The Patriarchy - is it small or even dead in the West?

If not, what is it and is it very problematic?

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The Patriarchy - is it small or even dead in the West?

#1  Postby Keep It Real » Apr 08, 2020 8:37 am

I watched a documentary last night about a British young lady who went to fight with the Kurds against ISIS (Daesh) in Syria. She died there in a Turkish air strike. It seems she loathed Islam, and organised religion in general, because of its patriarchal structures. I'm not saying for a moment that Islam isn't often extremely patriarchal, but is the patriarchy extant to a seriously problematic real degree in, say, the UK?

Some women I've met seem to equate patriarchy with "male leaders/managers" full stop, but surely male leaders are not necessarily a bad thing? Perhaps there are more male leaders largely because males tend to be more inclined to seek leadership and/or are simply generally better at it, as with chess and drum and bass producer professionals?

I know this may be a controversial topic and I hope nobody takes this as me being sexist, it was just a very profound and moving documentary which has me thinking.
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Re: The Patriarchy - is it small or even dead in the West?

#2  Postby blindfaith » Apr 08, 2020 9:40 am

Yes, lets give the men a chance for a change! /sarcasm

Are you trolling or serious?
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Re: The Patriarchy - is it small or even dead in the West?

#3  Postby Keep It Real » Apr 08, 2020 9:42 am

Serious. Also, I did not say men do not "have a chance."
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Re: The Patriarchy - is it small or even dead in the West?

#4  Postby Hermit » Apr 08, 2020 9:50 am

Keep It Real wrote:...is the patriarchy extant to a seriously problematic real degree in, say, the UK?

Not to the extent it used to be, but yes, the patriarchy is still extant to a seriously problematic real degree in, say, the UK.
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Re: The Patriarchy - is it small or even dead in the West?

#5  Postby blindfaith » Apr 08, 2020 9:56 am

Keep It Real wrote:Serious. Also, I did not say men do not "have a chance."


good for you.

Perhaps there are more male leaders largely because males tend to be more inclined to seek leadership and/or are simply generally better at it,


Any evidence for this statement?

I dont think what your saying is controversial, its been said a million times before, usually by sexist cunts.
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Re: The Patriarchy - is it small or even dead in the West?

#6  Postby Fallible » Apr 08, 2020 10:05 am

Now why in the world might men seek leadership more? :think:
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Re: The Patriarchy - is it small or even dead in the West?

#7  Postby Keep It Real » Apr 08, 2020 10:09 am

blindfaith wrote:

Perhaps there are more male leaders largely because males tend to be more inclined to seek leadership and/or are simply generally better at it,


Any evidence for this statement?


Nope. Just seems at least plausible given that the alternative is an endemic systematic underground cloak and dagger hidden agenda/secret society called, perhaps: MEN FOREVER KEEP THE WOMEN OUT OF POWER! for which there is also no evidence, at least as far as I'm aware.
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Re: The Patriarchy - is it small or even dead in the West?

#8  Postby Keep It Real » Apr 08, 2020 10:11 am

Fallible wrote:Now why in the world might men seek leadership more? :think:


Image
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Re: The Patriarchy - is it small or even dead in the West?

#9  Postby Fallible » Apr 08, 2020 10:13 am

:eh:
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Re: The Patriarchy - is it small or even dead in the West?

#10  Postby Keep It Real » Apr 08, 2020 10:17 am

Leadership = power? It was a joke really, that giff, from back when Star Wars had some redeeming features. Quite a scene!
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Re: The Patriarchy - is it small or even dead in the West?

#11  Postby blindfaith » Apr 08, 2020 10:17 am

Keep It Real wrote:
blindfaith wrote:

Perhaps there are more male leaders largely because males tend to be more inclined to seek leadership and/or are simply generally better at it,


Any evidence for this statement?


Nope. Just seems at least plausible given that the alternative is an endemic systematic underground cloak and dagger hidden agenda/secret society called, perhaps: MEN FOREVER KEEP THE WOMEN OUT OF POWER! for which there is also no evidence, at least as far as I'm aware.


So an empty statement explaining an empty statement, what a waste of forum space. All you have done with this thread is make yourself look more like a sexist, why are you always desperate for attention?
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Re: The Patriarchy - is it small or even dead in the West?

#12  Postby Fallible » Apr 08, 2020 10:21 am

Keep It Real wrote:Leadership = power? It was a joke really, that giff, from back when Star Wars had some redeeming features. Quite a scene!


Ok...I was...making a subtle point that there will be reasons for the things you posted if they are correct, eg. there are reasons why men may seek out leadership more than women, and I’m sure you can think what some of them might be.
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Re: The Patriarchy - is it small or even dead in the West?

