The Danger of Science Denial - "Alternative Medicine"-Split

Homeopathy, Chiropractic and similar "alternative" views

Discussions on astrology, homeopathy and superstition etc.

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Re: The Danger of Science Denial - "Alternative Medicine"-Sp

#621  Postby Darkchilde » Jun 10, 2010 6:06 pm

wunksta wrote:what the hell am i reading? you are saying that homeopathic doctors are now some kind of voodoo/esp magician and is actually influencing the the patient irrespective to the 'medicine'?


Well, it sure looks like Nancy Malik does not know what entanglement, semiotic and EPR paradox mean or are. She is completely ignorant of quantum physics. She is just putting the word quantum and some sciency-sounding words to her homeopathic woo, so as to attract more gullible people. Many people by listening to the word "quantum" are taken by it, and fall victim to various forms of woo because of those sciency-sounding words, which are used totally out of context, and without even the basic understanding of what they mean and in what context they can be used.

Putting the word quantum, entanglement and EPR paradox in a homeopathic article, is just using sciency-sounding words to draw in the gullible, the ignorant who are trying to cling to some hope, or who for some reason do not trust conventional medicine. But I bet that the writers of the article are ignorant in quantum physics and just took the words from some other quack like Chopra and used them.

I don't think Nancy actually knows what those words are and what they means. Unless of course she has read or studied actual physics.

But:

Quantum: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quantum
Quantum entanglement: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quantum_entanglement
EPR Paradox: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EPR_paradox
Semiotics: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semiotics
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Re: The Danger of Science Denial - "Alternative Medicine"-Sp

#622  Postby Dr. Nancy Malik » Jun 10, 2010 6:07 pm

Darkchilde wrote:Homeopathy talks about the "Memory of Water". if that was true, then water would "remember" a number of dangerous ingredients, like radioactive material, the feces of various humans and animals containing any number of diseases, all diseases and microbes and everything else.

Nancy Malik, please answer the previous questions.


More about "memory of water" concept

http://hubpages.com/hub/Homeopathy-and- ... Benveniste
http://hpathy.com/homeopathy-scientific ... -of-water/
Evidence-based scientific homeopathy is a modern nano-medicine like Conventional Allopathic Medicine (CAM)
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Re: The Danger of Science Denial - "Alternative Medicine"-Sp

#623  Postby wunksta » Jun 10, 2010 6:08 pm

Darkchilde wrote:But I bet that the writers of the article are ignorant in quantum physics and just took the words from some other quack like Chopra and used them.

I don't think Nancy actually knows what quantum is and what it means. Unless of course she has read or studied actual physics.


reminds me of what the bleep do we know :puke:
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Re: The Danger of Science Denial - "Alternative Medicine"-Sp

#624  Postby GenesForLife » Jun 10, 2010 6:09 pm

How do you remove the memory of impurities already present in water? ;)
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Re: The Danger of Science Denial - "Alternative Medicine"-Sp

#625  Postby Darkchilde » Jun 10, 2010 6:10 pm

Dr. Nancy Malik wrote:
Darkchilde wrote:Homeopathy talks about the "Memory of Water". if that was true, then water would "remember" a number of dangerous ingredients, like radioactive material, the feces of various humans and animals containing any number of diseases, all diseases and microbes and everything else.

Nancy Malik, please answer the previous questions.


More about "memory of water" concept

http://hubpages.com/hub/Homeopathy-and- ... Benveniste
http://hpathy.com/homeopathy-scientific ... -of-water/


No, I am not going to lose my time reading those. Please explain it in your own words.
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Re: The Danger of Science Denial - "Alternative Medicine"-Sp

#626  Postby Dr. Nancy Malik » Jun 10, 2010 6:10 pm

Shrunk wrote:
"Some"? So can you name a single conventional drug that has been released to the market without clinical testing on human subjects?



http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style ... 70197.html
Evidence-based scientific homeopathy is a modern nano-medicine like Conventional Allopathic Medicine (CAM)
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Re: The Danger of Science Denial - "Alternative Medicine"-Sp

#627  Postby wunksta » Jun 10, 2010 6:12 pm



more of the bullshit persecution/victim complex
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Re: The Danger of Science Denial - "Alternative Medicine"-Sp

#628  Postby Dr. Nancy Malik » Jun 10, 2010 6:13 pm

Shrunk wrote: Has a single homeopathic remedy been abandoned because it was found to be ineffective or unsafe? If not, how to explain this superhuman infallibility of homeopaths, unique among any human endeavour?


Homeopathic medicines are ultra-dilute doses. This makes them non-toxic, safe and largely free from side effects
Evidence-based scientific homeopathy is a modern nano-medicine like Conventional Allopathic Medicine (CAM)
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Re: The Danger of Science Denial - "Alternative Medicine"-Sp

#629  Postby Shrunk » Jun 10, 2010 6:14 pm

Dr. Nancy Malik wrote:
Moridin wrote:Dr. Nancy Malik, please define, in your own words, the concept of "entanglement", "Semiotic", and "EPR paradox". No cheating.


Macro-Entanglement between Patient, Practitioner and remedy (PPR)
Entanglement means non-local.

Remedy interacts with prover (human) to produce symptoms. Prover can not be removed from the relationship equation.They are entangled (linked) to each other.

analogy: in a modulated signal, message signal and carrier signal are entangled.

