Civilisation

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Civilisation

#1  Postby Nostalgia » Dec 14, 2011 11:42 pm

So the other day I bought the Civilisation IV Complete Game of the Year edition as since my mega-gamer PC died a year or so back I've been gaming on a average laptop*. I'm a big strategy fan, but I had never played a Civ game and seeing as Alpha Centuri was an important part of my young gaming life I'd thought I'd give this Sid Meier's production a go. I was quite excited about playing. I Installed it. Played through the tutorial, then got into the game.

I just don't like it. :snooty:

It seems awfully small and awfully large at the same time. The technology/research abilities are rudimentary. The fights involve no skill on the player's part. The resource collection seems dislocated. And the timeline moves way too fast, even on the slow option.

After two nights of playing it ( a good eight hours of play) I said fuck it and went back to playing Medieval Total War 2.

Am I doing something wrong, do I need to give it more of a chance, or is it just a hugely overrated game?

*Incidentally, if anyone has any recommendations for any great games that are a few years old (say with specs of about half a G of RAM and 64MB of video WITHOUT the need for a Steam account) I would love to hear them.
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Re: Civilisation

#2  Postby quixotecoyote » Dec 16, 2011 2:48 am

It's been awhile since I've played Civ IV, so I don't recall all it's distinctions within the series, but I'm a little lost on how you could really like Alpha Centauri and be totally down on Civ 4.

AC remains my favorite of the series and I'll still run it when I feel the need for a Civ fix, but from it to Civ 4 is just a series of evolutionary changes. The resource system is still production/food/wealth with tile/city improvements, the combat is largely the same (albeit with no unit editor). I don't recall how the tech felt, but I do agree the time-line went by a bit quick, especially the middle ages. I don't think Civ 4 was quite as good as Alpha Centauri, but I doubt it's that much worse.

Civ 5 is where they really changed the feel of things, in a way I thought worked (though the AI needs some work).
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Re: Civilisation

#3  Postby quixotecoyote » Dec 16, 2011 2:59 am

Oh and if you're looking at older games with no steam, you've got great timing.

gog.com is having a half off sale. so 3-5 dollar games with no DRM.

My reccomendations:

Space Rangers 2 for a surprisingly good 2d Elite/Privateer/Freespace experience

Beyond Good and Evil & Psychonauts for action/adventure

Dungeon Keeper 2 & Evil Genius for simish strategy

Any Fallout games if you haven't played them for rpgs.

Not too much as far as RTS's go, although Sacrifice is my favorite hybrid.
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Re: Civilisation

#5  Postby trubble76 » Dec 16, 2011 11:02 am

:shrug:
I love Civ4 ( I also loved AC).
I play on marathon setting and I tend to find that different eras pass at different rates for every game. It largely depends on when you choose to go to war with your neighbours (which may depend on what resources you find nearby and what order you do your research in.)

Have you tried altering the settings? For example, I usually turn off the timed win (I think it ends the game at 2050).
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Re: Civilisation

#6  Postby Kaleid » Dec 19, 2011 6:48 pm

I think if you grew up playing previous Civs, it's easier to get into them. Still, compared to many games these days, it's looking rather tired. Maybe it's time for the series to end.

Altering the settings as trubble suggested can make things better. I always find the most frustrating thing about the game to be slowdown, especially near the endgame. Even with an ultra-fast computer, you pretty much have to give up large maps at some point because it just takes too long between turns. Playing on standard or smaller maps can help, as can turning graphics options down to their lowest levels.

Or you can just do what I do: set the win condition to conquest, play as Genghis Khan and send your hordes out straight from the off in an often-suicidal warrior/archer rush :dopey:
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Re: Civilisation

#7  Postby Sgt Kelly » Dec 19, 2011 7:33 pm

Civ IV is my all time favorite game (unless I voted for something else on one of the polls on here...).

As far as the dimensions of time and space go, I think I always played one level down from the maximum (large world and epic time scale, if I'm not mistaken, but I probably am). That should give you a chance to get some cities in and explore a bit before it starts to get crowded.

Now let's look at your criticisms.

"Resource collection is dislocated".
How so ? Every resource has a double function : it improves the productivity of your cities and has some beneficial effect on your wider empire. For example a tile with a foodstuff will make the population in the city that 'owns' the tile grow faster and also improves the health of all cities further afield that are connected to the tile by road or by a sea route.
There are 3 types essentially : food, which I've just explained, strategic resources, which you'll need to build certain types of units (e.g. horses to build mounted units) and luxuries, which help to keep your populace happy.

"Technology / research abilities are rudimentary".
Well, like in many games you divide your income over military spending, R&D and treasury. You can further modulate this by constructing buildings, turning citizens into specialists, producing great persons, building wonders, etc.

Hope this helps.
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Re: Civilisation

#8  Postby mraltair » Dec 19, 2011 7:36 pm



^This. A bajizamillion times this!

Also, I don't like Civ, especially after I played Total War and then after EUIII I will never need to play it again.
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Re: Civilisation

#9  Postby dogmadogsh1t » Dec 20, 2011 2:52 pm

I loved CIV 4 (as I did 1, 2 and 3) and went out immediately and purchased Civ 5, which wouldn't run on my crappy hardware (it really needs a beast of a laptop to run it!).

