Reincarnation Myth or Possible?

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Re: Reincarnation Myth or Possible?

#21  Postby Autumn Clouds » Mar 25, 2010 12:50 pm

What do you mean, no way to verify it? Go lift stone number 12,234,222 and see what's chiselled into the bottom of it. If that stone hasn't been moved in 6000 years, and what the subject said would be there is actually there, it would be a pretty good case of evidence to support something like reincarnation.


Not at all Occam's razor in this case would suggest the guy in advance went to stone 12,234,222 and saw the inscription then told everyone it was his doing in a past life (There are plenty of this cases but are dissmised, like the guy who said he was the incarnation of Julius Cesar). Or how about if that inscription contained a name of a guy called John?, How many Johns are there?. Also the memories of past lives aren't that concise, they speak in general terms or very traumatic events that may or may not have occured.

If that knowledge existed (and it did), and it was even possible for that kid to learn of it, it is nothing more than a trick. There are no Buddhists in Brooklyn? This kid couldn't have read this material somewhere? No one at all could have taught it to her, the neighbor down the hall, perhaps?


I see where you're comming from, but trust me buddhism is not a black white, good heaven bad hell religion. It's a rather complex and profound philosophy, I've studied for some time now and I still know squat. She is, you can check her out if you want teaching really advanced philosophical subjects, like the anicca.Could you imagine a child saying the ego is an ilusion?, for there is no permanent self?, and give a coherent explanation (relatively).

Cut away the bullshit with Occam's razor.

I completley agree. If some one tells me about all those verifiable cases of past reminiscence, then... only three theories available. Materialism, Live forever in a cloud or a place with lots of bbq, or conciousness rebirth. Occam's razor would be rather swift.
Again none of these three postitions are or could be accurate, we just lack imagiantion, who knows maybe aliens come steal our conciousness and then implant them on new babies, who in turn forget everything when they grow up?.
We simply don't know.
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Re: Reincarnation Myth or Possible?

#22  Postby The_Metatron » Mar 25, 2010 1:55 pm

Autumn Clouds wrote:
What do you mean, no way to verify it? Go lift stone number 12,234,222 and see what's chiselled into the bottom of it. If that stone hasn't been moved in 6000 years, and what the subject said would be there is actually there, it would be a pretty good case of evidence to support something like reincarnation.


Not at all Occam's razor in this case would suggest the guy in advance went to stone 12,234,222 and saw the inscription then told everyone it was his doing in a past life (There are plenty of this cases but are dissmised, like the guy who said he was the incarnation of Julius Cesar). Or how about if that inscription contained a name of a guy called John?, How many Johns are there?. Also the memories of past lives aren't that concise, they speak in general terms or very traumatic events that may or may not have occured.

I'm not sure you read my scenario carefully enough. There is no "looking" at that stone. The only way to get to it is to disassemble a chunk of the pyramid. There is no way that stone has been lifted since it was placed by the builders.

The point is, this was an off the cuff example of what would be perfectly unambiguous, and would only have one reasonable explanation. It wouldn't take a lot of imagination to think of many such unambiguous results.

Yet, we never see any of those from these reincarnation anecdotes, do we? Why is that, do you think?

Autumn Clouds wrote:
If that knowledge existed (and it did), and it was even possible for that kid to learn of it, it is nothing more than a trick. There are no Buddhists in Brooklyn? This kid couldn't have read this material somewhere? No one at all could have taught it to her, the neighbor down the hall, perhaps?


I see where you're comming from, but trust me buddhism is not a black white, good heaven bad hell religion. It's a rather complex and profound philosophy, I've studied for some time now and I still know squat. She is, you can check her out if you want teaching really advanced philosophical subjects, like the anicca.Could you imagine a child saying the ego is an ilusion?, for there is no permanent self?, and give a coherent explanation (relatively).

The limit of my imagination is also irrelevant to the quality of any "evidence". From my desk here, it's looking obvious this child could (and did) say all kinds of shit. That doesn't mean she understood it.

You don't suppose maybe those around her picked up on a bit of this, and started filling in the blanks? What do you want to bet those people are Buddhists, and the antics of this child are benefitting them directly?

Which brings up another interesting question. Who benefits from these past life stories? Who has something to gain, be it noteriety or direct monetary gain? In the absence of an unambiguous case, the good bet for finding the truth is to look at who has something to gain.

Autumn Clouds wrote:
Cut away the bullshit with Occam's razor.

