Posted: Oct 03, 2017 4:54 pm
GrahamH wrote:Do you want principles to be completely universal from continents down to individuals? That' would be utterly ridiculous.
Probably not, if there really were a principle which decided when some group of people was entitled to a secession referendum one would hope it would separate out both of those cases.
In fact there is such a principle - it's enshrined in Spanish law and does just that. The issue is that you've said you reject that principle and then gone on to arbitrate that certain groups (regions of England, counties, towns and so on) are not worthy, but other groups are.
GrahamH wrote:Autonomous regions with their own parliaments are clearly different to county councils, parish councils businesses or individuals. It's absurd to argue that self determination cannot apply to autonomous regions unless it applies to individuals or 'Oxfordshire'.
What constitutes an autonomous region? Why should Oxfordshire or Southeast England not be capable of being such?
Are you saying that the dividing line for who gets a referendum is some specific level of local government already existing and having been granted powers by the same national parliament and same constitution that you reject as getting to decide who gets referenda?
GrahamH wrote:In any case individuals should be free to move, which a region cannot do.
I think yours was the 'pointless jab'.
Actually the "region" you're referring to there is the people of a region, and yes, then can move. You're winding yourself up in semantics again, there was never any suggestion that anything other than people (of a region) would get to vote in a referendum - that would be obviously silly.