Can you truly make a reasoned decision to commit suicide?

Anthropology, Economics, History, Sociology etc.

Moderators: Calilasseia, ADParker

Re: Can you truly make a reasoned decision to commit suicide

#121  Postby Gallstones » Jun 23, 2011 4:39 pm

logical bob wrote:
Gallstones wrote:
z8000783 wrote:


Do you know how you know that?

John


According to logical bob
It's a common opinion that you can't know something without being aware that you know it.

WTF? I didn't say anything about knowing how you know something.

Anyway, I've been gone from this forum for months and you're still moping around making big puppy dog eyes at everyone? I never bothered following the soap opera but whatever happened it must have been some bad shit.


I make eyes at no one here.
But if I'm "still moping around" this would be the topic for it, don'tcha think?

BTW, quoting you doesn't mean you are saying anything about me anymore than my quoting Sarah Palin means she is saying anything about me. I was complying with a request and trying to get some understanding.
Gallstones
 
Posts: 11911

Print view this post

Ads by Google


Re: Can you truly make a reasoned decision to commit suicide?

#122  Postby michaelmansun » Jul 19, 2012 6:38 am

There are reasons. I have considered suicide now for about 12 years. Only recently have I made plans for my death. It will happen, and I believe it will happen this year. I have my reasons. In any case, it is just a feeling I have. I think I prefer death to this existense. Maybe it will be better. Maybe it will be nothing. In any case, I do not believe in Hell. I think it is better to die than to continue becoming more crazy with each passing day. I dont want your thoughs. I dont want your advice.
michaelmansun
 
Posts: 1

Print view this post

Re: Can you truly make a reasoned decision to commit suicide?

#123  Postby Durro » Jul 19, 2012 12:39 pm

michaelmansun wrote:There are reasons. I have considered suicide now for about 12 years. Only recently have I made plans for my death. It will happen, and I believe it will happen this year. I have my reasons. In any case, it is just a feeling I have. I think I prefer death to this existense. Maybe it will be better. Maybe it will be nothing. In any case, I do not believe in Hell. I think it is better to die than to continue becoming more crazy with each passing day. I dont want your thoughs. I dont want your advice.


Michael, I'm sure you have your reasons. Without wishing to pry into your intimate details, I hope that you are able to make a rational, unclouded, and well informed decision about your health and your future prognosis, preferably in consultation with your health care professional and if you decide to end your prolonged suffering, I hope that it is in a peaceful, pain free and reliable manner. Again, your health care professional could best advise you about your options there.

I wish you all the best.

Durro
I'll start believing in Astrology the day that all Sagittarians get hit by a bus, as predicted.
User avatar
Durro
RS Donator
 
Posts: 16737
Age: 54
Male

Country: Brisbane, Australia
Australia (au)
Print view this post

Re: Can you truly make a reasoned decision to commit suicide?

#124  Postby z8000783 » Jul 19, 2012 2:36 pm

michaelmansun wrote:There are reasons. I have considered suicide now for about 12 years. Only recently have I made plans for my death. It will happen, and I believe it will happen this year. I have my reasons. In any case, it is just a feeling I have. I think I prefer death to this existense. Maybe it will be better. Maybe it will be nothing. In any case, I do not believe in Hell. I think it is better to die than to continue becoming more crazy with each passing day. I dont want your thoughs. I dont want your advice.

Is there anything that you would like or might be useful from here?

John
I don’t simply believe in miracles - I rely on them
z8000783
 
Name: WTF
Posts: 9333
Age: 67
Male

Country: Greece
Greece (gr)
Print view this post

Re: Can you truly make a reasoned decision to commit suicide?

#125  Postby lordbyron » Aug 06, 2012 10:55 am

In reply to the original post;

we know that one can make a reasoned decision to die , for example all the soldiers around the world losing their lives for one reason or another. A combat soldier accepts that fact that his likelihood of death is significantly increased when he enlists as a soldier. Even in mandatory enlistment people accept this fact and continue their service. Given this universal behavior among humans one should accept the possibility that death after all is not that much of a deal . Given the right environment and psychology one can reason that the termination of one's life is the right thing to do.