I completley agree. If some one tells me about all those verifiable cases of past reminiscence, then... only three theories available. Materialism, Live forever in a cloud or a place with lots of bbq, or conciousness rebirth. Occam's razor would be rather swift.

Except it is still subject to who is wielding it. Verifiable cases of past reminiscence are not evidence of any of those three things. They are nothing more than support that an event actually happened. The zeroth theory is that you're being conned.
Autumn Clouds wrote:Again none of these three postitions are or could be accurate, we just lack imagiantion, who knows maybe aliens come steal our conciousness and then implant them on new babies, who in turn forget everything when they grow up?.
We simply don't know.

Again, with the utter lack of evidence to suggest any of those things happen, why bother to think they do?
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Re: Reincarnation Myth or Possible?

#23  Postby Autumn Clouds » Mar 25, 2010 3:08 pm

The point is, this was an off the cuff example of what would be perfectly unambiguous, and would only have one reasonable explanation. It wouldn't take a lot of imagination to think of many such unambiguous results.

Yet, we never see any of those from these reincarnation anecdotes, do we? Why is that, do you think?


I think I got a better grasp of your point now. But you seem to confuse what the facts state with a view of what a gypsy may tell you about your past. The memories of past lives are only of those more traumatic events (both good and bad) and they never seem to strech beyond a generation (unless through hypnosis). In most hypnosis cases I would too consider them as cons or incoherent babblings. But when they start speaking in dead tongues, with perfect accent and common quotations of the time I pay attention.
Now here's another story, and remember these were conducted by a very professional psychiatrist, who attempted to desprove the througly. A young boy (4 years old) goes to the house he was supposed to inhabit in his previous life and pointed in the floor to a secret compartment where he saved the money. The money wasen't found but his supposed wife from his previous life(?) claimed she discovered it not so long ago and took the money.
And another point to this satement would be a little bit of instrospection on our behalf. Can you remember everything you did in your childhood from ages 3 to 11?. Can you barely remember the most traumatic events?. Can you remember the first time you wrote your name?, then what happend to the paper?. Don't asume there's some sort of perfect hardrive on us that just keeps adding data and data, and we can call on it whenever we want. Im 22 now and I cant remember almost nothing when I was 3.

From my desk here, it's looking obvious this child could (and did) say all kinds of shit. That doesn't mean she understood it.


Don't be sure of yourself when judging a philosophical idea. I was giving an example of one of the many things she taught, and still does today. And according to testimonies of her center, she indeed changed many lives (better or worse thats of no matter to me).
If a child would start teaching Socratic philosophy to people?, would you say she was just saying random shit she read from somewhere?. There's a limit to your memory capabilities, and memorized and indoctrinated ideas, can never hold up to further questioning. She explained the deduction to which she arrived to these ideas, and remember one of the formost buddhist premises is to question EVERYTHING. I seriously doubt it she could teach this from memory and when ask give perfect coherent, mature answers out of memory.

Which brings up another interesting question. Who benefits from these past life stories? Who has something to gain, be it noteriety or direct monetary gain? In the absence of an unambiguous case, the good bet for finding the truth is to look at who has something to gain.


If you expect me to belive that there's a massive conspiracy of 3 year olds trying to con me just to gain somesort of noteriety, as if they were megalomaniacals infants with extremely developed egos for their age then, uhm sorry wont go for me. Even if this was the case, which I really doubt it, why then, when questioned at a latter age (11+) they wont have recollection of anything?, not even being asked when they were 3 about their past lives?.

Except it is still subject to who is wielding it. Verifiable cases of past reminiscence are not evidence of any of those three things. They are nothing more than support that an event actually happened.


That event would be the transcendence of death?. You expect to find somesort of immediate evidence or otherwise its false?. How do we know evolution in a macroscopic scale is real if we can't register a case of mutation right now that increseas the genome information?.

Again, with the utter lack of evidence to suggest any of those things happen, why bother to think they do?


I gave you lots of examples, and if you look you'll find hundreds more, all verifiable and even double blind studies.
Im just trying to use the scientific method (Facts, Create Hypothesis to explain facts, try to disprove hypothesis). For something related to conciousness, that due to some stupid historical reason this is viewed as taboo as well.
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Re: Reincarnation Myth or Possible?

#24  Postby The_Metatron » Mar 25, 2010 3:44 pm

You're basing your estimation of the abilities of others on your own abilities. I can remember, with great fidelity and clarity, many many mundande events from easily the age of three.

