Posted: May 06, 2015 10:41 pm
by iskander
Nicko wrote:
iskander wrote:Charlemagne made the pope the “emperor maker”; after the coronation the emperor owed the crown to the pope and every emperor after that will have to ask the pope to crown him.

Probably not Charlemagne's idea. Charlemagne seemed to have the attitude that his business was to rule the faithful (including forcibly bringing other peoples into the faith) and the Pope's business was to pray for his success. The Pope seems to have pulled a fast one on Karl de Grossa when he whacked the Imperial Crown on his noggin in the middle of a religious ceremony.

Charlemagne's son was crowned by Charlemagne, not the Pope. Too late as his coronation was the one that stuck in the cultural memory (which, after all, was the whole point of staging memorable public ceremonies in a largely illiterate time).

Charlemagne is only a suitable marker for the beginning of the papal supremacy over the secular power. By 816 the emperor Louis prostrated himself before the pope who crowned him.

In early October, the Pope and Emperor met at Rheims, where Louis prostrated himself three times before Stephen.[6] At Mass on Sunday, 5 October 816, Stephen consecrated and anointed Louis as emperor, placing a crown on his head that was claimed to belong to Constantine the Great...

While with Louis, the emperor gave Stephen a number of presents, including an estate of land (most likely at Vendeuvre-sur-Barse) granted to the Roman church.[10] They also renewed the pact between the Popes and the kings of the Franks, confirming the privileges of the Roman church, and the continued existence of the recently emerged Papal States[/quote]

The involvement of Charlemagne with the pope begins with his father Pippin. Pippin wanted to be king and sought allies, the pope was threatened by the Lombards.

The pope and pippin made a deal, the pope will bless his becoming a king and pippin will defeat the Lombards. In addition , Pippin granted some of the conquered lands in Italy to the pope and thus the Papal States were born.

Charlemagne wanted to conquer Europe and doing this in the name of the official religion of the late Roman Empire would be a holly convenient thing to do, He sought and alliance with the pope and got it. The result of this alliance was the first ever European religious war; Charlemagne made war on the Saxons to convert them to the religion of the pope.