The years rush by at the start then get much sower so that shouldn't be an issue. Have you tried the various MODs that are about? That usually extends it's life by a good few months at least.
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Civilisation

#10  Postby Ironclad » Dec 20, 2011 4:00 pm

Civ IV like totally rocks, man! Find a copy of Beyond the Sword and use this (final) expansion, I think there is an "epic" setting.
For the player with a higher end machine or around 6gb RAM I seriously recommend looking on the Civfanatics forum for the dev-mod called, Caveman2cosmos. In this expansion you will find the clock starts at 100,000 BCE! The resources are vastly improved and include seeds, potato, amber and much more. There are also mythical beasts, such as giants and griffins, but they disappear as your world expands. Giant lizards, sabre-toothed & neanderthal man make tough opponents, especially as you are unlikely to have anything more advanced than a simple rock-thrower or slingers.
If your machine is capable and you fancy Civ IV you really ought try this. Oh, and for good measure the developers have added numerous civilisations and leaders; the Tung Sisters, the late Jong-il, Adolph, and others important to Polynesia and Hawaii.. Etc etc etc. A truly vast game, set this baby on marathon, if you dare. :)
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Re: Civilisation

#11  Postby trubble76 » Dec 20, 2011 4:24 pm

Ironclad wrote:Civ IV like totally rocks, man! Find a copy of Beyond the Sword and use this (final) expansion, I think there is an "epic" setting.
For the player with a higher end machine or around 6gb RAM I seriously recommend looking on the Civfanatics forum for the dev-mod called, Caveman2cosmos. In this expansion you will find the clock starts at 100,000 BCE! The resources are vastly improved and include seeds, potato, amber and much more. There are also mythical beasts, such as giants and griffins, but they disappear as your world expands. Giant lizards, sabre-toothed & neanderthal man make tough opponents, especially as you are unlikely to have anything more advanced than a simple rock-thrower or slingers.
If your machine is capable and you fancy Civ IV you really ought try this. Oh, and for good measure the developers have added numerous civilisations and leaders; the Tung Sisters, the late Jong-il, Adolph, and others important to Polynesia and Hawaii.. Etc etc etc. A truly vast game, set this baby on marathon, if you dare. :)


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Civilisation

#12  Postby Ironclad » Dec 20, 2011 4:58 pm

A convert in teh making! Just wait until you get a scout with a subdued animal companion, or the ME-109, or maybe a gang of slingers fronting a Neanderthal hoard! Or the ever popular Jewish Hitler... Rofl. Such fun.
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Re: Civilisation

#13  Postby Wiðercora » Dec 25, 2011 11:20 am

mraltair wrote:


^This. A bajizamillion times this!

Also, I don't like Civ, especially after I played Total War and then after EUIII I will never need to play it again.


I got EUIII for Christmas and, er, I'm a little confused to put it lightly.
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Re: Civilisation

#14  Postby mraltair » Dec 25, 2011 7:16 pm

It's a tad overwhelming at first.

My tip: Don't start with a European nation, you'll end up at war too quickly. You'll want to start with a peaceful nation to get to grips with the economy and all those sliders. My personal favourite is Ming. Its massive allowing you to gain lots of taxes and a huge army then you can start invading the many minnows that surround you.

Castille is a great nation to start as in Europe though. Or Portugal if you want to just colonise S.America.

The Wiki that Tuco linked to is a very useful resource too.

I have a huge urge to play it again now. :grin:
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Re: Civilisation

#15  Postby Wiðercora » Dec 25, 2011 8:26 pm

I tried declaring war on some tiny little French province, and everyone declared war on me.

I have no idea how this game works. How do I even do war? I defeated all their armies, and then...nothing.
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Re: Civilisation

#16  Postby mraltair » Dec 26, 2011 10:30 am

Battles to defeat their armies and sieges to take their provinces. If you take all of their provinces and defeat their army they will usually offer a crappy truce like white peace or a bit of gold. Just reject it and offer your offer

You won't always be able to annex them or vassalise them (unless you're much more powerful than they are). That usually takes a second war to defeat their final province.

Peace, and war.
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Re: Civilisation

#17  Postby Wiðercora » Dec 26, 2011 3:34 pm

Okay. I'm playing as Portugal atm. Discovering the New World some 30 years behind schedule. I think I've sort of got the hang of it
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Re: Civilisation

#18  Postby Wuffy » Dec 27, 2011 7:29 am

I used to be a Big Civilisation fan. But number 5 has thrown away some of the things I liked best while eeping the things that drive me mad.

Between the ridiculous time scale of the game (Traveling one space early game takes 100 freaking years) Doing any war that isn't modern setting takes over 1000 to complete, By 600ad you might have 5 cities... The tech tree... is the weirdest progress I've ever seen. (Advance up the tree it will slow down the passage of time)

City improvements are retarded, along with technologies only giving you access to units, city improvements, or more research.

Civilisation revolutions had the right idea, discover a technology and get a bonus, discovery it first get a larger bonus.

Your 'people' had set adaption which had nothing to do with the environment you were in or how you progressed your society along (Partly fixed in Civ 5 with the social policies).

Oh and good luck trying to build any kind of connection or infrastructure between/around your cities until 100bc... Workers/settlers take so darn much to make, then 100 years to walk to the right spot...
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