Posted: Apr 16, 2019 10:44 am
by UncertainSloth
Spearthrower wrote:
UncertainSloth wrote:the failing in this particular situation is the length of time it's been applied for such a length of time without other appropriate intervention or action

That's certainly a significant part of it, but there's also the punishment aspect too.

Isolation even for dangerous convicted criminals is considered deeply contentious, with the UN suggesting that, depending on the manner and length, it could be considered torture.

I'm a little distant from the UK now and I've seen some oddities I still struggle to process (like fining parents when kids miss school), and my time in school was unusual (we had a privilege system instead of punishment), but unless suspension and expulsion have been outlawed, then I can't see a distinction betweem a kid that's so irredeemably awful that they need to be isolated in school from other kids and a kid that should just be suspended. If their behavior's not bad enough to warrant suspension, then their behavior's surely not bad enough to warrant isolation?

so you believe it's ok for children to be taken out of school for an extended period of time for what isn't considered an exceptional reason? professionally, i don't believe they're fined enough, that's why it still happens...with the fine, it's still much cheaper to go in term time...the demands for progress are far too high for extended absence to not have an impact...
that said, personally, i'd extend the exceptional reason definition from its current form but that's a different debate

all schools should have positive reinforcement within their behaviour policy, that's not something that's disappeared, but sanctions are, unfortunately, very much needed

the issue with your reference to suspension and exclusion rather than isolation comes to what i mentioned above...those two are far more difficult to achieve than they used to be, especially permanent exclusion...basically, speaking as one who's working within the process at the moment, you have to demonstrate you have exhausted every possible avenue possible to support that's child's exclusion or referral to behavioural unit...this is made even more complex if the child has send
isolation, where it is used, is one of those hoops that has to be jumped through first...

to be clear, i know i'm coming from experience (and only from a uk persepctive) rather than evidence but i'm trying to explain the weaknesses in our system, not defend them and i certainly don't believe it was applied at all correctly in this case as that child's needs should have been catered for within the send policy, not the behavioural...

believe me, as fall said above, the standards of behaviour have changed massively in the last 25 years...i hold my own opinions as to why that is...