If you want to start an argument in an empty room, start a thread that only you can post in. I've no doubt you could pull it off.

Don't call me dear.

So anyway, leaving Scot to inexplicably roll around on the floor...

Candles are no longer made with tallow, and haven't been for around 200 years, give or take. It appears to be more common in soap manufacture, but is sometimes replaced with other fats, for example olive oil. Either way, it's not hard for a vegan to avoid tallow from these sources. As for their complaints over tallow in the fiver, I'm not all that sympathetic, as I'm not particularly sympathetic to veganism in general, but that's just my personal opinion based on various things. Objectively, it's probably harder for them to avoid fivers, so this comes down to whether a small group's lifestyle choice should be taken into account, and I suppose this would be in part down to how much effort or inconvenience would be required.

I bet there are candles and soaps that are specifically marketed as being "vegan" and those vegans complaining about the new bill will probably only use those.

We can buy these everywhere that sells candles.



Beeswax and tallow candles.

We have candles lighting up our staircase, except they're festive LED candles. You can't get old-fashioned wax candles anymore in this country, unless you go to the shops, where they sell candles.

A shop where they sell candles you say??

Yes, and they are quite rare. There are less than 30 shops in the whole of Edinburgh listed on Google maps. You have to travel quite far to find them — sometimes as much as up to 3 miles from the city centre. There is shop called "Candle - It" near me, but they are closed now. Probably they will be open again tomorrow morning. Very difficult to buy candles this time of day, unless you go to a supermarket.

In this day and age, the least one can expect is that one's candle needs are catered for 24 hours a day. What is one meant to do when that craving for a Yankee Candles Fireside large jar hits at 2 am?

Down here, we are a little more advanced, thank goodness. We have high class celebrities providing us with our candles.

http://www.carolgeescandles.com/gallery/index.php

I like how Spit the Dog has grey hairs now. That's attention to detail, that is.

Any, my god, that website. It's so modern and conducive to online purchasing.

Northern Powerhouse.

Go Dutch:

http://www.kaarsen-online.nl/

Why?

Everyone knows the Dutch make the best candles.

No.

Well you are not everyone then?

If I don't know it, everyone doesn't know it, obviously.