Another funny phenomena is that even you, the person currently reading this, yes, you , is not fully aware of the fact that you will eventually die, and as you are most comfortable with leaving most of the decisions in your life to outside factors, you want your death to be out of your control. However a person who decides to commit suicide sees the world , his/her life not worth living, and once that feeling satisfies the satisfactory levels of courage needed to take the responsibility of one's own death, they are free meaning that they have a choice to go further or stop there.

So to summarize it all, almost all of you are in a state of ultra slavery since you have no choice but to live, this in return dictates every single aspect of your life.
Such a pity.
Lord.
User avatar
lordbyron
Banned Troll
 
Name: Deniz
Posts: 105

Country: Turkey
Turkey (tr)
Print view this post

Re: Can you truly make a reasoned decision to commit suicide?

#126  Postby Residue » Aug 17, 2012 7:03 am

This sounds a bit like the guy who had no prospects so had no gun then swallowed the bullet and ended up with hemorrhoids. It's a very pertinent question indeed. It presupposes, in mental health corridors, that every human who ever lived, at the point of death, would have filled in a survey sheet to return a positive balance - on having lived. Now as, we all know, for many of us that just ain't so! Many of us would return a rational "no go" to life. However the fear of consequences, of accepting euthanasia booths standing next to vending machines in retail outlets, is too challenging to comprehend considering. People are all too fearful of the criminal fraternity switching door signs, with the gents or ladies toilet for example, and it becoming something that might stare themselves in the face and everyone think it just another clunk in a long line of 21st century symphonies. The privileged and powerful are probably the most fearful group respecting any memes that have the potential to devalue the sanctity of life. After all, isn't it them who are racking up positive life balance at the end of most days they are living?
Residue
 
Posts: 14

Print view this post

Re: Can you truly make a reasoned decision to commit suicide?

#127  Postby Fallible » Aug 17, 2012 3:07 pm

:eh:
She battled through in every kind of tribulation,
She revelled in adventure and imagination.
She never listened to no hater, liar,
Breaking boundaries and chasing fire.
Oh, my my! Oh my, she flies!
User avatar
Fallible
RS Donator
 
Name: Alice Pooper
Posts: 51607
Age: 48
Female

Country: Engerland na na
Canada (ca)
Print view this post

Ads by Google


Re: Can you truly make a reasoned decision to commit suicide?

#128  Postby DavidMcC » Aug 19, 2012 3:26 pm

Residue wrote:This sounds a bit like the guy who had no prospects so had no gun then swallowed the bullet and ended up with hemorrhoids. It's a very pertinent question indeed. It presupposes, in mental health corridors, that every human who ever lived, at the point of death, would have filled in a survey sheet to return a positive balance - on having lived. Now as, we all know, for many of us that just ain't so! Many of us would return a rational "no go" to life. However the fear of consequences, of accepting euthanasia booths standing next to vending machines in retail outlets, is too challenging to comprehend considering. People are all too fearful of the criminal fraternity switching door signs, with the gents or ladies toilet for example, and it becoming something that might stare themselves in the face and everyone think it just another clunk in a long line of 21st century symphonies. The privileged and powerful are probably the most fearful group respecting any memes that have the potential to devalue the sanctity of life. After all, isn't it them who are racking up positive life balance at the end of most days they are living?

I don't think the right to die is about having suicide booths in the high street, Residue. It's about making it legal for doctors to help a patient who has nothing but pain to "look forward to" end his/her life with dignity, and end their suffering.
May The Voice be with you!
DavidMcC
 
Name: David McCulloch
Posts: 14913
Age: 67
Male

Country: United Kigdom
United Kingdom (uk)
Print view this post

Re: Can you truly make a reasoned decision to commit suicide?

#129  Postby Gallstones » Aug 20, 2012 8:41 am

Director Tony Scott jumps to death from bridge
Tony Scott, director of blockbusters Top Gun and Days of Thunder, jumped to his death Sunday from the Vincent Thomas Bridge, authorities said.


