem was eminent.

That's really a fucked up apologetic. There weren't riots, looting, and arson every night, only a few nights. I guess the demonstrators should have let the police know before hand when and where the riots, looting, and arson would take place so that the police could respond only at the appropriate time and place.

Sciwoman · **#186** by **Sciwoman** » Aug 19, 2014 8:48 am

Was there a robbery?

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2014/08/1 ... igar-Theft
http://aattp.org/ferguson-cops-busted-n ... los-video/

And even if there was, the Ferguson PD has already said that the officer who shot Brown did NOT know anything thing about it.. So it still comes down to the fact that all this started because the officer saw Brown jaywalking - that is all he knew about Brown until long after the shooting.

And what the hell is going on with this:

Dispatch was not even aware of the shooting for several minutes after it happened. And when they contacted dispatch, it was not over the shooting, it was because they were worried about the people gathering. In reality, it took almost half an hour for the transmission of the shooting’s scope to be transmitted to the county dispatch.

http://www.addictinginfo.org/2014/08/15 ... -dispatch/

GT2211 · **#187** by **GT2211** » Aug 19, 2014 9:26 am

Oldskeptic wrote:
GT2211 wrote:
Oldskeptic wrote:
I want to know, and so should you, is how a cop in a police car got his left arm around the neck of a 6'4" Big Mike while the cop was still in his seat? I'll tell you how. Big Mike stuck his head through the window going for the cop. The lying sack of shit and his script writers were too fucking stupid to figure out that you can't just reach out the window of a car and grab a man that tall around the neck.

The cop was not in a car but an SUV I believe so grabbing the collar of his shirt wouldn't be that difficult.

The cop's car may look like an SUV, but it's no taller than a regular car.

Was he not driving the Chevy Tahoe in the YT videos? If he was since when are Chevy Tahoe's no taller than a regular car?

And the lying sack of shit didn't say that the cop grabbed Big Mike's shirt collar,

he said the cop grabbed Big Mike around the neck with his left arm while the cop was sitting in his car.

Sort of true. He said he grabbed his neck and as Mike pulled away got a hold of his shirt.

Then according to the lying sack of shit Big Mike was running away and the cop shot Big Mike in the back. Good story, but according to Baden's autopsy Big Mike wasn't shot in the back.

He didn't get struck in the back no. Its possible he could've got hit in arm from behind though and the autopsy examiners stated as much.

It seems plausible that he was struck from behind in the arm based upon the location of the bullets. He certainly wasn't running with his hands down and palms forward. I believe Baden's assistant said as much.

Its also plausible that he was shot with his arms up either surrendering or perhaps trying to use them to shield bullets if he were charging. But they aren't locations you would expect to find on someone hit in front who was running in a typical running form.

Really! Running in a typical form involves pumping the arms.

No shit sherlock. Nobody ever would've thought that, good thing you are on the case.

Where the assistant points to his own arm is consistent with a running towards you posture rather than a running away from you posture.

No the wound on the forearm is not. Having went just watched that segment of the conference. The assistant makes that explicitly clear. People don't typically walk in the standard anatomical position used where the thumbs are pointing outwards and palms forward. The wound in the forearm would be consistent with moving away from the officer and then discusses it also could've possibly came with him putting his arms up, which was pretty much exactly what I had said.

He starts discussing it at 18:55

Also a head down charging posture is consistent with the shot that hit the eyebrow, deflected out the eye socket, went through the chin, and into the chest. Just as the shot to the top of the head is consistent with a head down charging posture.

I agree on this much, though I don't think its the only plausible explanation. I don't think the autopsy result details that have been released so far settle much of anything.

I think my plausibles are better than yours.

Again, what I stated was the exact same thing that was stated by assistant during conference.

Alright I'm off to bed. Perhaps tom., I'll have time to get to the rest.

GT2211 · **#188** by **GT2211** » Aug 19, 2014 9:43 am

Sciwoman wrote:Was there a robbery?

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2014/08/1 ... igar-Theft
http://aattp.org/ferguson-cops-busted-n ... los-video/

And even if there was, the Ferguson PD has already said that the officer who shot Brown did NOT know anything thing about it.. So it still comes down to the fact that all this started because the officer saw Brown jaywalking - that is all he knew about Brown until long after the shooting.

And what the hell is going on with this:

Dispatch was not even aware of the shooting for several minutes after it happened. And when they contacted dispatch, it was not over the shooting, it was because they were worried about the people gathering. In reality, it took almost half an hour for the transmission of the shooting’s scope to be transmitted to the county dispatch.

http://www.addictinginfo.org/2014/08/15 ... -dispatch/

I think there is pretty clearly a robbery. At no point does it look he tried to pay for anything and it would make no sense for the owner to try and shut him in if he didn't. Also prior to the tape being released I saw a twitter and IG post from workers at the store that seemed to imply that he had stole some cigarellos. I kinda wish I had saved them because i can't remember the handles now and after the video was released there are so many results coming up that searching for them is pointless.

I think the owner doesn't want to be seen as going against the community or responsible for the events. Which is understandable, but I do kinda wonder if his initial denial of having reported any robberies of Brown which was misleading influenced the both the police departments decision to release the video and the reaction to it.

Peter Brown · **#189** by **Peter Brown** » Aug 19, 2014 12:26 pm

cigarellos, oh my, I just looked them up. I thought they were mini thin cigars for a hard man "gangstar" but they are f-n sweets ffs

Wuffy · **#190** by **Wuffy** » Aug 19, 2014 12:30 pm

GT2211 wrote:
Sciwoman wrote:Was there a robbery?

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2014/08/1 ... igar-Theft
http://aattp.org/ferguson-cops-busted-n ... los-video/

And even if there was, the Ferguson PD has already said that the officer who shot Brown did NOT know anything thing about it.. So it still comes down to the fact that all this started because the officer saw Brown jaywalking - that is all he knew about Brown until long after the shooting.

