Posted: Jul 23, 2013 9:53 am
neilgodfrey wrote:......So Josephus nowhere discusses messianic expectations prior to the Jewish War. Your argument appears to rely upon data that makes no reference to messianic expectations nor even messiahs of any kind, and must in turn find an explanation for that silence in the evidence to justify its use to support a claim that Josephus is talking about messianic movements! That sounds like the sort of apologetic one expects from the most erudite of theologians.
Here is exactly where your argument for an early Paul is utterly flawed.
1. Josephus wrote nothing of messianic expectations until the Jewish War c 70 CE.
Now, explain why the Pauline writers are writing about a character called Jesus the Messiah hundreds of times as if Jesus the Messiah was a household name before the Jewish War c 70 CE.??
The Pauline Corpus mentions Jesus as the Messiah over 380 times.
How could Josephus miss such a prominent Messiah, the Son of God, born of the seed of David which was being proclaimed "all over" the Roman Empire by a Hebrew of Hebrews of the tribe of Benjamin and a former Pharisee?
Let us compare the Epistle to the Romans with gMark--both have 16 chapters.
The author of Romans mentioned Jesus as the Messiah about 68 times
The author of gMark mentioned Jesus as the Messiah ONLY about 8 times.
Examine 1 Corinthians---Jesus called the Messiah about 59 times----gMark Only 8 times.
Examine 2 Corinthians--Jesus called the Messiah about 45 times--gMark Only 8 times.
Examine Galatians---Jesus called the Messiah about 36 times--gMark Only 8 times.
The Pauline Corpus is NOT compatible with Jewish expectations of a Messiah c 70 CE as found in the writings of Josephus, Tacitus and Suetonius.
The Pauline Messiah was unknown by Jewish and Roman writers of the 1st century.
The Pauline Corpus matches a later time period AFTER the writings of Philo, Josephus, Tacitus and Suetonius.
It was in the 2nd century that Jesus the Messiah was a household name in the Roman Empire.
In "Against Celsus" Origen declared that Celsus wrote nothing of Paul.
It is gMark that appears to match the early Jewish and Roman writers of the 1st century---gMark's Messiah was unknown and wanted no-one to know who he was.
Mark 8:30 KJV ------And he charged them that they should tell no man of him.
Up to the writing of gMark, after c 70 CE, no-one was told of a Messiah called Jesus which is completely compatible with the writings of Philo, Josephus, Tacitus and Suetonius.