A clever three year old kid can be taught to parrot fantastic amounts of shit. A savant, even more. It still doesn't imply they understand it. Your own responses here should give you a clue to that. The 11 year old that has no knowledge of his antics as a 3 year old. Tells me that the 11 year old didn't understand what he was parroting when he was 3.

This is an amusing one you posted: "A young boy (4 years old) goes to the house he was supposed to inhabit in his previous life and pointed in the floor to a secret compartment where he saved the money. The money wasen't found but his supposed wife from his previous life(?) claimed she discovered it not so long ago and took the money."

He knew dick. This talk about money is smoke. All the kid did was point out a hole in the floor of some house. What we don't know is how impossible (not unlikely) it is for him to have known that. Damned inconvenient that money wasn't there, isn't it? And, he had a damned convenient explanation for it, too, don't you think?

Take that same story and imagine that kid said there was 213 dollars in that hole, and there was, and that hole turned out to be under a floor that has been covered by concrete since the house was remodeled in 1952. You start to build confidence in the evidence and the conclusions you draw from it. Then, you need to nail down how many people knew of the existence of that hole, who they were, and that they were all killed in a mine explosion the day after the floor was covered.

As for the conspiracy of 3 year olds, you don't honestly think the 3 year olds are acting alone, do you? Who gains from the noteriety of a kid that appears to be able to prove a past life? The parents? Guardians? Follow the money. "..."according to the testimonies of her center, she indeed changed many lives ..." Who stands to gain from those testimonies? They are useless and meaningless.

We would be pleased to see one unambiguous example of evidence supporting reincarnation that has no other possible explanation. Just one.
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Re: Reincarnation Myth or Possible?

#25  Postby Autumn Clouds » Mar 25, 2010 10:12 pm

You're basing your estimation of the abilities of others on your own abilities. I can remember, with great fidelity and clarity, many many mundande events from easily the age of three.


I know and I apologize. Was just trying to make a statement, I remember things when I was that age as well, but just find it curious that they all had a particular strong emotion attached to them.
Can you remember being born?. Some hypnosists claim that through hypnosis they can recover most of these forgotten memories, including memories of the birth. Of course, I'm not prone to belive this since the adult unconscious mind can fill in the gaps so to say.

A clever three year old kid can be taught to parrot fantastic amounts of shit. A savant, even more. It still doesn't imply they understand it. Your own responses here should give you a clue to that. The 11 year old that has no knowledge of his antics as a 3 year old. Tells me that the 11 year old didn't understand what he was parroting when he was 3.


In your defense, she was not 3, but 17 we she started her center. Came from a very poor background, and was constantly abused all her life. Sure it is possible she's just mimcking everything, but if you can have an inteligent conversation with toddler, who responds you accuratly what you ask, it's more unlikely she was just repeating everything from hearsay, than actually having knowledge of the topics. I mean there's no buddhist holy book, the pali canon comes close but it's just some ramblings put into pages which happens to have 12 times the size of the bible, you're sure a toddler can remember all that?.


He knew dick. This talk about money is smoke. All the kid did was point out a hole in the floor of some house. What we don't know is how impossible (not unlikely) it is for him to have known that. Damned inconvenient that money wasn't there, isn't it? And, he had a damned convenient explanation for it, too, don't you think?


I see your point. But it's my fault, I narrowed down the story. The kid recognized his familiars (brothers, cousins, etc), and actually when left alone with her (ex-wife would be?) would give rather specific intimate details of their sex life. The kid didn't knew this beforehand, he had to be subject to the stimuli of actually going to his past life village. Also Stevenson's methodology isn't naive or flawed, he was very careful, he tested over 2000 cases and when he could come with some explanation about them, he dissmissed them. He was left with some, which you can read in 20 cases suggestive of reincarnation.

As for the conspiracy of 3 year olds, you don't honestly think the 3 year olds


lol it was a joke, relax. It's just funny how you seem to jumpo into conclusions about the methodology used. Most of the cases Stevenson presented happend in very poor villages where some little fame isin't the inhabitants top priority. And most of these poor people if not all don't have the means to go check a random guy in another country for details about their sex life. He performed double blind studies, and how do you know he paid them anything?.

I don't belive money and fame is sole porpouse for existance, and to claim and dissmis all these cases just as golddigging attempts is not prudent at best. I've heard the same argument from religious people about atheism (lol I know how stpuid it sounds :) ).