Entanglement ensures one will affect the other

Homeopath practitioner acts as the mirror of the patient with the aim of leading to/providing curative remedy for the patient.


Translation: Homeopathy is a placebo.
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Re: The Danger of Science Denial - "Alternative Medicine"-Sp

#630  Postby wunksta » Jun 10, 2010 6:14 pm

Dr. Nancy Malik wrote:Homeopathic medicines are ultra-dilute doses. This makes them non-toxic, safe and largely free from side effects


and free of any benefit
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Re: The Danger of Science Denial - "Alternative Medicine"-Sp

#631  Postby Paul G » Jun 10, 2010 6:15 pm

ANSWER MY FUCKING QUESTION
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Re: The Danger of Science Denial - "Alternative Medicine"-Sp

#632  Postby orpheus » Jun 10, 2010 6:15 pm

Dr. Nancy Malik wrote:
Shrunk wrote: Has a single homeopathic remedy been abandoned because it was found to be ineffective or unsafe? If not, how to explain this superhuman infallibility of homeopaths, unique among any human endeavour?


Homeopathic medicines are ultra-dilute doses. This makes them non-toxic, safe and largely free from side effects


Fixed that for you.
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Re: The Danger of Science Denial - "Alternative Medicine"-Sp

#633  Postby gilthanass » Jun 10, 2010 6:17 pm

Dr. Nancy Malik wrote:
Shrunk wrote:
"Some"? So can you name a single conventional drug that has been released to the market without clinical testing on human subjects?



http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style ... 70197.html


Hahaha, nice one. BTW, did you even read that article? Shrunk asked for a single drug that had been released to market without going through clinical testing (aka drug trials) on humans, and you link an article about a drug trial gone wrong? Hint: that drug wasn't out to market yet, it was still in trial! That was in the first sentence for fuck's sake.
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Re: The Danger of Science Denial - "Alternative Medicine"-Sp

#634  Postby GenesForLife » Jun 10, 2010 6:18 pm

Dr. Nancy Malik wrote:
Shrunk wrote:
"Some"? So can you name a single conventional drug that has been released to the market without clinical testing on human subjects?



http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style ... 70197.html


Typical mendacity, Nancy, this was not released into the market, it was a drugs trial, learn the difference between the two.

The German company whose drug trial has left six men fighting for their lives after it went badly wrong had never tested its products on humans before.

Thomas Hanke, the chief scientific officer of TeGenero, based in Wurzburg, said the company was "devastated" by the news. The new medicine, known as TGN 1412, had shown no safety problems in laboratory trials or animal tests, he said.


In a trial, do you know what they do? They do test it out on humans, I suggest you read what you are posting first to avoid any embarrassment.
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Re: The Danger of Science Denial - "Alternative Medicine"-Sp

#635  Postby Paul » Jun 10, 2010 6:19 pm

Dr. Nancy Malik wrote:
Shrunk wrote: Has a single homeopathic remedy been abandoned because it was found to be ineffective or unsafe? If not, how to explain this superhuman infallibility of homeopaths, unique among any human endeavour?


Homeopathic medicines are ultra-dilute doses. This makes them non-toxic, safe and largely free from side effects


Only 'largely' free from side-effects?

Any example of side-effects that have been experienced from homoeopathic drugs?
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Re: The Danger of Science Denial - "Alternative Medicine"-Sp

#636  Postby GenesForLife » Jun 10, 2010 6:21 pm

Drat, orpheus got there first :D
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Re: The Danger of Science Denial - "Alternative Medicine"-Sp

#637  Postby GenesForLife » Jun 10, 2010 6:22 pm

Zincam and loss of smell, Paul.
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Re: The Danger of Science Denial - "Alternative Medicine"-Sp

#638  Postby orpheus » Jun 10, 2010 6:26 pm

GenesForLife wrote:Zincam and loss of smell, Paul.


Zicam wasn't actually homeopathic. It was marketed that way in order to avoid having to go through FDA approval. That's part of what caused the big flap about it.

Interestingly, it did work - it shortened the duration of cold symptoms. No question about that. But there was that side-effect some people had, of losing their sense of smell.

However, to repeat: it certainly was not homeopathic.
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Re: The Danger of Science Denial - "Alternative Medicine"-Sp

#639  Postby Dr. Nancy Malik » Jun 10, 2010 6:28 pm

Paul G wrote:Are you familiar with M.E? I suffer from it and would be happy for you try and cure me. We could do it on the Rational Skepticism podcast.



Please.....[/quote]

It's bad to know that you are suffering from myalgic encephalomyelitis. If you need to take the help of homeopathy medicine, it would be the best if you consult your local homeopath. But some idea in regard to chronic fatigue syndrome is http://www.homeoint.org/site/vaishnav/cfs.htm
Evidence-based scientific homeopathy is a modern nano-medicine like Conventional Allopathic Medicine (CAM)
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Re: The Danger of Science Denial - "Alternative Medicine"-Sp

#640  Postby Dr. Nancy Malik » Jun 10, 2010 6:31 pm

Shrunk wrote:Except that happened long ago, certainly by the time she denied the germ theory of disease.


False.I have not denied the germ theory of disease. I accept it partially only.
Evidence-based scientific homeopathy is a modern nano-medicine like Conventional Allopathic Medicine (CAM)
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