#13  Postby Keep It Real » Apr 08, 2020 10:23 am

blindfaith wrote:
So an empty statement explaining an empty statement, what a waste of forum space. All you have done with this thread is make yourself look more like a sexist, why are you always desperate for attention?


Translation:

blindfaith wrote:hypocritical insult: bitch, winge, winge, moan. KIR KIR insult KIR insult.


:yawn:
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Re: The Patriarchy - is it small or even dead in the West?

#14  Postby blindfaith » Apr 08, 2020 10:25 am

Keep It Real wrote:
blindfaith wrote:
So an empty statement explaining an empty statement, what a waste of forum space. All you have done with this thread is make yourself look more like a sexist, why are you always desperate for attention?


Translation:

blindfaith wrote:hypocritical insult: bitch, winge, winge, moan. KIR KIR insult KIR insult.


:yawn:


Nice deflection

why are you always desperate for attention?
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Re: The Patriarchy - is it small or even dead in the West?

#15  Postby Keep It Real » Apr 08, 2020 10:28 am

Fallible wrote:
Keep It Real wrote:Leadership = power? It was a joke really, that giff, from back when Star Wars had some redeeming features. Quite a scene!


Ok...I was...making a subtle point that there will be reasons for the things you posted if they are correct, eg. there are reasons why men may seek out leadership more than women, and I’m sure you can think what some of them might be.


I only said perhaps....I overcooked it methinks with the whole "cloak and dagger secret society" bit - the old boys' club could well be holding sway I guess in many fields. As to those reasons...nope, nothing really springs to mind TBH...I'll think on...
Last edited by Keep It Real on Apr 08, 2020 10:29 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The Patriarchy - is it small or even dead in the West?

#16  Postby Keep It Real » Apr 08, 2020 10:29 am

blindfaith wrote:
Nice deflection

why are you always desperate for attention?


Please stop trying to make this thread about me.
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Re: The Patriarchy - is it small or even dead in the West?

#17  Postby Fallible » Apr 08, 2020 10:30 am

Keep It Real wrote:
Fallible wrote:
Keep It Real wrote:Leadership = power? It was a joke really, that giff, from back when Star Wars had some redeeming features. Quite a scene!


Ok...I was...making a subtle point that there will be reasons for the things you posted if they are correct, eg. there are reasons why men may seek out leadership more than women, and I’m sure you can think what some of them might be.


I only said perhaps....I overcooked it methinks with the whole "cloak and dagger secret society" bit - the old boys' club could well be holding sway I guess in many fields. As to those reasons...nope, nothing really springs to mind TBH...I'll think on...


Nothing springs to mind? I’m not being funny, but yeah, maybe think just a little bit about society, roles within it, history, and in this context why men might seek leadership more than women.
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Re: The Patriarchy - is it small or even dead in the West?

#18  Postby blindfaith » Apr 08, 2020 10:32 am

Keep It Real wrote:
blindfaith wrote:
Nice deflection

why are you always desperate for attention?


Please stop trying to make this thread about me.


I really hope you see the massive irony in that statement
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Re: The Patriarchy - is it small or even dead in the West?

#19  Postby Keep It Real » Apr 08, 2020 10:43 am

Fallible wrote:
Keep It Real wrote:I only said perhaps....I overcooked it methinks with the whole "cloak and dagger secret society" bit - the old boys' club could well be holding sway I guess in many fields. As to those reasons...nope, nothing really springs to mind TBH...I'll think on...


Nothing springs to mind? I’m not being funny, but yeah, maybe think just a little bit about society, roles within it, history, and in this context why men might seek leadership more than women.


Yeah - so the history in the UK. It wasn't so very long ago women didn't even have the vote, nor that female monarchs were considered "acceptable." All those Shakespearean plays themed around men hacking away tooth and nail to try and be number 1 (ie - the king) - not that I'm any kind of Shakespeare aficionado you understand - quite the opposite, but that's what I've gleaned. I guess then male leadership has been presumed and built into society and that it's just sort of "expected" because of our sexist past where muscle and violence ruled. Perhaps tearing ourselves away from that past entirely is a...er....LENGTHY and difficult process and that men just sort of think they "should" seek leadership and power because of that past out of, er, societal habit. Theories.
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Re: The Patriarchy - is it small or even dead in the West?

#20  Postby Fallible » Apr 08, 2020 10:47 am

Also, that women ‘shouldn’t’, and that this belief is held by both men and women still. Women lag behind, rather as they do in football proficiency. As you probably know, women’s football drew enormous crowds, more than men’s matches, until they were banned from playing on any Football Association pitch. Now, women’s football is seen as a joke because surprise surprise, the skills have suffered.
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