What really amazes me is the knowledge of particular memes, only available to a specific culture.

"In addition, many of the memories the child had, the talents the child displayed (including speaking in a foreign language), and the birthmarks, could not have been faked. Nor is it likely that a young child, no matter how carefully coached, would be a good enough actor to convincingly show the appropriate emotions and social behaviors toward his past-life wife, parents, siblings, extended family and friends. For example, one child is reported as eating off the plate of his former wife, but not off anyone else's--because in that culture it would only be appropriate to eat off one's spouse's plate. It is extremely unlikely that a young child, in an unfamiliar surrounding with unfamiliar people, would remember such minute details and put on a command performance, such that he could fool a trained psychiatrist.

Wilson goes so far as to suggest that one birthmark was created by the money-grubbing parents. Although such a callous and blatant deception on the part of parents is not inconceivable in one or two cases, it's absurd to say that it accounts for all of them, or a majority of them. After all, Stevenson is a medical doctor--something Wilson presumably is not. Stevenson carefully examined and categorized the birthmarks by medical type. Wilson's charge that they were faked, and that Stevenson would be unable to detect fakery, is both illogical and reckless."
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Re: Reincarnation Myth or Possible?

#26  Postby Autumn Clouds » Mar 26, 2010 5:46 am

Found another doctor that investigated the area. She's called Dr. Helen Wambach, here's some outline of her studies.

By doing a scientific analysis on the past lives reported by her 10,000 plus volunteers she came up with some startling evidence in favor of reincarnation:

• 50.6 % of the past lives reported were male and 49.4 % were female — this is exactly in accordance with biological fact.

• The number of people reporting upper class or comfortable lives was in exactly the same proportion to the estimates of historians of the class distribution of the period.

• The recall by subjects of clothing, footwear, type of food and utensils used was better than that in popular history books. She found over and over again that her subjects knew better than most historians — when she went to obscure experts her subjects were invariably correct.

Her conclusion was:

'I don't believe in reincarnation — I know it!' (Wambach 1978).

Extreme Coincidence?, what's the monetary gain if they're volunteers?, and the fame alusions if they're told they're part of 1 of 10000s volunteers for the study?.
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Re: Reincarnation Myth or Possible?

#27  Postby xrayzed » Mar 26, 2010 6:07 am

Autumn Clouds wrote:Dr. Ian Stevenson, Carlson Professor of Psychiatry at the Universite of Virginia, has investigated over 2000 cases of (spontaneous recall of past lives), which are documented and published. There are several other reasearchers who have carried out such investigation on children who spontaneously recall past lives. Many of these researchers belong to religions that do not accept rebirth.
These children speak volubly, accurately and with unanswerving conviction about their previous lives, and histories related have been verified. In most cases these children voice their past life memories between the ages of two and five. They small and free from memories crowded with information of their current lives. They often use phrases such as "when I was big" and often grumble about their small bodies and even speak resentfully of not being of the same sex as before. (...)

I'd like to see the data, because I reckon it's bollocks.

I've heard similar claims before, but when I've looked more closely the data has been less than convincing. There are often major discrepancies between what is recalled and demonstrable facts, the children speak languages they were exposed to in childhood, etc.

The lack of a plausible mechanism is a problem as well. How do the memories get into the brain? What is there in the brain that remembers? Where does the "essence" of the person go between births?
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Re: Reincarnation Myth or Possible?

#28  Postby xrayzed » Mar 26, 2010 6:14 am

Autumn Clouds wrote:Found another doctor that investigated the area. She's called Dr. Helen Wambach, here's some outline of her studies.

By doing a scientific analysis on the past lives reported by her 10,000 plus volunteers she came up with some startling evidence in favor of reincarnation.

I'm guessing the number of peer-reviewed articles she posted on this = 0?

Again, I'd like to see the data.
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Re: Reincarnation Myth or Possible?

#29  Postby Autumn Clouds » Mar 26, 2010 6:40 am

Sure, been going through several of them including the book (20 cases suggestive of reincarnation) trying to find a hole, but... the guy was very careful, and the fact that he never calims reincarnation take place but that it suggests it may, gives him that humble credibility you don't see too often in doctors (or maybe i'm just naive).
Like Sam Harris said, or he's a poor victim of a very intrinsicate fraud, or something weird is going on.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ian_Steven ... d_articles
Be sure to check the birthsigns one, it completley blew my mind off. :crazy:

As for Dr. Wambach, can't find a link to her original works but this article explains her methology and results pretty nicely:
http://pureinsight.org/node/1165

The lack of a plausible mechanism is a problem as well. How do the memories get into the brain? What is there in the brain that remembers? Where does the "essence" of the person go between births?


