"Women are unlikely to own up to their true desires..."

What do women want?

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"Women are unlikely to own up to their true desires..."

#1  Postby Made of Stars » Mar 08, 2014 9:26 pm

We all know what causes the inherent tension between the sexes - men want sex more, lots more, than women. They're genetically programmed to spread their seed as widely as possible, while women want to mate for life. Right?

Wrong. The truth is women want sex just as much as men do, and with lots of different partners, according to a provocative investigation into female desire by American author Daniel Bergner. They're just not being honest about it with themselves - or with anyone else.

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/lifestyle/breakin ... z2vPKJ00rl

Rest easy boys, even women don't know what they want. Allegedly.
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Re: "Women are unlikely to own up to their true desires..."

#2  Postby Keep It Real » Mar 08, 2014 9:38 pm

I find the normalisation of female promiscuity in secular society to be very disturbing. That's one thing Islam's got going for it IMO.
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Re: "Women are unlikely to own up to their true desires..."

#3  Postby Scarlett » Mar 08, 2014 9:43 pm

Disturbing how?
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Re: "Women are unlikely to own up to their true desires..."

#4  Postby Keep It Real » Mar 08, 2014 9:46 pm

I find female promiscuity to be the biggest turn-off imaginable. The fear that a female SO could be having sex with somebody else is deeply rooted in most straight male's psychology - for evolutionary reasons. It really resonates with me. Slut pride marches and the like turn my stomach.
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Re: "Women are unlikely to own up to their true desires..."

#5  Postby Onyx8 » Mar 08, 2014 9:54 pm

Anecdote alert: All the aging women I know say that they want more sex than their men give them.
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Re: "Women are unlikely to own up to their true desires..."

#6  Postby Thommo » Mar 08, 2014 10:04 pm

All the women I've met (or, the ones I've talked about it with) have been individuals with differing preferences, tastes, fantasies, circumstances in which they want and don't want sex and so on.

I also think that the idea that "women" should conform to whatever one man's tastes are is utterly bizarre. If one person doesn't want a promiscuous partner I can't see how that has the least fucking relevance to the other 3.5 billion women who aren't that person's partner.
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Re: "Women are unlikely to own up to their true desires..."

#7  Postby Beatsong » Mar 08, 2014 10:10 pm

Onyx8 wrote:Anecdote alert: All the aging women I know say that they want more sex than their men give them.


I've heard/read that a lot too, but I think it could be misleading.

The fact that the men don't want as much sex WITH THEM doesn't mean they don't want as much sex. It could just mean that their sexual desires are more promiscuous - that they specifically want lots of sex with OTHER people (as anecdotal observation of men tends to confirm). Or it could even mean that, despite being largely monogamous in their desires, they just don't fancy their partners. It could just be a fact of sexual attraction that aging women lose their attractiveness to men, more than aging men do to women (again, as seems to be the case anecdotally).

Also, what is true of "aging" couples isn't necessarily true of the young or middle aged, since the effect of hormones etc. on sexual desire changes over the course of a lifetime.
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Re: "Women are unlikely to own up to their true desires..."

#8  Postby Keep It Real » Mar 08, 2014 10:19 pm

Thommo wrote:
I also think that the idea that "women" should conform to whatever one man's tastes are is utterly bizarre. If one person doesn't want a promiscuous partner I can't see how that has the least fucking relevance to the other 3.5 billion women who aren't that person's partner.

If it's commonly accepted in society that female promiscuity is acceptable then it's more likely to occur. Every slutty female worsens this problem; and those who purport there's nothing wrong with female promiscuity, such as yourself, add weight to that hideous notion. All too common in secular society - women's rights and whatnot - feminism loosing the plot basically.
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Re: "Women are unlikely to own up to their true desires..."

#9  Postby Beatsong » Mar 08, 2014 10:25 pm

Interesting article, although it's always frustrating trying to get a clear sense of what the data says from a newspaper report.

One problem I can see is this:

To find out what women really want in the bedroom, Bergner interviewed sexologists, ordinary women, scientists working on the development of a female Viagra and spent a week at a primate colony.