And what the hell is going on with this:

Dispatch was not even aware of the shooting for several minutes after it happened. And when they contacted dispatch, it was not over the shooting, it was because they were worried about the people gathering. In reality, it took almost half an hour for the transmission of the shooting’s scope to be transmitted to the county dispatch.

http://www.addictinginfo.org/2014/08/15 ... -dispatch/
I think there is pretty clearly a robbery. At no point does it look he tried to pay for anything and it would make no sense for the owner to try and shut him in if he didn't. Also prior to the tape being released I saw a twitter and IG post from workers at the store that seemed to imply that he had stole some cigarellos. I kinda wish I had saved them because i can't remember the handles now and after the video was released there are so many results coming up that searching for them is pointless.

I think the owner doesn't want to be seen as going against the community or responsible for the events. Which is understandable, but I do kinda wonder if his initial denial of having reported any robberies of Brown which was misleading influenced the both the police departments decision to release the video and the reaction to it.

Actually I quoted another article earlier that there was no robbery. It was a disagreement and while a foul situation the store owner and his lawyer did not report the event the police came in and demanded for the surveilance.

Edit: Crappy quote positioning.

Oldskeptic · **#191** by **Oldskeptic** » Aug 19, 2014 5:59 pm

Peter Brown wrote:cigarellos, oh my, I just looked them up. I thought they were mini thin cigars for a hard man "gangstar" but they are f-n sweets ffs

Sciwoman · **#192** by **Sciwoman** » Aug 19, 2014 6:28 pm

I have another question. If the officer Brown supposedly assaulted was taken to the hospital for treatment of his injuries, where is the evidence of that? Seems to me that there should at least be a picture or two would have been taken as evidence No EMS ever showed up at the scene either.

Scarlett · **#193** by **Scarlett** » Aug 19, 2014 7:46 pm

There's been another young black guy shot dead by police in Missouri tonight :shock:

http://news.sky.com/story/1321517/suspect-shot-dead-by-police-in-north-st-louis

kennyc · **#194** by **kennyc** » Aug 19, 2014 8:00 pm

Ferguson

It’s about authority without accountability.
It’s about the unacknowledged class structure of America.
It’s about battle lines being drawn between rich and poor haves and have-nots.
It’s about taking cigars from a convenience store by brute force because you can.
It’s about the loss of morals and ethics by all classes.
It’s about entitlement and about everyone being a winner.
Well everyone isn’t a winner, everyone doesn’t have a point, in fact
most of the population is clueless unless you happen to ask about Survivor or
The Voice or those implanted beliefs provided by the endless thirty second spots
because that’s what it’s about.

Kenny A. Chaffin – 8/19/2014

from my Mansions of the Mind blog: http://mansionsofthemind.blogspot.com/2 ... -poem.html

Sciwoman · **#195** by **Sciwoman** » Aug 19, 2014 8:04 pm

Jesus H. Christ! I'm beginning to think that Mississippi has it's act together in the area of race relations better than Missouri.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/08/1 ... 90671.html

Macdoc · **#196** by **Macdoc** » Aug 19, 2014 9:01 pm

t’s about authority without accountability.
It’s about the unacknowledged class structure of America.
It’s about battle lines being drawn between rich and poor haves and have-nots.
It’s about taking cigars from a convenience store by brute force because you can.
It’s about the loss of morals and ethics by all classes.
It’s about entitlement and about everyone being a winner.
Well everyone isn’t a winner, everyone doesn’t have a point, in fact
most of the population is clueless unless you happen to ask about Survivor or
The Voice or those implanted beliefs provided by the endless thirty second spots
because that’s what it’s about.

GT2211 · **#197** by **GT2211** » Aug 19, 2014 9:53 pm

Peter Brown wrote:cigarellos, oh my, I just looked them up. I thought they were mini thin cigars for a hard man "gangstar" but they are f-n sweets ffs

Nah the sweets are popular for younger potsmokers.

Peter Brown · **#198** by **Peter Brown** » Aug 19, 2014 11:14 pm

GT2211 wrote:
Peter Brown wrote:cigarellos, oh my, I just looked them up. I thought they were mini thin cigars for a hard man "gangstar" but they are f-n sweets ffs

Nah the sweets are popular for younger potsmokers.

as are the sweet cigars... they empty the contents and replace it with another leaf, and yep, it was in a vid about the shooting of MB I heard this, from someone on the political right? he blames the left for all the woes anyhow.

But after watching I was left with a large question mark regarding those who are protesting. The community seems to want a culture change and it doesn't look like the powers that be wants to go that route.
Cold Dead Hand with Jim Carrey
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N0Wn3Eey6dY

GT2211 · **#199** by **GT2211** » Aug 20, 2014 9:58 am

Egypt's trolling

The Egyptian foreign ministry has said it is closely watching developments in the US city of Ferguson following clashes between security forces and protesters over the murder of African American teenager Mike Brown last week.

It has called on US authorities to exercise restraint and deal with the protests in accordance with US and international standards, foreign ministry spokesperson Ambassador Badr Abdel-Atti told state news agency MENA.

http://english.ahram.org.eg/News/108764.aspx

Nicko · **#200** by **Nicko** » Aug 20, 2014 10:11 am

Oldskeptic wrote:Yeah, and the cop was running after him yelling, "stop," or, "freeze," and Big Mike figures out that he can't get away so comes back at the cop. Boom, boom, boom, boom, boom and poor innocent unarmed 6'4" 300 lb Big Mike isn't coming back at the cop any longer.

OR

Brown figured he couldn't get away and turned around with his hands up.

Missouri has officially turned into a warzone

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