How am I supposed to know? :grin: . Nevertheless the evidence seems to suggest that personalities within the alledged reincarnations differ. There's a lot we don't know about the brain, we don't even know where the conciousness is stored. And for the last question, why there has to be an essence?, or why there has to be a direct transference as the one you suggest?.
Sorry I don't want to hypothesise, I dunno squat about neuroscience. Maybe you can come with a possible explanation to all these cases, it'll be fun to hear possible hypothesis as wacky as they may sound. :mrgreen:
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Re: Reincarnation Myth or Possible?

#30  Postby xrayzed » Mar 26, 2010 6:52 am

Autumn Clouds wrote:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ian_Steven ... d_articles
Be sure to check the birthsigns one, it completley blew my mind off. :crazy:

As for Dr. Wambach, can't find a link to her original works but this article explains her methology and results pretty nicely:
http://pureinsight.org/node/1165

I'll see if I have time to read these over the weekend.

The lack of a plausible mechanism is a problem as well. How do the memories get into the brain? What is there in the brain that remembers? Where does the "essence" of the person go between births?


How am I supposed to know? :grin: . Nevertheless the evidence seems to suggest that personalities within the alledged reincarnations differ. There's a lot we don't know about the brain, we don't even know where the conciousness is stored. And for the last question, why there has to be an essence?, or why there has to be a direct transference as the one you suggest?.

I'm using "essence" to refer to whatever it is that is transferred. I'm assuming it would have to be independent of the brain because otherwise you have a temporal issue to deal with. How does a brain that died in 1806 manage to download in a brain born in 1975 if there wasn't something existing somewhere?

For now I still think the most likely mechanism is "bollocks". :mrgreen:
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Re: Reincarnation Myth or Possible?

#31  Postby aspire1670 » Mar 26, 2010 6:53 am

Autumn Clouds wrote:Sure, been going through several of them including the book (20 cases suggestive of reincarnation) trying to find a hole, but... the guy was very careful, and the fact that he never calims reincarnation take place but that it suggests it may, gives him that humble credibility you don't see too often in doctors (or maybe i'm just naive).
Like Sam Harris said, or he's a poor victim of a very intrinsicate fraud, or something weird is going on.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ian_Steven ... d_articles
Be sure to check the birthsigns one, it completley blew my mind off. :crazy:

As for Dr. Wambach, can't find a link to her original works but this article explains her methology and results pretty nicely:
http://pureinsight.org/node/1165


The only weird going on was Stevenson's complete disregard for the scientific method; although come to think of it crackpots always do eschew rigour in favour of confirmation bias so I guess it's not weird after all. For an exploration of Stevenson's weird see: http://www.skepdic.com/stevenson.html
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Re: Reincarnation Myth or Possible?

#32  Postby The_Metatron » Mar 26, 2010 7:00 am

I don't share your opinion of this thread. It is not fun, it is an annoyance. I detest that I have taken time to discuss a topic that is almost certainly woo. There are too many holes in it, and not a single unambiguous case where the knowledge demonstrated could not have possibly been known by the subject, or anyone else.

If someone else had knowledge of the fact that supposedly proves reincarnation, anyone else, then you get into a situation of trying to demonstrate a the reliability of a chain of evidence or the veracity of an anecdotal story. He said, she said. Blah, blah, blah. If it isn't subjectively testable, it's fucking worthless.

I will instead observe the grass growing in my garden. At least from that, I can get some useful information. For example, when I need to next mow it down.
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Re: Reincarnation Myth or Possible?