He discovered women actually lose interest in their long-term partners quicker than men do, are more likely than men to want to receive sexual pleasure than give it, and get much more turned on by strangers than known lovers. The revelation that women are just as lusty as men could spell real danger for monogamy - except women are unlikely to own up to their true desires.

Canadian psychologist Meredith Chivers starkly illustrated the female desire disconnect in a series of experiments that prompted Bergner's book. She placed a miniature light bulb and sensor (called a plethysmograph) inside the vagina to measure the blood flow as her female subjects watched a variety of pornography. To establish what turns women on, Chivers showed them sex between men and women, men and men, women and women, and a pair of bonobos (a type of chimpanzee) while she measured their physiological reactions. The women also had to rate their own feelings of arousal on a key pad.

According to their self-reports, straight women were indifferent to the bonobos, and not especially turned on by gay sex involving men or women. Yet their plethysmograph readings told a different story, soaring no matter who was on the screen and what they were doing.

''Chivers found there was a very consistent difference between what women say turns them on, and what their bodies say turns them on,'' Bergner explains.

When Chivers conducted the same experiment with men, their physical and mental responses matched. Straight men were unaffected by the bonobos, sort of turned on by male sex, very turned on by heterosexual sex, and incredibly aroused by lesbian encounters. So why are women less in tune with their sexuality than men?


I've read about the pornography experiment before and it's fascinating. Doesn't it kind of destroy the point it's trying to prove though?

It's supposed to indicate that women's self reports of desire levels are not to be trusted, because of the disconnect between what they actually feel and what they're willing to admit to themselves and others. And yet "to find out what women really want in the bedroom, Bergner interviewed sexologists, ordinary women...".

If women's self reports are worthless, then how can an accurate idea of what they really want be gained by interviewing them?
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Re: "Women are unlikely to own up to their true desires..."

#10  Postby Thommo » Mar 08, 2014 10:26 pm

Keep It Real wrote:
Thommo wrote:
I also think that the idea that "women" should conform to whatever one man's tastes are is utterly bizarre. If one person doesn't want a promiscuous partner I can't see how that has the least fucking relevance to the other 3.5 billion women who aren't that person's partner.

If it's commonly accepted in society that female promiscuity is acceptable then it's more likely to occur. Every slutty female worsens this problem; and those who purport there's nothing wrong with female promiscuity, such as yourself, add weight to that hideous notion. All too common in secular society - women's rights and whatnot - feminism loosing the plot basically.


I see, so my not telling people how they should or should not behave is a problem for you.

Why should I care?
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Re: "Women are unlikely to own up to their true desires..."

#11  Postby laklak » Mar 08, 2014 10:27 pm

Women don't know what they want, so they should just listen to their man.

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Re: "Women are unlikely to own up to their true desires..."

#12  Postby Keep It Real » Mar 08, 2014 10:28 pm

Thommo wrote:
Keep It Real wrote:
Thommo wrote:
I also think that the idea that "women" should conform to whatever one man's tastes are is utterly bizarre. If one person doesn't want a promiscuous partner I can't see how that has the least fucking relevance to the other 3.5 billion women who aren't that person's partner.

If it's commonly accepted in society that female promiscuity is acceptable then it's more likely to occur. Every slutty female worsens this problem; and those who purport there's nothing wrong with female promiscuity, such as yourself, add weight to that hideous notion. All too common in secular society - women's rights and whatnot - feminism loosing the plot basically.


I see, so my not telling people how they should or should not behave is a problem for you.

Why should I care?


Unless you're a psychopath, you should care about other people a bit, in general.
Last edited by Keep It Real on Mar 08, 2014 10:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: "Women are unlikely to own up to their true desires..."

#13  Postby Thommo » Mar 08, 2014 10:30 pm

Keep It Real wrote:
Thommo wrote:I see, so my not telling people how they should or should not behave is a problem for you.

Why should I care?


I'm sorry, I didn't know you were a psychopath.


I don't think me not being willing to advocate constraints on millions or billions of people because you have a problem with them being promiscuous is quite the same as psychopathy.
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Re: "Women are unlikely to own up to their true desires..."

