Posted: Jun 26, 2010 11:06 am
by CharlieM
Rumraket:
You are making the mistake of thinking about any given line of evidence as seperate from the otheres. If you take it all together, observed speciation, observed micro/macro evolution, our knowledge of the workings of genetics and all the other stuff I listed above, plus more, the simple conclusion is that life evolved. And the geological record shows it.


CharlieM:
I am looking at the details while keeping the whole in mind. As you begin to look outward from the half a dozen proteins I mentioned things only get worse for a naturalistic explanation. These proteins need to work together as part of a whole functioning unit in order to be viable. They must be copied in precise numbers, transported to their correct location in sequence and assembled into the right shape, flexibility, strength and position. Thus you have structural proteins, assembly proteins, regulatory proteins and the rest all working together in a precise manner. And many of these proteins have no known homologs.

Granted your list of stuff giving the bigger picture shows that life developed into what we see today. But this does not show that it was some sort of fortuitous accident. We can observe a human developing from a fertilized egg, this does not mean that there was no plan involved. A point you seem to have forgotten (see below).

Rumraket:
Are we now supposed to believe that intelligent designers returned to earth to finetune living organisms once every, say 100.000 years, over a course of 3.5 billion years just so they can engineer existing life into looking like the slowly evolved? Unless of course, you are now going to say that radiometric dating is false and the change only took place over a course of 6000 years?


CharlieM:
This would be a very simplistic view of how "the designers" operated. Its not my view. And I'm happy to accept any timescale that the evidence supplies. Its all relative anyway.

Rumraket:
Furthermore, I never understood the objection to large-scale speciation in the first place. Creationists often cry about the supposed impossibilites of "macro evolution" with inane references like "We have never observed a fish turn into a cow".

Well, actually.... we have. You did it yourself in nine months. Every fucking animal on earth did. At one point, you, a Blue-Whale, a Bear, an elephant... every fucking mammal was a tiny fishlike creature with a tail inside their mothers womb. And you all turned into a fully grown living member of your extant species, without intervention by any intelligent agent. All you required was time and nutrients. Here you are now... from almost nothing to a huge chunck of flesh. And it was pure, unintelligently guided chemistry and physics. If that can happen... a fish turning into a not-so-much-a-fish-but-with-legs in 20 million years cannot really be said to be a stretch of the imagination.


CharlieM:
I think you are forgetting about the plan that was put in place when you were conceived, your DNA. You could have all the time and nutrients you wanted but nothing would have developed without your DNA.