Hugin wrote:

Animavore wrote:There are certain things which science can reveal which can change your outlook. Take evolution and biology, for instance. Instead of being this fixed, immutable, white Irish person I am part of a biological chain which stretches back billions of years. In some ways you can call all life on the planet one giant organism (not to take that analogy too far). When realising this certain boundaries, which are made-up concepts in the first place, are destroyed. It no longer makes sense for me to call myself white, Irish, Catholic, even a man, in some sense, when you understand male to female is a spectrum and sexuality with it. Even "human" becomes a convenient label and a transient biological state. Racism, sexism and homophobia dissolve and become meaningless in the biological menagerie. Teleology is completely destroyed and religion along with it making sectarianism also untenable. There can be no "Christ killers", there can be no, "God's chosen." There can be no, "Final prophet" or "enlightened one." The beliefs become laughable and their fighting over these beliefs merely obscene.

How might this type of understanding relive stress and anxiety? I'm not sure. I guess it would bring comfort to people who are marginalised and treated differently over bronze-age bollox written by superstitious people who knew fuck all when they accept that far from being disordered abominations living in 'sin' they are just another biological creature crawling over the face of tiny rock floating in the vacuum of space. A product of a long process of natural selection which knows no "normal", "proper", or "natural ends".

This is beautifully written, I'm positively surprised that it seems to be the prevailing sentiment on this forum.

(Color highlight added)

Why are you surprised?

I don't take any "comfort" in a scientific world view, the world is what the world is and there isn't a fuck of a lot I can do about it. I take comfort, sometimes, in mashed potatoes and gravy. Tonight I'm taking comfort in a lamb korma and a couple of bottles of white wine. Sometime I find comfort in my relationships with my wife, family and friends. Sometimes watching a bit of telly can be comforting, as can a warm bed and a good book or a glass of nice single malt. What is not, in any way, comforting to me is religion or a belief in deities. Now, maybe I'm deficient in something, I lack a sensus divinitatis, or maybe I just have a low tolerance for codswallop. Perhaps I'm strong enough, psychologically speaking, to accept that I'm a speck of dust on a minor cosmic mudball, here for a very short period and soon forgotten when I'm gone. That's fine with me, I don't need "comfort" to deal with that reality.

I tire of this constant attempt to describe a lack of belief in deities as some monolithic structure. Atheists are social justice campaigners, they're leftists, they take comfort in science, they think this or believe that or do this or want that. What a bunch of bullshit. There are as many different beliefs, political stances, personal philosophies, likes and dislikes among atheists are there are among any other group of humans. There is no "Atheist Central Command" issuing fatwas or encyclicals, no prophet, no leader, no dogma, no political position, no College of Cardinals, no scripture. Richard Dawkins doesn't "lead" us, Sam Harris doesn't speak for all of us. The only thing we have in common is we don't buy into the existence of a god or gods. That's it, full stop, finis. The only thing this constant attempt to pigeonhole "atheism" shows me is theists simply are incapable of understanding what "atheism" actually means. It's so frightening, so threatening, that they have to see it as some organized movement directed at destroying the fragile, comfortable little myth they live by. Nothing could be further from the truth. Most of us don't give a single fuck what theists believe or how they live their lives, so long as they don't foist their nonsense on us.

laklak wrote:I tire of this constant attempt to describe a lack of belief in deities as some monolithic structure. Atheists are social justice campaigners, they're leftists, they take comfort in science, they think this or believe that or do this or want that. What a bunch of bullshit. There are as many different beliefs, political stances, personal philosophies, likes and dislikes among atheists are there are among any other group of humans. There is no "Atheist Central Command" issuing fatwas or encyclicals, no prophet, no leader, no dogma, no political position, no College of Cardinals, no scripture. Richard Dawkins doesn't "lead" us, Sam Harris doesn't speak for all of us. The only thing we have in common is we don't buy into the existence of a god or gods. That's it, full stop, finis. The only thing this constant attempt to pigeonhole "atheism" shows me is theists simply are incapable of understanding what "atheism" actually means. It's so frightening, so threatening, that they have to see it as some organized movement directed at destroying the fragile, comfortable little myth they live by. Nothing could be further from the truth. Most of us don't give a single fuck what theists believe or how they live their lives, so long as they don't foist their nonsense on us.

I couldn't have put it better!

laklak wrote:I don't take any "comfort" in a scientific world view, the world is what the world is and there isn't a fuck of a lot I can do about it. I take comfort, sometimes, in mashed potatoes and gravy. Tonight I'm taking comfort in a lamb korma and a couple of bottles of white wine. Sometime I find comfort in my relationships with my wife, family and friends. Sometimes watching a bit of telly can be comforting, as can a warm bed and a good book or a glass of nice single malt. What is not, in any way, comforting to me is religion or a belief in deities. Now, maybe I'm deficient in something, I lack a sensus divinitatis, or maybe I just have a low tolerance for codswallop. Perhaps I'm strong enough, psychologically speaking, to accept that I'm a speck of dust on a minor cosmic mudball, here for a very short period and soon forgotten when I'm gone. That's fine with me, I don't need "comfort" to deal with that reality.

I tire of this constant attempt to describe a lack of belief in deities as some monolithic structure. Atheists are social justice campaigners, they're leftists, they take comfort in science, they think this or believe that or do this or want that. What a bunch of bullshit. There are as many different beliefs, political stances, personal philosophies, likes and dislikes among atheists are there are among any other group of humans. There is no "Atheist Central Command" issuing fatwas or encyclicals, no prophet, no leader, no dogma, no political position, no College of Cardinals, no scripture. Richard Dawkins doesn't "lead" us, Sam Harris doesn't speak for all of us. The only thing we have in common is we don't buy into the existence of a god or gods. That's it, full stop, finis. The only thing this constant attempt to pigeonhole "atheism" shows me is theists simply are incapable of understanding what "atheism" actually means. It's so frightening, so threatening, that they have to see it as some organized movement directed at destroying the fragile, comfortable little myth they live by. Nothing could be further from the truth. Most of us don't give a single fuck what theists believe or how they live their lives, so long as they don't foist their nonsense on us.

/thread