#33  Postby Autumn Clouds » Mar 26, 2010 8:08 am

The only weird going on was Stevenson's complete disregard for the scientific method; although come to think of it crackpots always do eschew rigour in favour of confirmation bias so I guess it's not weird after all. For an exploration of Stevenson's weird see: http://www.skepdic.com/stevenson.html


lol, great article and "Smart people believe weird things because they are skilled at defending beliefs they arrived at for non-smart reasons." Is the best quote ever. :mrgreen:
But still the article was biased the moment the author started attacing Stevenson's persona. His investigations may not have been scientifically flawless, but almost none are. Either way, the author fails to explain alternate solutions for what Stevenson picked up . Remembering foreign cultural trappings being one. He dissmisses Stevenson's findings (birth defects and such) cause Stevenson himself coulden't give a coherent explanation for what he saw. Cold readers throw out a specific detail and wait for a individual of a group of individuals to show some response. These cases involved specific individuals with specific details. Most of his cases weren't documented in the news for what I saw. Cryptomnesia dosen't disprove the cases where the children coulden't have had possible knowledge of the place. It's like saying they're all having a severe case of deja-vu.
Calling Stevenson a stoner, that tries to explain magical thinking, and at the same time quote his beliefs on a review of his work is fun but extremely unprofessional.

I detest that I have taken time to discuss a topic that is almost certainly woo.

Don't be so promtp to disgregard evidence, just cause you can't find a specific type, that by itself is highly unlikely, disprove the cases I've presented then I'll gladly share your opinion. I'm not talking about imaginary friends here.

If it isn't subjectively testable, it's fucking worthless.

Just because some dude had to reach an agreement in the 17th centruy with the church so they'll be able to study physical phenomena and discard mental ones, so they could proceed without fear of persecution dosen't mean we should hold the same mentality as then. You've just killed the entire branch of psychology in that statement.

nd not a single unambiguous case where the knowledge demonstrated could not have possibly been known by the subject, or anyone else.


I've shown you plenty of these cases, I haven't found one which can be traced to an actual physical object (since it would be almost impossible), but plenty of intelectual objects unavailable to most people.
What about the Glenn Ford case?
What about knowledge of cultural trappings, that surpassed those of historians?

You're expecting me to belive that the entire study group of volunteers (over 10000) and all these people are involved in somesort of mass conspiracy, that would require them to study occult culture of the middle ages and beyond, for fame and money, in an annonymus volunteer study?.
And even if this was the case, how would you explain the Glen Ford case?, he was already famous and rich.
How would you explain that in most of the cases the childs forget everything when they grow older?.

Don't get so angry just because of a little cognitive dissonance, it's not worth it :).

I will instead observe the grass growing in my garden. At least from that, I can get some useful information. For example, when I need to next mow it down.


How buddhist of you! :lol:
Last edited by Autumn Clouds on Mar 26, 2010 8:19 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Reincarnation Myth or Possible?

#34  Postby aspire1670 » Mar 26, 2010 8:14 am

*sigh* just *sigh*.
psikeyhackr wrote: Physics is not rhetorical pseudo-logic crap.

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Re: Reincarnation Myth or Possible?

#35  Postby Autumn Clouds » Mar 26, 2010 8:17 am

*sigh* just *sigh*.


:lol: I know, again i'm not dogmatic, and I want not to belive in reincarnation, it dosen't really take me that much to belive in materialism, but how come these cases exists?. It'll be narrow minded on my behalf just to pretend they aren't there.
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Re: Reincarnation Myth or Possible?

#36  Postby virphen » Mar 26, 2010 8:19 am

If these cases are so convincing, why haven't any of them taken Randi's million yet?
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Re: Reincarnation Myth or Possible?

#37  Postby Autumn Clouds » Mar 26, 2010 8:26 am

I had to look him up lol, don't know why they don't.
They're not really paranormal powers (are they?), they can't consciously invoke them. And those that do are 3 year old kids that forget them when they grow up. I don't think memories qualify as paranormal.
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Re: Reincarnation Myth or Possible?

#38  Postby virphen » Mar 26, 2010 8:28 am

Autumn Clouds wrote:I had to look him up lol, don't know why they don't.
They're not really paranormal powers (are they?), they can't consciously invoke them. And those that do are 3 year old kids that forget them when they grow up. I don't think memories qualify as paranormal.


Reincarnation definitely does qualify.
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Re: Reincarnation Myth or Possible?

#39  Postby Autumn Clouds » Mar 26, 2010 8:47 am

Reincarnation definitely does qualify.


It's very odd then :? why don't they?.
But still it's not motive to throw valid scientific reasearch (more or less) out the window. I'm still looking for alternative explanations for these "memories", but can't find any on the web that would explain all of the thousands of cases.
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Re: Reincarnation Myth or Possible?

#40  Postby virphen » Mar 26, 2010 8:50 am

Autumn Clouds wrote:
It's very odd then :? why don't they?.


A pound to a penny nobody has ever applied because they know the evidence will not stack up under the focus of properly skeptical oversight.
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