Vincent Thomas Bridge(been over it)---Long Beach(my alma mater)--Daily Breeze(subscribed)---San Pedro(grunion, love that Cabrillo Marine museum)

Success isn't enough, I guess.
He left a note. I'd love to be able to know what it says.

The descriptions by witnesses say he was quite deliberate.
Gallstones
 
Posts: 11911

Print view this post

Re: Can you truly make a reasoned decision to commit suicide?

#130  Postby surreptitious57 » Aug 22, 2012 11:51 am

Gallstones wrote:
Director Tony Scott jumps to death from bridge

Success isn't enough, I guess.


Presumably, you did not know he had inoperable brain cancer. Your comment about success is nevertheless interesting. There is this strange assumption that if you have made it in life, that you should be happy. Well yes, but a couple of caveats. One: on whose definition of made it, are we going on, here? Two: sometimes the trappings that come with
success can be one's undoing. Obviously not in this case, but just saying.
A MIND IS LIKE A PARACHUTE : IT DOES NOT WORK UNLESS IT IS OPEN
surreptitious57
 
Posts: 10195

Print view this post

Re: Can you truly make a reasoned decision to commit suicide?

#131  Postby Sertorius » Aug 23, 2012 6:14 pm

It is idiotic to assume that a decision to commit suicide implies mental disease and needs to be "cured".

When a person decides to end his own life, it is absolutely nobody else's business.

The incarceration and torture of people in psychiatric insititutions for the sole reason of "danger to oneself" is one of the biggest disgraces in the civilised world today.

To me, it seems that a person who enjoys drinking tomato juice can't be in his right mind. But I'm no longer a child and I realise that another person's doing something I find disgusting is not a legitimate reason of declaring him mentally ill.
Sertorius
 
Posts: 10

Print view this post

Re: Can you truly make a reasoned decision to commit suicide?

#132  Postby Gallstones » Aug 23, 2012 10:01 pm

surreptitious57 wrote:
Gallstones wrote:
Director Tony Scott jumps to death from bridge

Success isn't enough, I guess.


Presumably, you did not know he had inoperable brain cancer. Your comment about success is nevertheless interesting. There is this strange assumption that if you have made it in life, that you should be happy. Well yes, but a couple of caveats. One: on whose definition of made it, are we going on, here? Two: sometimes the trappings that come with
success can be one's undoing. Obviously not in this case, but just saying.


I did not know about the brain tumor. I had been watching the news and nothing was said. I was suspicious of something like that though.
Gallstones
 
Posts: 11911

Print view this post

Re: Can you truly make a reasoned decision to commit suicide?

#133  Postby z8000783 » Aug 24, 2012 6:28 am

Sertorius wrote:The incarceration and torture of people in psychiatric insititutions for the sole reason of "danger to oneself" is one of the biggest disgraces in the civilised world today..

Are you saying, that because of the way mental institution treat these patients they should not be treated at all?

John
I don’t simply believe in miracles - I rely on them
z8000783
 
Name: WTF
Posts: 9333
Age: 67
Male

Country: Greece
Greece (gr)
Print view this post

Re: Can you truly make a reasoned decision to commit suicide?

#134  Postby Fallible » Aug 24, 2012 8:31 am

His wife has denied that he had a brain tumour.
She battled through in every kind of tribulation,
She revelled in adventure and imagination.
She never listened to no hater, liar,
Breaking boundaries and chasing fire.
Oh, my my! Oh my, she flies!
User avatar
Fallible
RS Donator
 
Name: Alice Pooper
Posts: 51607
Age: 48
Female

Country: Engerland na na
Canada (ca)
Print view this post

Re: Can you truly make a reasoned decision to commit suicide?

#135  Postby Aern Rakesh » Aug 24, 2012 8:50 am

Fallible wrote:His wife has denied that he had a brain tumour.


Also apparently the coroner who did the post-mortem said there was no obvious signs of brain cancer, but that it was too early to know if there were microscopic signs that would have been undetectable by a physician.
Image
User avatar
Aern Rakesh
RS Donator
 
Posts: 13582
Age: 72
Female

Country: UK (London)
United States (us)
Print view this post

Ads by Google


Re: Can you truly make a reasoned decision to commit suicide?