#14  Postby OlivierK » Mar 08, 2014 10:31 pm

Keep It Real wrote:
Thommo wrote:
I also think that the idea that "women" should conform to whatever one man's tastes are is utterly bizarre. If one person doesn't want a promiscuous partner I can't see how that has the least fucking relevance to the other 3.5 billion women who aren't that person's partner.

If it's commonly accepted in society that female promiscuity is acceptable then it's more likely to occur. Every slutty female worsens this problem; and those who purport there's nothing wrong with female promiscuity, such as yourself, add weight to that hideous notion. All too common in secular society - women's rights and whatnot - feminism loosing the plot basically.

I understand that you've owned up to having a particular fear, but women getting the sort of sex they want doesn't seem problematic to me, in and of itself. Your fear is the only thing being "worsened", and if your fear is a result of events in society that do not involve you personally in any way, then I'd say that's entirely your problem.
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Re: "Women are unlikely to own up to their true desires..."

#15  Postby Beatsong » Mar 08, 2014 10:33 pm

Thommo wrote:
Keep It Real wrote:
Thommo wrote:I see, so my not telling people how they should or should not behave is a problem for you.

Why should I care?


I'm sorry, I didn't know you were a psychopath.


:rofl:

I don't think me not being willing to advocate constraints on millions or billions of people because you have a problem with them being promiscuous is quite the same as psychopathy.


No shit. :lol:

In common with many men, I positively LIKE it when women are slutty, because it increases my chances of being able to shag them. I wonder what that makes me? :?
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Re: "Women are unlikely to own up to their true desires..."

#16  Postby Ironclad » Mar 08, 2014 10:36 pm

Keep It Real wrote:I find the normalisation of female promiscuity sexuality in secular society to be very disturbing. That's one thing Islam's got going for it IMO - is the suppression of natural desire (with occasional threats of violence).


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Re: "Women are unlikely to own up to their true desires..."

#17  Postby Keep It Real » Mar 08, 2014 10:36 pm

Thommo wrote:
Keep It Real wrote:
Thommo wrote:I see, so my not telling people how they should or should not behave is a problem for you.

Why should I care?


I'm sorry, I didn't know you were a psychopath.


I don't think me not being willing to advocate constraints on millions or billions of people because you have a problem with them being promiscuous is quite the same as psychopathy.


Ahh, too late; I edited my post but you quoted me quick. Same point though it doesn't tickle the FUA. Anyway - the normalisation of female promiscuity affects millions, not just me.
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Re: "Women are unlikely to own up to their true desires..."

#18  Postby Keep It Real » Mar 08, 2014 10:38 pm

Ironclad wrote:
Keep It Real wrote:I find the normalisation of female promiscuity sexuality in secular society to be very disturbing. That's one thing Islam's got going for it IMO - is the suppression of natural desire (with occasional threats of violence).


FIFY :popcorn:

I believe that's what they call a naturalistic fallacy - not all desires should be acted upon, even if they did come about naturally (as if there is some other source for desires).
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Re: "Women are unlikely to own up to their true desires..."

#19  Postby Mazille » Mar 08, 2014 10:40 pm

What.
The.
Fuck.


Seriously. Did someone flip a switch lately and some members just go into full on "spouting batshit insanity" mode?
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Re: "Women are unlikely to own up to their true desires..."

#20  Postby Keep It Real » Mar 08, 2014 10:40 pm

Beatsong wrote:
Thommo wrote:
Keep It Real wrote:
Thommo wrote:I see, so my not telling people how they should or should not behave is a problem for you.

Why should I care?


I'm sorry, I didn't know you were a psychopath.


:rofl:

I don't think me not being willing to advocate constraints on millions or billions of people because you have a problem with them being promiscuous is quite the same as psychopathy.


No shit. :lol:

In common with many men, I positively LIKE it when women are slutty, because it increases my chances of being able to shag them. I wonder what that makes me? :?

It makes you a duplicitous sly beta male - unable to hold a pride, he just takes what he can on the side, like a homeless drug addict bum raiding trash cans.
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