From Wikipedia:

Wilhelmus Simon Petrus Fortuijn, known as Pim Fortuyn (Dutch pronunciation: [ˈpɪm fɔrˈtœyn]; February 19, 1948 – May 6, 2002) was a Dutch politician, author, public servant, sociologist and professor who formed his own party, Pim Fortuyn List (Lijst Pim Fortuyn or LPF).[1]

Fortuyn was the centre of several controversies for his views about immigrants and Islam. He called Islam "a backward culture" and said that if it were legally possible he would close the borders for Muslim immigrants.

Here's the rest:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pim_Fortuyn

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Agree/disagree?

Your thoughts, please.

Thanks.

Nobody biting yet? Not really surprising - too many questions rolled into one.
There's the whole European argument about population and immigration as a background. In the UK, businesses are alleged to be crying out for immigrants because of the government's failed education policy, whereas the government is accused of increasing immigration for political reasons. Both policies are probably condemned by the average voter - if only because they've never been asked and never been allowed to ask why this is.
There's the further question of the uneven distribution of immigrants - some areas feeling overwhelmed, some thinking a bit of diversity is fine, some rural areas rarely seeing any.
So it's very difficult to separate attitudes towards Islam from attitudes to immigration and to the proportion of immigrants in the population. I doubt whether many people are able to distinguish.
I also doubt whether it's really possible to distinguish between the cultural baggage of Islam and the "pure" practice of the religion. I doubt many Muslims can do that.

Well, the Koran literalists, the Talmud literalists and the Bible literalists etc, are all promoting a backward culture.

Muslim=/=Islam

Aurlito wrote:Muslim=/=Islam

Which is the sub-set of the other?

james1v wrote:Well, the Koran literalists, the Talmud literalists and the Bible literalists etc, are all promoting a backward culture.

I was unaware that Islam was a culture.

Islam will have to move several light years forward just to achieve backwardness. It's a pathetic belief system that make the other ones look progressive and that's not saying much.

theye1 wrote:I was unaware that Islam was a culture.

Indeed. There's a wide range of Islamic cultures and you would be hard pressed to define all of them as backwards.
If you're going to slag off a group of people, at least get your facts straight. (That's a generic "you" by the way, and wasn't aimed on anyone in here specifically.)

This is interesting.

I just finished reading Ayaan Hirsi Ali's biography and she mentions being asked during an interview whether or not she agreed with Pim Fortuyn's opinion that Islam is backwards.

She answered,

According to the Arab Human Development Report of the UN, if you measure by three things - political freedom, education, and the status of women - then what Pim Fortuyn said is not opinion, it's a fact. (Hirsi Ali, 2007, p. 288)

She herself received much criticism from fellow Muslims (mainly men) for this statement, but stood by it and answered her opposers by stating that she was Muslim too, and if she wanted to call Islam backwards, she would do so.

She also found there were no statistics in Holland regarding honor killings and was told by the Ministry of Justice, "we don't register murders based on that category of motivation. It would stigmatize one group in society."

She became a member of Dutch Parliament and made it her "holy mission" to have these statistics registered, saying,

I wanted someone, somewhere, to take note every time a man in Holland murdered his child simply because she had a boyfriend. I wanted someone to register domestic violence by ethnic background- and sexual abuse, and incest- and to investigate the number of excisions of little girls that took place every year on Dutch kitchen tables. Once these figures were clear, the facts alone would shock the country. With one stroke, they would eliminate the complacent attitude of moral relativists who claimed all cultures are equal. The excuse that nobody knew would be removed...I am also convinced that this is the largest, most important issue that our society and our planet will face in this century. Every society that is still in the rigid grip of Islam oppresses women and also lags behind in development. Most of these societies are poor; many are full of conflict and war. Societies that respect the rights of women and their freedom are wealthy and peaceful. (Hirsi Ali, 2007, p. 296)

Eventually her outspoken criticism gained her death threats and she was forced into hiding.

One must remember that Hirsi Ali was strictly raised and educated Muslim. She was excised and forced into marriage. No one that I have read has a fuller understanding of what Islam actually stands for.

I find it ironic that Islam, due to it's belligerent, violent tactics, actually confirms the views of it's critics time and again, and yet still claims to be a religion of peace.

*my bold