#136  Postby Sertorius » Aug 24, 2012 9:20 am

z8000783 wrote:Are you saying, that because of the way mental institution treat these patients they should not be treated at all?

No, not "because". I am saying that "these patients" are not patients at all. Merely the fact that a person is contemplating suicide or has even attempted it is no legitimate cause to consider him mentally ill and in need of treatment.
Sertorius
 
Posts: 10

Print view this post

Re: Can you truly make a reasoned decision to commit suicide?

#137  Postby Fallible » Aug 24, 2012 9:29 am

Agree 100%.
She battled through in every kind of tribulation,
She revelled in adventure and imagination.
She never listened to no hater, liar,
Breaking boundaries and chasing fire.
Oh, my my! Oh my, she flies!
User avatar
Fallible
RS Donator
 
Name: Alice Pooper
Posts: 51607
Age: 48
Female

Country: Engerland na na
Canada (ca)
Print view this post

Re: Can you truly make a reasoned decision to commit suicide?

#138  Postby Scarlett » Aug 24, 2012 9:47 am

One of the most compelling stories I've heard to support a reasoned decision to commit suicide was that of an elderly couple. Both in their 80's, married for over 50 years, had never spent a night in separate beds. The husband had terminal cancer but the wife was extremely fit and healthy for an octogenarian. It was her wish, supported by her husband, that when he died she would want to end her life. She felt she simply would not be able to tolerate life without her spouse.
User avatar
Scarlett
 
Posts: 16046

United Kingdom (uk)
Print view this post

Re: Can you truly make a reasoned decision to commit suicide?

#139  Postby mindhack » Aug 24, 2012 2:17 pm

Someone not too close to me committed suicide about two months ago. He had suffocated himself with helium gas. He had rented a bottle from a shop for party gear.

When his wife found him dead on his bed this bottle along with a note laid next to him. The note gave instructions for returning the bottle to the shop and for retrieving the deposit he'd had to pay for it. He had made arrangements and wrote instructions about many things. Like a business transaction, sort of. I was stunned at how rational this person must have been when he was planning for it all. Nobody would have been able to stop him.

On a gruesome side note. After several days, when the wife returned the bottle to the store, the shopkeeper asked her “if everything had gone according to plan.”. I’m sure the shopkeeper had a party in mind, but you can imagine what went through her head when she heard that question. :(
(Ignorance --> Mystery) < (Knowledge --> Awe)
mindhack
 
Name: Van Amerongen
Posts: 2668
Male

Country: Zuid-Holland
Netherlands (nl)
Print view this post

Re: Can you truly make a reasoned decision to commit suicide?

#140  Postby Aern Rakesh » Aug 24, 2012 2:24 pm

mindhack wrote:When his wife found him dead on his bed this bottle along with a note laid next to him. The note gave instructions for returning the bottle to the shop and for retrieving the deposit he'd had to pay for it. He had made arrangements and wrote instructions about many things. Like a business transaction, sort of. I was stunned at how rational this person must have been when he was planning for it all. Nobody would have been able to stop him.


This isn't quite the same, but many years ago I spent a summer working in the Allegheny County Morgue doing autopsies (I was an anatomy student at the time). Anyway, one of the most surprising things I discovered was how many suicides there were: on average 2 a day (out of 5-10 corpses/day). This was in Pittsburgh, an average-sized city.

The most notable one was a person (can't remember whether it was a man or a woman) who had slit their wrists, swallowed some corrosive poison and then hung themselves. Clearly was taking no chances. However they had the humanity to leave a note warning whoever found them/the coronoer to beware the corrosive poison they had swallowed.
Image
User avatar
Aern Rakesh
RS Donator
 
Posts: 13582
Age: 72
Female

Country: UK (London)
United States (us)
Print view this post

PreviousNext

Return to Social Sciences & Humanities

Who is online

Users viewing this topic: No registered users and 2 guests