The creationist mind at work

Cognitive dissonance, FTW

Incl. intelligent design, belief in divine creation

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The creationist mind at work

#1  Postby Shrunk » May 18, 2017 4:23 pm

I'm having a discussion with a creationist on Stephen C. Meyer's Facebook page over whether the nested hierarchy found in biological taxonomy is evidence of common descent. He provided the following analogy (apparently quoted from an uncited source) as part of his argument:

Here is yet another illustration by someone who really understands nested hierarchy using something that aren't even as related as the electronic gadget I have repeatedly used. Learn from it and demystify your mind about nested hierarchy of a thing:

"Let us, for instance , assign all of the petroleum -burning machines into a kingdom . Of this , the gasoline- burning ones form a subkingdom . The rubber - wheeled vehicles form a phylum . Of this , conventional automobiles are a class . Each type of car ( 2 - door hatchback , 4 - door hatchback , 2 - door sunroof , etc . ) forms a family. Finally, the manufacturer ’s designations make up the genus ( e. g . Toyota ) and species ( e. g . Toyota Tercel ) . Using selected mechanical components , a nested hierarchy can also be inferred from the structures of wheeled vehicles , whether expressed as a character matrix or cladogram."

I pointed out that this was not a nested hierarchy, because the "genus" Toyota contains members from multiple families.

He responded with this gem (emphasis added):

No, it is not a nested hierarchy, as u have already explained. All Toyotas do not fit within the "Family" of, say, 2 door hatchbacks

Lol - Lol - Lol

Is that what nested hierarchy means to you? Don't be funny.

I thought you said you understood taxonomy or nested hierarchy? All Toyotas cannot possibly fit within the family of 2 door hatchbacks. No one expects it to.

"2 door hatchbacks" is a sub family for crying out loud. This is basic thing, man. Whenever you see a taxon being divided based on certain other characteristics, in biology, we mean such taxon is sub grouped, and in this case, each of "2-door -", "4-door -" hatchbacks is a sub family.

Now you cannot logically cherrypick one sub family and expect to fit all Toyotas into it. Are you for real?

What's expected is that each of the sub families is contained in the bigger taxon, and that the lower taxa in turn are contained in each of the sub families, and they are.

It's high time you revisited basic taxonomy.

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Re: The creationist mind at work

#2  Postby Rumraket » May 19, 2017 6:54 am

I like how he "progressed" to try to argue that you can make a nested hierarchy with a single object. Uhm, wat? How would you "sort it" by number of shared characteristics? For fucks sake, these people are morons.
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