I was in the car and a family member had their iPhone connected to the audio system. We were listening to music and suddenly, an audiobook by Tony Robbins came up. I didn't have much of a choice, so I listened to it.

My bullshit detector started freaking out. It was the standard things: waffling on, unrelated anecdotes that make the speaker look like a hero, mentioning "the greater good" and saying vague things without much substance. It was rot, plain and simple, and I disagreed with the few assertions he did present in a coherent manner.

When I could access the Internet again, I Googled him. To my surprise, he had quite the reputation as a life guru, and criticism was in short supply. I must be missing something.

So, do you guys know much about Tony Robbins? Does all his motivational rot actually work? I saw the coal-walking thread where 20 people got burned, but that was about all I could find about him on this site.

Edit: Coal-walking thread

http://www.rationalskepticism.org/post1 ... s#p1397244



EDIT

Sorry Corke, I missed the last part of your post.

maiforpeace wrote:http://www.rationalskepticism.org/post1431465.html?hilit=tony%20robbins#p1397244



EDIT

Sorry Corke, I missed the last part of your post.

I'm not that lazy.

He's a motivational speaker and as such i'd say he works... He talks complete bollocks but if its bollocks that most people think is motivating then i can't really fault his methods even if they don't work for me.

From what i've read though, these motivational seminars only work on a tiny tiny percentage of people attending with the majority completely changing their lives and promising that everything will be better... for a day or two then everything is back to normal. These life coaches do work... as long as you spend the money and have them around all the time to pretty much brainwash you into thinking about things differently.

That makes sense. Thanks. Now to let this thread die.

Hiya Rhubis nice avatar.

Rhubis wrote:... These life coaches do work... as long as you spend the money and have them around all the time to pretty much brainwash you into thinking about things differently.

Yes, generally you only have to give these people the possession of your soul and your bank details for their 'coaching' to work.

See?! That's exactly what I mean. He's even on TED!

After watching that video, I've formulated a new hypothesis. Maybe the reason people admire him so much is simply because he's good at what he does. Motivational speakers don't have to be down-to-earth. Their assertions are simply to make people feel good about themselves. I'd like a personal, invisible force at my disposal, even though I know such a thing is a crock of shit. So, essentially, no one cares if he's sprouting rubbish, as long as it makes them feel good. No harm done.

Well, apart from all the money they pour into his business. But he gives to charity. Even if he makes stuff up as he goes, I reckon his intentions are well-meaning.

Do his motivational speeches actually work? In the short term, most probably. And I suppose that's good enough for most people. Just not me.

Corke wrote:Do his motivational speeches actually work? In the short term, most probably. And I suppose that's good enough for most people. Just not me.

PM me your bank details and I will guarantee to place the apple of your destiny directly within your life-path.

His entire schpiel can be distilled down to, "get off your ass and do something!"

Which honestly is actually good advise. Tony Robbins got started though doing some fairly interesting work from NLP, which has interesting uses and applications and such, but he was classified as reckless.

Build people way up and recklesssly let them loose.

Which a lot of motivators do, causing people to overturn their lives and go on a sweeping "Change" rampage which does some pretty bad things to relationships and such.

Ah, yeah. I remember him saying that "people crave uncertainty", which is why marriage can be boring. Pretty destructive stuff.

About ten minutes of waffling later, he says "people crave certainty".

People crave.

Humans are pretty ironic, paradoxical and whimsical. So you can say anything and it will mean something to someone. Just have to time it right.

The correct response to my post is, "Thanks Senne, I really need that."

I really needed that Senne. Thanks. How much do I owe you?

Pay it forwards.

So, essentially people just want to be told that they're awesome, and will hand over their cash for that. I recall Robbins telling his listeners to stand in front of the mirror each day and say stuff like: "I love you. You're awesome" etc.

apparently Robbins is a wizard:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iOhy5koThuM[/youtube]

Wait... Tony Robbins went religious? Fucking Seriously?

There's an old saying. "When you start believing your own bullshit you are in trouble."

I thought he was already religious. In the audiobooks I mentioned in the OP, he was always talking about God and how you need a spiritual side to add balance to your life.

Corke wrote:Ah, yeah. I remember him saying that "people crave uncertainty", which is why marriage can be boring. Pretty destructive stuff.

About ten minutes of waffling later, he says "people crave certainty".

As i see it, people want certainty, as in having a marriage, but don't want the events that follow to be certain so what follows must be uncertain; oh and another certainty they want is that what follows is a positive experience; as in u want to watch good movies->certainty, but u don't want to watch the same movies u already watched-> u want uncertainty. It's a logical relation between certainty and uncertainty. U want to know something good is about to happen but what happens u don't want to fking know. U want it to happen.

So certainty is the first rule that is followed by the psyche and then the second rule !if it does not break the first rule ! uncertainty is immediately followed, but this second rule is not discard-able.

So, essentially people just want to be told that they're awesome, and will hand over their cash for that. I recall Robbins telling his listeners to stand in front of the mirror each day and say stuff like: "I love you. You're awesome" etc.

Haha, you really have no clue about the techniques Tony Robbins uses, do you ?
There is more to Tony Robbins than this.
I have followed his Get the Edge audio program, and I'm now doing his Personal Power 2 audio program.
Let me introduce you to step 1 of what he calls "conscious change":

"#1 Get disturbed. We can't posssibly change unless we get our self disturbed enough so that we gonna do something about it. What it really means is get honest with yourself. Dont use any softners. Dont use any rationalizations. Dont compare yourself with other people so you can feel okay. Dont compare yourself with how you used to be. Look I used to be worse, so this is not that bad. All those things will steal away your drive. So if you really want to feel disturbed, and you are overweight, rip off those clothes right now and look in a full length mirror, and turn around and look at the parts you never want to see. You know, the parts that are scaring the family. Come on, let's be honest here. You got to see this stuf. And you got to truthfull, don't you. Because if you are not truthful, you will never have the energy to change. You got to get so disturbed that you will say: No more, not on other minute, not another day."

He talks a little bit longer about this step 1, but my point is the following. Tony Robbins techniques cover much more than standing in front of the mirror each day and say stuff like: "I love you. You're awesome"

It actually did help me to improve the quality of my life. I honestly believe that his techniques can help anyone, as long someone really has the desire to change.